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If you follow all of the anti-glowie threat model advice, one of the most common suggestions proposed is to disable all of your cellular related features on your phones, leave it on airplane mode permanently, or better yet just don't have a phone at all. What nobody seems to mention is, you're trading off reachability which could be critical for a lot of people that may not realize it at first. Imagine your significant other, friend, or family member gets incarcerated, and they're given a phone call to make before being locked up. Is it worth it to leave your phone off and risk you missing the crucial opportunity to help them fight out of the legal system? Even if you have a cell connection, prison calls are often labeled as spam, so your phone may not ring even if you receive one. Remember, the system is cruel and uncaring, they offer little help to those they want to imprison, they would love to have another slave to drive in their system. For some groups of people it might even be a matter of life and death given the cruelty of the prison system. Larping as a national security threat could have real world costs for those closest to you. On the other side, if YOU got locked up and had to make a call, would you remember which phone numbers to reach out to first? It's important to think about this in advance, because if you don't remember any you end up having to tell the officer to type in your PIN and speak out the phone number in your contacts across the room in evidence. (As a easy fix, put a contact card inside your phone case, so instead of telling the officer your PIN you could tell them to read out one of the numbers on the card.) I really do feel better without a SIM and airplane mode enabled. I feel a lot safer. But are there any ways in current society to be reachable without being tracked? Burner phones aren't really useful if you bring them home, and pagers won't work because they're taking 2g cell towers offline. Are there any other options?

>>25500 >Imagine your significant other, friend, or family member gets incarcerated, and they're given a phone call to make before being locked up. Hobo special. You get a cheap answering service. Voila, you have a phone number that's always available. You don't need a landline or a cellphone for this. They call your answering service and leave a message. You call the answering service when you get access to a phone, and get the message. >On the other side, if YOU got locked up and had to make a call... You use the pay phone in the jail house. If you don't know what number to call, tough soykaf. tl;dr All you need is a cheap answering service. If you still want to have a cellphone for convenience or emergency, you can leave it turned off. You don't really even need a carrier or a sim card. Just use voip on McDonald's wifi.

>>25500 My thinking usually is, unless they need urgent help with servers or something, my loved ones are better off calling someone else first. In case of a call from a prison, they probably should be calling our lawyer, not me. In case of a medical emergency they should be calling an ambulance, not me, etc. As someone who lived without a phone for a few years, I ended up carrying a flip phone for access to my loved ones, and then a smart phone for SSH access to my own private servers over VPN. This makes me more traceable indeed, but, am I not as traceable without them? Living in a city, I appear on hundreds of CCTV cameras on the daily, most of which are government or bigcorpo operated, if I use a car then street cameras are seeing it everywhere, recording the license plate, if I use public transport, cameras are everywhere there too, plus, the card used to pay for them probably logs everything anyway. The price for perfect anonymity is just too high. Minimizing your footprints is admirable, but make no mistakes, someone, somewhere, knows you. Striving for compartmentalization is more realistic than perfect anonymity. Get a phone, know that it tracks you, like everything else; only use it for appropriate activities given that knowledge, don't go rioting around having it active on you. --- Moving beyond the practical, and into the fully principled requires more than logic and method; it requires faith in something; surrender to the flow of the universe. Disconnect, throw away your phone, embrace old communication, in person, or through trusted delivery of hand-written mail, knowing that the world may hurt a loved one sooner or later, and you're not going to save them, move away from massive centers of civilization, knowing that one day you may have a medical emergency and will not have a hospital nearby and you may suffer, perhaps alone, and you may even die. Let go of reliance on modern technology and infrastructure knowing that you will have to put in more work to live and that you're making things harder, intentionally, out of faith. Accept that those are your choices, out of faith in an uncompromising truth, and that whatever the world gives you in response, whether goodness or suffering, is righteous and fair, and that it is, and you are, and they are, okay. That is of course too much to ask of most, lain; we should be gentle with ourselves, but perhaps at least it should be a direction to aspire to, save ourselves, save the world. --- >>25501 > a cheap answering service Have your communication with family and friend go through a 3rd party entity to protect yourself from another 3rd party entity. Yeah, no.

>>25516 Suit yourself. You can go all over town pinging cell towers if that's your idea of privacy.

I will keep bringing this up now and then to see anyone wants to try it. Get a cell tower repeater and set up your phone to only connect to the repeater and nothing else, which I know ive heard someone make their phone selectively connect to towers so i assume this can be done. What that does is make your movements and your location more difficult to track. Alternatively you could get a mobile hotspot to connect your phone to but problem with hotspots is they can be wifi mapped which takes away some of that advantage. Also you could just use call forwarding to a landline with a traditional answering machine or forward it to a trusted person who doesn't care as much about hiding.

>>25518 >I will keep bringing this up now and then to see anyone wants to try it. Get a cell tower repeater and set up your phone to only connect to the repeater and nothing else, which I know ive heard someone make their phone selectively connect to towers so i assume this can be done. What that does is make your movements and your location more difficult to track. Yeah, ok, Chief. Lets us know when you get that working.

>>25519 I dont have the money to buy a repeater.

>>25500 Okay, pal. Why you are being so deep into consequences of something like that? Anyway, what our goal is actually and what our threat model is? Why do you think that pager could be any good for something like privacy anyway? The data is open and free to intercept... Plus your provider know what are you doing, who you are talking to. I think the best spy game is compartmentalize, mask your actions under the usual ones. For example, if you worry about emergency and you need to know about it 100% so make separate sim number, give it a run on the gsm-modem, or SIP workstation, which you connect to the machine that connects to the internet, for example, trough another anonymously purchased sim-card. Pay for both of these in-cash trough terminal, or mask yourself and go straight to the provider office with fake mustache and hair in burner-clothes. So now you have traceable by geo phone number, but not by identity, which you can use for accepting calls from anyone trough VoIP, and have emergency calls getting to you, whenever you've got internet. Actually, if you kind of a psycho, you can have this setup plugged in the abandoned building, connected to the battery package, or straight to the main supply lines, but it's gonna be harder for operation to be untraceable. For more of it, you can actually setup your VoIP station to accept some numbers, or any call to that number can be a trigger for you to know about emergency. What you want from it, anyway? I don't know, you've never told me. But I suppose that for scenario from OP-post where someone calling when you off the grid and can't answer it, and later they can't send you important message, now have a solution. Anyway, any VoIP is a hundred times harder to trace, than any other type of communication. Because if it's not p2p and obfuscates itself trough different locations and IP-adresses, you've got only metadata for which you can always generate randomized traffic to make it harder to know what are you doing on the net. Because if there is two internet-users, who generate same amount of traffic that is look alike at the same time and at the same time of a day for a few days and in-between of that there is little to no of it, there are you two crypto-cypher-spy-punks, who are trying to stay on the low. From that point you should look deeper in what you are trying to achieve and what are these different things that I've told you about. You can make some kind of watchdog, which hardwired to the speaker or vibro output of your cellphone, which wiil initiate the loading of another system and so on, to hide some. You can place for all numbers, except specific, if they calling on dedicated numbers by yours, to play pre-recorded voice mail of chinese food restaurant or laundry, etc. Suit yourself with your needs and never let go the creative path to achieve your goal. That's all.

>>25500 >Imagine your significant other, friend, or family member gets incarcerated I absolutely cannot help them. And besides, it'd be the manifestation of Great Justice. They have made my country into soykaf. They were the ones who voted for Putin, they are the ones who work for his regime, they are those who always are gaslighting me by saying everybody loves Putin, United Russia and Nashists, and that all worthy persons are already parts of all that, and that I'm not worthy, and I'm soykaf, since I'm not doing that too. If Putin's regime eventually put them into prison, or killed them, I'd say they get what they deserve. Because while I don't believe in justice, I believe in the Great "Justice". Which is not just at all, it only takes everything what it can take. Kinda the treatment the majority of these guys https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Suspicious_deaths_of_notable_Russians_in_2022%E2%80%932024 got. Those who live by sword often die by it, that's the natural order of things. Those who don't maintain enough distance from immoral (and so dangerous) people and dangerous organizations and dirty activities and dirty soykaf - they risk to be among their victims. That's also the natural order of things. Everybody understands it. Who doesn't - well, he will deserve what he will get. If somebody is so confident that he can cheat the laws of nature .... well, we'll see.

>>25500 this thread screams someone is getting arrested

>>25500 Always call your lawyer first.

>>25585 My lawyer is the one who got me into this. He promised it would be fun.

>>25500 >oh no i got arrested! let me call the one guy i know without a phone

Cb/shortwave radios are probably the best, but those can still be tracked with triangulation. Honestly i dont really care at this point. If any entity or agency that wants to know where you are, they will know where you are. Even body signatures can be tracked with satellites. You're anonymous obsession is a petina of a bygone era. If it were at all remotely useful or fairly easy I'd probably care more, but it's not. Chances are anybody on this site that is of any interest is already being tracked(myself included). You could as other lainons have suggested, ditch electronics and live off the grid, but you will still be on the radar, they will notice your abrupt change in electronic footprints. Don't fear them, do as you would anyways. If you're really up to seriously nefarious soykaf, you're already on their radar anyways. You really think that the glowies aren't aware of anybody doing odd things? Hell, this site is probably just as much a Honeypot as 4chan was. This place is filled with people doing soykaf that gets them "noticed". This place is actually great for monitoring paranoid people's and a lot of threads feel like they're are for Intel gathering on us. But, if you still feel the need, led line your cellphone when it's not in use, led line your houses walls, get fake license plates, use face obscuring masks or have a disrupting emitter that messes with camera/mic frequencies, have EMPs on you at all times, only write snail mail in with an alias and no return address, get a p.o. box through a relative. Stuff like that. But, again at this point you falling off the grid and doing weird soykaf like led lined jackets/hats will make you even more of a target. You already are logged in some database and as I said before, if you are worth spying on, then you're being spies on.

To live anonymously forever is extremely draining and your loved ones will begin to complain rather quickly. For smaller and less than legal trips you live anonymously using a car, phone, etc, etc not tied to your 'legal' identity. But outside of those rare instances you should live a normal life that doesn't draw too much scrutiny. As long as you don't invite unnecessary attention and manufacture a concrete alibi (preferably with digital timestamps) your anti-glowie activities will remain a secret. Regarding leaving your phone off, for an advanced threat model that needs access regardless its more advisable, in my opinion, to setup a relay, perhaps a sms to xmpp bridge along with voip. That way if your current phone is off the moment you reconnect your pending messages will still come through.

>>25500 >Imagine your significant other, friend, or family member gets incarcerated, and they're given a phone call to make before being locked up. They can page me; I'll be in the area (most likely). > if YOU got locked up and had to make a call, would you remember which phone numbers to reach out to first? Well you'd have to. See the payphones in the picture YOU posted? Those don't have a contact list and I paid to be taken out of the whitepages a long time ago. >>25516 >Living in a city, I appear on hundreds of CCTV cameras on the daily All your efforts went kaput because of this. Great job, now move. >>25523 You can get them on Raspberry Pis now. Hell, my modem has one. >>26198 >To live anonymously forever is extremely draining and your loved ones will begin to complain rather quickly So? It's my life, not theirs.

>>26185 this there is no point in even caring about privacy at this point. unless your parents didn't register your birth and raised you off the grid, you were compromized from the second you were born. the only thing you can really do is blend in. act normal. stop caring. the failure of the luddites was it. all we can really do now is accept it and move on.

>>26198 problem is confused threat model. you have no idea who is trying to get you and why, and what techniques they use. as a result you wind up in these weird hypothetical scenarios that don't really mean anything in principle, because they consist of a series of "but what if"s that aren't based in real technologies or practices. >risk you missing the crucial opportunity to help them fight out of the legal system? if you can't prep them ahead of the time then there's very little you can do, and certainly nothing you can uniquely do, unless you are of course a lawyer. lawyers have a different threat model from you or i, for the obvious reasons. now that i think about it, cybersecurity for lawyers might be an interesting topic. >>25556 this >>26185 >give up there's plenty of reason not to stop caring about privacy outside of criminal contexts. numerous studies have been conducted showing a variety of adverse health effects that purely result from being watched, although reactions vary depending on the precise nature of surveillance. https://academic.oup.com/nc/article-pdf/2024/1/niae039/61022984/niae039.pdf https://www.nature.com/articles/s44271-024-00102-8.pdf >chances are anybody of interest is already being tracked site traffic is im sure being tracked but that's something very different from they're watching your every move, etc. >they will notice your abrupt change in electronic footprints they won't, these things are noticeable in the event of an investigation but they fly under the radar otherwise >if you're up to seriously nefarious soykaf you're on their radar anyways to some extent yes, which brings up the subject of plausible deniability and parallel construction. but that's not an eventuality you or i need to worry about, right lain? >>26198 >for smaller and less than legal trips you live anonymously using [resources] not tied to your 'legal' identity this is ideal. personally i like to keep phones/devices off when i need to focus for the above stated reasons, i don't have a conscious sense of being surveilled when they are on, but they are a distraction and an annoyance.

>>27791 Why dont you open up your asscheeks for the cia as well... This thread glows hard

>>25500 in the year of the fire horse the radio waves your phone emits can be the difference between being shot by a quad-copter or buried in an airstrike, I'm still trying to find a total alternative with these specific scenarios in mind but a faraday bag seems to do the job to some extent. Tell your family member they should have called a lawyer instead lol

>>25500 bro you can't memorize a few phone numbers? wtf it takes like 15 minutes to do just repeat it to yourself and practice typing it in so you get some muscle memory... wtf is wrong with this generation you didn't have to memorize your friend's house phone as a kid?

>>26185 >>27791 soykaf for brains >If any entity or agency that wants to know where you are, they will know where you are. for any normal individual tracking someone down is a long and difficult process. The govt is more capable but is also bureaucratic and sluggish and does not have an app with every persons location at every time so it takes time and effort to do this. in the case of a cellphone you would have to find the cellphone number the person is using and use triangulation to find the approximate location which is takes time effort paperwork expertise. You would also have to do something really bad to make them escalate the matter enough to have to use advanced methods to track you down. >Even body signatures can be tracked with satellites. 0 results on the net. >Chances are anybody on this site that is of any interest is already being tracked(myself included). Any interest for what? how do you track someone on an anonymous imageboard? how would you filter such data and infer useful information about specific people from it? Do you really think there is a whole office of agents dedicated to sifting through soykaf on imageboards? What benefit or purpose would there be to do that for anyone? >they will notice your abrupt change in electronic footprints. No. For example let's say there are 2 billion people using google. Google has a database of all the people that have an account. It shares the account metadata such as name and email to advertisers and social media. These are not looking for terrorists, they are looking for their target audience. Let's say 20% of accounts are abandoned, that's 20 million. 1% delete their account, that's a million. Even if these were added to a watchlist, how and why would anyone sift through a million accounts? Sure, AI is the perfect solution for this, but it will take years for such a comprehensive AI mass surveillance system to be implemented, and it is nowhere near that right now.

>>27868 And they change their phone number and you cant delete it. This isn't like the days when everyone was calling on landlines where their number never changes unless they move. Though probably should remember at least one contact number.