Avoiding Malware in Cars

Hey Lainons. I was recently thinking about purchasing a car and was wondering if there are any measures to combat malware and tracking. I began to become concerned about this issue after reading: https://www.gnu.org/proprietary/malware-cars.html I was thinking about buying a car and removing the computer and making my own UI with a rpi or something. Im not sure how difficult of a task that would be and i would like to see how you guys deal with this issue.

Buy a car that's not cyberhumped with all kinds of smart stuff. You don't need to be able to log into your google account to drive your car. Buy a reliable old honda.

>>11886 Can't you buy an old secondhand car? Also, I don't know if that is a thing in your country, but in my country if your car was fabricated 10 years ago (although this varies slightly depending on the area you live in) you don't need to pay any taxes for it, so I guess that's another advantage.

>>11885 Even honda has built in botnet. Older cars without computers are becoming less and less prevalent.

By not buying an car that comes with malware. It is also worth noting that all vehicles with an plate are tracked by ALPR these days.

>>11889 https://youtu.be/P2TMyBSqyqo?t=72 >the list of agencies Phoenix Police shares information with is several pages long and includes agencies like the FBI and the small police department in Colquitt Georgia :(( Wtf

Either check the laws about whether the car is still word worthy if you pay someone to strip all the spywareable parts out and if so do that or buy a car built before the bluetooth era

>>11885 This is the only answer. >>11888 This may start to be true in 10 years but there is plenty of non-botnet supply still. I drive a non-botnet 2015 Mazda.

Just buy a bicycle.

>>11893 But it's like totally not possible to be alive without a car

>>11893 i wanna see my dad sometimes who lives 50 km away

>>11894 Your mileage may vary wildly depending on how much public authorities fuarrrked up infrastructure and building planning by assuming everyone has a car. In some countries the assumption is you walk, bike or use public transportation everywhere. In some others, none of that.

thanks to the eu since 2018 every new car gets a emergency call system so they could track you anytime

Cut any antennas and swap out the ECU.

saw on tv is they have an inbuild camera recording your face while driving now. Pr Guy claimed it was to catch if you look tired etc. so its sold as for safety. Factually you are on camera with your emotional state recorded inside you own car.

I drive an '06 Chevy. As far as I know there are nothing in it that tracks me so in my opinion I would say to buy an older used car. Although if I am wrong and they have been doing this for years then I am open to correction.

You register the car with the state & insurance companies, highways are surveillance incarnate... they run around scanning everyone's plates, cams everywhere. Even if you debotnet the vehicle, you can only scoot around undetected for so long.

>>12635 It is not like you have ONE ECU, modern cars have up to 80 ECUs. And who tells you this is working? You need some knowledge about these kind of systems to know where which function is, and perhaps through your replacement the car doesnt start because it checks if it can connect via eSIM to the Car-vendor?

Cut any antennas and swap out the ECU. >>12646 I laugh at the idiots who think they can introduce blackboxes to 100 year old tech and expect it to be essential and irremovable. ECU literally just controls fuel injection, and could be replaced by any microcontroller of your choice, if you don't want to reverse engineer and install hacked firmware. All computer, network and radio exploits will work too. Or you could just modify your engine to run on woodgas.

>>12650 That is soykaf. They do NOT "just" controls fuels injection and could be replaced by "any" microcontroller of your choice. Have you ever looked deeper into ECUs in modern cars? What they are responsible for? You have a lot of sensors that all report something to a bus, and if information is missing, this can also limit the functionality of the car because other systems rely on these values. Most of all we are talking about realtime systems that have to fulfill hard realtimes and you just want to reverse engineer and exchange them? Good luck, I wouldn't want to drive in this car anymore.

>>12652 Computers and electronics have never been necessary for cars, and never will be. You can easily build your own car from scratch using a couple machine tools. None of these botnetmobile sensors are necessary for the operation of a car. That's right, no GPS, no accelerometer, no radio, no cameras, no lidar and no microphones are necessary at all. No form of anti-theft device is necessary. Not even engine sensors like temperature, coolant, RPM, voltage or fuel are necessary. You could remove all of them, and still be able to drive around just as well.

>>12653 if you would build from scratch you are right but the most of us do not have the necessary skill to do this or want to take that amount of time for building it

Get a pre 2010 vehicle. They have enough computational capacity to be fuel efficient, but not enough to be a snitch,

>>12657 that will be a temporary solution in the future most of the old combustion engines will be forbidden due to co2-regulations There should be a better option. E-Car without being a fuarrrking snitch. But the big car vendors do not want this of course.

Not available information about russian systems auto tracking "platon"(платон) and era-glonass(эра-глонасс). These systems installs(we have a law) on heavy hauler (платон+эра-глонасс) and other motor vehicles(buses, cars, motorcycles(soykaf!)) (эра-глонасс)

>>12656 The good news is that making things DIY becomes easier with time, as CNC machine tools continue to decrease in price. In the future, it will be possible for everyone to 3D print their own cars. >>12660 Using alternative energy sources is the easy part, there are many cheap and easy to build options that do not require high-tech manufacturing or centralized infrastructure. You can use woodgas, ethanol, biodiesel, vegetable oil, compressed air, hydrogen, flywheels, fuel cells, liquid nitrogen, magnesium, supercapacitors, redox flow batteries or just conventional batteries.

>>12664 GLONASS was only completed in 2015, any tracking system using it would be newer than 2015. First step to reverse engineer it is to find the receiver, then how it is powered, and then what it transmits.

>>12666 https://habr.com/ru/post/406503/

>>12667

>>12668

>>12669 And sorry for flood. https://www.zr.ru/content/news/900476-sekretnoe-oruzhie-ehra-glonass/ Era-glonass allow remotely stop the engine. I think era-glonass have full access to CAN system.

>>12670 Assume that era-glonass is based on onstar used by some US cars, which does have access to CAN bus. Need to find out if the antenna frequency is cellular, satellite or radio, which will reveal how the entire system operates. First try disconnecting the entire board, and see if the car still starts. If not, try disconnecting the board while the car is already started, and see if it stays on. If not, then disconnect the two antennas, and try to start the car again.

>>12660 >in the future most of the old combustion engines will be forbidden due to co2-regulations not true, just get an exhaust pipe co2 filter and it will pass the regulations

>>12947 >not true, just get an exhaust pipe co2 filter and it will pass the regulations All cars since the 90s already have catalytic converters by law. Still doesn't change the fact that some engines are far more clean than others, especially with forced induction. Have you not noticed how engine displacement in new cars in plummeting while numbers of turbochargers are increasing. It's all about meeting more and more stringent emission goals. Even Porsche has started unironically selling tiny 4 cylinder 2L cars. So >>12660 is correct, in a few years time, older cars will either be too expensive to tax or just outright illegal. Enjoy your V8s while you can. >>12652 >That is soykaf. They do NOT "just" controls fuels injection and could be replaced by "any" microcontroller of your choice. It's possible he meant that electronic fuel injection is the only thing you strictly need. Assuming antilock brakes, traction control, stability control, immobilizers, car alarm etc. is just for glitterboys. But you're right, just deciding when to squirt gas into the cylinders is not the only essential function it does. The ECU needs to prepare the air/fuel mixture in the correct quantities by reading other sensors like air flow sensor and throttle position (>inb4 I'm 19 and want to go top speed all the time). Needs to adjust the valve timing as the engine speeds up and slows down. If you want to know trivial things like how fast you're going or how high the engine is revving or how much gas you have left then the ECU needs to calculate all those things. There's also a lot of safety stuff you probably want too like rev limiting, oil temperature checks (assuming you don't want to buy a new engine every 6 months). So yeah, "just reverse engineer the firmware and rewrite it with a raspberry pi" is hilariously naive.

>>12952 Reading sensors to adjust fuel-air mixture is basic mechanical engineering, very easy to calibrate for arbitrary engine configurations. You could also just replace the fuel-injection system with a carburetor or woodgas generator, and run the car without any electronics at all.

>>11894 Move to a place where bikes and public transport are usable.

>>12645 Solutions if you are stuck with this situation and actually need to be evasive: > Drive to the general location, but ditch the car and walk/busride to your destination while taking evasive routes > Cover license with fake license or steal someone's plate. This is risky if you could get pulled over, but otherwise works > Take Greyhound bus. You can pay cash and don't need to show an ID > Drive someone else's car

>>12969 >woodgas generator, and run the car without any electronics at all. Ok captain autismo. The goal is to run without an ECU, or an ECU with custom firmware. Not to run without electricity all together.

>>12980 The objective is to get rid of the botnet in cars, and running a car on woodgas is the most thorough way to do that. Also, it's highly sustainable and allows you drive off-the-grid.

>>12665 I am a CNC programmer mainly in fixturing now, but I worked my main career in Medical. I also started in manual machining working for GE R&D with a bunch of Bridgeports and Lathes. If you think you can simply Machine a car, you are out of your mind. You might think you can but you can’t And won’t. Plus the main chassis of a car is forged and THEN machined. You don’t just start with bar stock. I’m not a comp-sci guy, my dad is and has been for long time, so you got me beat there but your claims about CNC are delusional.