Natural treatment for severe mental disturbances

In the absence of psychiatric drugs, what would an ideal and enlightened treatment of somebody with a severe mental disturbance look like? Consider somebody in a psychotic episode, that has completely lost touch with reality and is being pulled around by paranoid thoughts that they believe with conviction, ,hallucinating voices in their head. Antipsychotics can reduce the intensity of these thoughts by their neurosedative action and allow that person some respite, return the ability to sleep and can reduce the length of such an episode. However these drugs have serious side effects , especially in the long-term, and patients are too often left dependent on the medication and not supported in withdrawing safely. For a thought experiment, let's imagine a world without such drugs, somebody is in a serious psychotic episode, what would an elightened society do to quickly reduce the disturbance so as to reduce potential harm and set them on a journey to recovery and regaining of insight?

Vestibular stimulation of the left ear can improve awareness of delusions https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC5720160/ Beyond that having a good social support system of people responding appropriately is beneficial. Basically don't argue the delusion and hallucinations nor humor them just show empathy and try to understand what the experience is like for them. There also is targeted cognitive therapy showing some benefit for which I will have to cite sources later if anyone wants them. There is also benefit in building a good mind body relationship through playing an instrument or doing yoga or martial arts. Also depends how you define drug. Does this also exclude supplements (some of which are unregulated synthetic drugs) and herbs or no?

>>86040 I've never experienced any hallucinations or psychotic episodes. But I had paranoia and PTSD from an actual traumatic violent situation when I was very young. Then some stressful military-like situation later in life. So tons of paranoia. What helped was the scientific method. Understand the physics of how things work saved me from tumbling down the rabbit hole of the endless conspiracy theories peddled by laymans on the internet. Other than a basic study of mainstream psychology. A dash of Jung. A dash of Dabrowskis theory of disintegration. And as the other lain said a support structure. A safe quiet place you can disappear to when things get too stressful. Knowing how to protect yourself if need be. Hows your nutrition? Hows your sleep? Do you exercise? Hows your blood pressure? Get a blood pressure and heart rate monitor. Check it constantly in your stressful times. Mediate, box breathing. Honestly one of the things that has made thing easier for me, and I don't recommend this for the faint-hearted, is I've visualized my death in different ways where I'm at the point I don't fear death. I also don't fear having to legally kill in self-defense if need be. But I also know the law and who my neighbors are so it's likely I'll just randomly find myself in a situation where I'll have to become violent. I believe in god as well, this helps with the fear of death. On god, try to have a mission aligned with what ever you consider a higher power. Honor your mission towards that higher power. Hope something helps from this random disjointed idea drop. best wishes to you.

>>86042 typo: "it's unlikely" I'd have to become violent because I find myself in a random dangerous situation, also unlikely because I do my area studies. It's really good to know everyone who lives and works around you. Get into technical OSINT if not knowing who lives 3 blocks away from you bothers you, etc.

>>86040 I can only speak from my personal form of schizoid which is more fatigue than mania, but simply getting enough sleep (and peace and quiet in general) seems to help the most, even if that means having to take 1 or 2 naps a day. Other than that, sticking to one coffee a day to avoid overstimulation (and planning my routine around getting everything important done in that hour or so window after drinking it), and having a ciggie or 2 each day if I need to calm down. Of course that's not exactly the healthiest thing in the world, but I would argue it's far more preferable to dopamine-zapping antipsychs. As is popping an Oxazepam or drinking a beer if it gets bad, but then I haven't needed that for a long time now. Weed also works wonders for me personally, as long as I keep it to a minimum, but I'm aware that's not the experience of most schizoids, so I am cautious to recommend that too brazenly. Other than that, maybe look into vitamins and supplements that regulate dopamine/serotonin/adrenaline/cortisol, and especially start with making sure you're getting enough Vitamin Bs, Vit. D, Iron, Zinc, Omega-3s, Magnesium, and Amino Acids, if you're not already. You also might find certain nootropics helpful, like Semax/Selank, or on the more extreme side of the spectrum, Alzheimer medications/supplements. Anything that increases 'neurogenesis' essentially.

>>86042 >What helped was the scientific method. This is a really good point too, learning/practicing to stay rationally minded, to recognize when you're falling into conjecture and 'positive feedback loops', and making sure you're questioning all the steps that have lead to a 'schizo' conclusion. And also doing what some may argue is the polar opposite, and may even recommend against; believing in something metaphysical/supernatural (and positive/constructive). For example, I no longer believe I'm being followed, and that people around me are (intentionally, of their own volition) 'setting up coincidences' to freak me out. I now choose to believe that it's a metaphysical power working *through* the people and material world around me, and that these people around me are completely unaware of the 'coincidences' they're unwittingly involved in. Even if I experience it as negative, I can still choose to see it as a spiritual 'test', rather than someone of flesh and blood fuarrrking with me. I mean, most religious people claim they 'hear' and 'see' God, and that they believe in fate; that God is guiding their life. What's the difference between someone who believes they're being attacked by 'demons', and someone with 'schizophrenia'? Well, the religious person gets to share their 'delusions' with tens of thousands of other likeminded people, and have a whole written narrative to justify their beliefs, not to mention a community to feel a part of, and not feel isolated and 'different'.

A solution providing carbon dioxide, fructose, and potassium. An orangina in other words.

There already was a thread like this by the way >>>/hum/56859

slap in the face, dunk in a cold stream, and a good dose of actual existential danger if they dont get good then kill em

the 'problem' is strictly psychosis? have someone (shaman) who can completely enter their state of mind, let them sit and rest in the state together and feel it out to recontextualize a bit: psychosis is the pathologized term for when someone enjoys exploring their own neural pathways, and finds adequate pleasure in that, as opposed to the 'normal' approved pathways offered by the rest of the mammals is the hive. the 'problem' is really in the (society of the) onlooker, their inability to jump track and process information on a higher circuit. the person is likely experiencing somatic comfort in their own headspace, but is being coerced to come down from their ecstatic high and face the so-called real world, which is full of automaton signals. they're trying to evolve, but the echological niche is rejecting their instability as it is not proven sperm+egg=survival formula they've been domesticated with.

>>86058 what you describe exemplifies how such states represent a break in communicative ability. it ought to be fine to go off into ones own wacky headspace. how much should one be able to convey to others before becoming an outcast? thats another state of being altogether

>>86058 I agree completely, but the problem arises when the person in question is required, or seeks, to engage with community and society. That's when it's virtually a necessity to balance that mindset with a normative, nominal 'rationality'.

>>86058 This is what it sounds like when a dumb person tries to sound smart. Psychotic people are more often than not very disturbed, full of fear, paranoia, etc. >somatic comfort in their own headspace Yeah that's why they scream and shout and cry. You must have smoked your tiny fool away, retard.

>>86080 >He's a crazy retard How do you know that maybe english is his second language, but he's trying to speak about esoterica? He posted a picture of a tarrot card. Read the room.

>>86056 Ironically the only real advice in this thread. Mental illness is void, not accounted for by nature. The healthiest thing is to simply filter them out. Life isn't about reason. It's about survival. Dumb controllable bulls who can hunt & haul are what is needed, not some useless schizos that are good for nothing. I personally would prefer being shot in the head.

also a cynic would argue that in antiquity hallucinations of voices and images were pretty common and fairly accepted if you're still functional. All the old stories about heros speaking to gods, being guided by visions, etc etc etc. I guess you have to keep some grip on reality (or maybe join a temple or become a wandering weirdo mystic) but you can dip your toes into these behaviors and still be entierly functional can even modern medicine save someone who's actually fully lost touch with reality ? I'd like to see a good controlled study on this.

>>86098 There were studies on eastern cases living happily vs western because west demonizes voices in your head while east believes its grandpas spirit watching over you. Basically west makes it a problem by creating a bogeyman of it.

>>86099 Well not quite. I read this same study and it was their positive symptoms were not as malicious sometimes actually friendly. But there is still the issue of negative symptoms

For starters I think in an enlightened society some mental illnesses maybe would not be so. Im not saying this to disparage current definitions and descriptors of mental illnesses because almost all have the caveat of it needing to cause the person or others suffering and or interfere with their ability to live. In some enlightened society its possible some things that are currently a mental illness would not interfere with a persons ability to live a full life, and so they would fall by the wayside. Its possible I guess too if you are more cynical that an enlightened society would have a similar or only slightly lesser amount of mentally ill individuals, and it would just look different. Maybe someone whos productively neurotic and driven that would normally fill like a CEO type role would be miserable in one vision of an enlightened society where that role is not needed or as valued. Not to definitively say an enlightened society would not be capitalist but just as an example, you can come up with your own im sure for your vision of an enlightened society. From your picture and your exclusion of psychiatric meds I dont think you will like my answer but most likely I imagine in an enlightened society the only mental illness treatment necessary would be various kinds of talk and group therapy, and then things like TMS for uncontrollable brain imbalances that result in things like psychotic episodes or mania or severe depression. Sometimes the brain does go irreperably wrong by the standards of any society you could imagine, sure maybe someone with hallucinations could fill some oracle type role and learn to distinguish between these visions and reality. But there is nothing positive about being in a full blown psychotic episode, or full blown mania, or full blown depression. In these instances tms can work perfectly, and I suspect it will get even better in the future or similar technologies will come about. Ideally the only situations where these sorts of interventions wouldnt help would be the situations where someone could actually learn to live with their illness or even go into remission with just some guidance and counseling and support. Situations where with the right help you can start to make the new mental pathways and cultivate the self talk you need to tip the scales in your brain in the right direction. That probably isnt true though, there is probably a host of causes for mental illness where neither jolting your synapses with magnets nor talk or group therapy could help. Which is why I think a real enlightened society would use the whole gamut of treatments available including medications, and the only way it would be different from now is in an organizational sense of what the first line of action is, what is cheap and available, how long to try xyz before trying something else, addressing mental illnesses that may only be caused by societal flaws, etc.

>>86048 >I can only speak from my personal form of schizoid which is more fatigue than mania, but simply getting enough sleep (and peace and quiet in general) seems to help the most, even if that means having to take 1 or 2 naps a day. Other than that, sticking to one coffee a day to avoid overstimulation (and planning my routine around getting everything important done in that hour or so window after drinking it) sounds like you're suffering a critical case of modernity and all your problems would be moot in a world without electric speakers, IC engines, cheap stimulants and the 9-5 grind

>>86040 >In the absence of psychiatric drugs, what would an ideal and enlightened treatment of somebody with a severe mental disturbance look like? The first thing you have to do is make sure they don't hurt themselves or anyone else. If there's no other choice that might even involve confinement. The second thing you should do is make sure they have as safe, comfortable, healthy an environment as possible. The thrid thing to do is to treat them with compassion, talk to them, and try to help them understand reality better, feel better emotionally and physically, and improve their behavior enough to interact with other people better. Healthy food, exercise, sleep, good environment, friendly interaction when possible. Physical restraint only when a danger to themselves or others. Helping them straighten out some of the erroneous thinking that leads to suffering can help a lot in some cases.