I am a bad person

I just finished therapy and the course of the session ended up on the question 'am I a bad person trying to be good or a good person trying to be bad?' My therapist offered a story from her life that demonstrated her being the latter when she was younger, during her story I had the realization that I am truly, maybe innately, a bad person. I'm not sure how I haven't realized this before. Over the course of my life I have done terrible things to people without second thought and without any guilt, only in the last year or so have I experienced guilt and shame of any sort, and I attribute that primarily to the way I used drugs. My current plan, before this realization, was to join the military. Now I don't know. What am I supposed to do? What is a "bad" person supposed to do? Before you say 'oh you can be a good person', is that worth it? I liked how I used to be, the shameless and guiltless, manipulative person that used people to my benefit. What am I supposed to do now? I feel troubled by this.

i might not be the best person to respond, but ill begin - the process of forgiving yourself is a very hard one. especially for people who keep this part unconscious. its only later on when they first approach true intimacy that all the built-up shame revels out. that is my story. it doesnt have to be drugs - it can be anything. i have a very addictive personality. too. still in the process of figuring it out just like you - but i would suggest a start for both of us, in surrounding us with people who see us or with whom we have any capacity of establishing a meaningful/ intimate relationship with. as you will come with acquaintance with your self as with a person who "feels guilt, feels shame" as opposed to being guilt and shame, you might realize that the one who feels them is not a bad person. then, naturally, you will begin aligning yourself with things you truly love

>>79392 Don't take what I'm about to write very personally, I had just heard something awful today. Something vile and horrific done by someone that I heard of over the news. Not the usual kind of bad you hear every day but the kind of vile that makes you lose complete hope in humanity. So vile I don't want to even spell it. No one is holding a gun to your head to be a good or kind person. No one. No one is expecting compassion. We as a society right now are well past that point. Be a total asshole if you want. But at least don't be evil. It's literally not that hard to do. Just don't be evil. It's such a simple rule, for anyone who is too retarded to follow complex teachings. >am I a bad person trying to be good or a good person trying to be bad? I'd tell your therapist that I can't answer whether I'm good or bad person. That's on others to judge as when we look at ourselves we get a skewed perception of who we really are. What I do know, is that I'm trying (extremely hard might I add) to not turn into a bad person by living in a world filled with vile people that seem to only give you the option of either being a victim or a perpetrator. >>79394 >forgiveness I'm autistic and schizoid so that's probably the reason I've never understood what forgiveness really means. I don't hold grudges or anything, I simply just don't get it no matter how hard I try to. Seems like a ploy perpetuated by hollywood movies to brainwash people into being ~cool~ with whatever. What I do when I feel guilt and shame is correct my actions so I don't make the same mistakes in the future. I have no idea how not doing something can be so hard for some people. JUST DON'T BE EVIL.

>>79396 I’ve actually also been diagnosed with both autistic and schizoid traits and that’s exactly what I meant by keeping that part “unconscious” When time comes and you’ll be in a situation - you’ll find out

>>79392 OP, you say you feel guilt and shame, which means you care. well then, if you’re a bad person, how do you feel them?

>>79394 I don't think this is a permanent state of affairs. I didn't feel this way once, I don't think I need to feel this way still. As a result of the course of my life I am incapable of having meaningful relationships with anyone. Anyone who 'gets to know me', with whom I exchange confidences, or otherwise try to be sincere to will either a) doubt my sincerity (because I don't truly know how to express it anyhow) or b) learn about the truly unforgivable (by my standards) actions of my past. >>79396 I am sorry to let you down because by most people's standards, many of my prior behaviors have been "evil". I can, and have in the past, made the argument that I wasn't doing it intentionally (which I'm unsure is true still) or that I didn't realize it at the time or I hadn't thought things through etc etc ad nauseum. I am a bad person, I have done evil things, things that likely will have far greater repercussions than just on the people to whom I did them to. >>79399 Because if given the option to not feel them I would. Because I know how, I'm pretty sure, to turn certain feelings like those *off* again. Maybe 'bad person' is an oversimplification. I have, as with any one, a large capacity for evil. What I also have that many people don't, is a willingness and a seemingly flimsy moral compass, if any, and the ability to rationalize/justify just about anything.

>>79400 >I am sorry to let you down because by most people's standards, many of my prior behaviors have been "evil". Being autistic I had no concept of empathy. I litearlly had to be taught about it and I learned one simple trick "Don't do to others what you don't like done to you". A more elaborate version of "don't be evil". If that can't fix your moral compass I don't what can. People like to derezz religion saying soykaf like "Well if you need religion to tell you that murder is bad then you are simply bad person". Some people are born morally compromised, and need to have it drilled in their heads not to be menace to society.

>>79392 there's no such thing as innately bad people. telling yourself that you couldn't be any other way is a cop out, to save you the effort of doing the right thing. you have free will and there's nothing stopping you from choosing to do good at any time.

bad things are bad. good things are good. u shud b gud. of course your therapist is probably bad because therapy seems pretty bad lol. in my humble observations it seems to do more harm than gud. maybe next time just git gud

im back >>79401 i have a friend who's a psychopath, that's completely true it really depends, did you kill someone? help sign a contract for a war in kuweit w the c1a? did you rape women? so far from what you said it has to be something of those things, because thats "bad", and all of these presume you could attempt to make up for the said offense in the respective field

you probably distributed cp since this is lainchan but even in that vain there is room for an attempt at personal redemption

OP, if you liked children, attempt to ask yourself why - it usually stems from the attempt to regain perceivingly lost innocence

>>79403 what about people that are born pedophiles, attracted to children, and were never abused, or ultra rich people who've never had anything bad happen to them, and concoct financial conspiracies like the one that lead to the 2008 economic crisis, they know they're breaking the law, and it profits them, and they know that their whole scheme is going to blow up and create chaos and everything will be traced back to them, but they don't care at all

>As a result of the course of my life I am incapable of having meaningful relationships with anyone op i understand you more than we should know - i also find it way easier to choose people to talk to who are either light-hearted or psychologically myopic, so i dont feel busted as long as op continues getting in touch with the feeling part of themselves im not worried. op must read poetry, "forgiving yourself is hard" - yes, but the hard trick is - it cant happen without other people >>79401 as a person who constantly sees the overdiagnosing panic of gen z and skyrocketing autism rates as well as been acquainted with psych as a field but chose to not work there - theres nothing wrong with most of you on lainchan, yall are just very sheltered. if you feel like you're weird, find weirdos like you - just go out, fall in love love, enjoy, live life

>>79415 >theres nothing wrong with most of you on lainchan, yall are just very sheltered >just go out, fall in love love, enjoy, live life Spoken like an ignorant person. Lain, I do enjoy my life because I've learned to cope with the disorder. My life was 10x worse when I didn't know what was causing the problems. I can't really "just go out" any time because I live in a resident evil type of city (because people like OP or worse roam the streets). I do live my life and I don't see myself as weird or outcast just because I face more difficulties than the average person. It is what it is. If you really see the world through a just live-laugh-love lens maybe it's better you are not acquainted with psych (not a respectful field anyway). >>79403 Spoken like a naive ignorant person. >>79404 Exactly. It's not that hard.

>>79418 I’ve also been diagnosed with autism schizotypicality and more, I’m not gonna continue the conversation because you’ve turned away every bit of advice from different people in your response showcasing the exact aforespoken traits and in this case mb even a shrink won’t help ya not me It’s not like I know anything about the political implications of the module because I have no connection to the sphere anyways Peace

>>79421 I am not OP, wtf are you on about

>>79423 I don’t think they think you’re OP

>>79424 so why are they saying "every bit of advice from different people"? And I never asked for any advice.

>>79425 Are you mad? You've been asking for an advice just a few posts earlier. Reload your relay, now!

>>79428 Here are my posts: >>79396, >>79401, >>79418, >>79423, >>79425, and this one. I don't know what you are on about. I didn't ask for any advice and I don't need the unsolicited advice in the first place, like I've said previously. Why you are being hostile, I have no idea. I've said all I have to say and have overstayed my welcome in this thread. OP (or anyone reading this): just don't be evil. Bye.

>>79429 what is your coping strategy, exactly? is it something specific to your disorder?

>>79392 volunteering? Food shelter, helping homeless people or raising money for charity. Find in internet organizations in your city.

OP here, I appreciate the responses but I think some of you are missing the point. I don't think I have any interest in 'redemption' or forgiveness from others for my perceived sins (and I don't believe those are "real" especially in my case). I just want to know how to operate as someone essentially universally thought of as a bad person. I would like not to hurt anymore people but I believe this is more to do with my own selfish reasoning than any real desire not to see other people hurt. I just want to know what I'm supposed to do with my life once I've accepted my nature.

>>79433 OP i think we need more information to help you Since you posted this poem, I will assume you were talking about cp, so >>79410 to >>79412 might be helpful

>>79433 I have a friend who’s a psychopath he now does Ethical alignment of AI in a top Google team

>>79438 Bro honestly if you still believe in true love even to the minuscule extend quit your hitman darknet job or whatever it is it won’t give any safety to your family further on down the line and you’ll fail to protect your loved ones

>>79436 I feel stupid that I don't see the link between the poem and cp, and while I've had my fair share of OCD intrusive thoughts wondering if I'm a pedophile, I don't believe that I am (have never had the urge to look at CP or view a child sexually), and that is not what I'm referring to. Beyond that, I'd rather not go into detail on my previous actions, other than that they were heinous and without remorse (up until quite recently). >flood detected post discarded God this soykaf is annoying as fuarrrk

>>79440 I’ve seen your deleted post and beyond giving abstract iterations on forgiveness if you won’t tell your story I sincerely doubt any pragmatically valuable guidance can be given. but yes, if it’s from darknet quit, if it’s from war contracts with intelligence (because we have some feds lurking here and there) or something adjacent governmentally involved I would suggest to quit and to yes think about people you would like to not be part of this sh1t, because with the awakening of your soul that you can see so far, the chance is high that in the future you WILL fall in love, and they WILL suffer what you’re doing here is signing an emotional torture contract basically.

like choose your soul or choose your job at this point - there’s no other way of going about it and that choice will show if you’re a good person

you’re single-handedly signing out on your own chance at happiness in life with this job

>>79392 >Before you say 'oh you can be a good person', is that worth it? Yes. Good people bring prosperity and harmony in the world. Ask yourself how the world would look like if everyone was like you. Would you like to live in that kind of world? Would you like the people around you to be like you, your family, friends, partner? >What am I supposed to do now? Change for the better and move on. No point in dwelling. >I liked how I used to be, the shameless and guiltless, manipulative person that used people to my benefit >Because if given the option to not feel them I would. Because I know how, I'm pretty sure, to turn certain feelings like those *off* again. It's a matter of habit. You can't change overnight. And you can't change if your values stay the same as before. If you don't value integrity, fairness, goodness, the habit won't stick and you will revert to your old self. If being self-serving is one of your core beliefs and you refuse to let go of it, then honestly, I don't think you can change. Not in this lifetime, anyway. >I would like not to hurt anymore people but I believe this is more to do with my own selfish reasoning than any real desire not to see other people hurt. I just want to know what I'm supposed to do with my life once I've accepted my nature. If you think you can be a good person on autopilot while holding those beliefs, you are a lost cause. If you have no desire to see people not get hurt, you will remain the way you are. You are already saying "accepted my nature" which signifies your subconscious resist to change. Nature is changeable. Hell, even people born without a limb get a robotic arm. Nurture even more so. If you are willing to accept your nature, you will never change. Accepting is an excuse to continue being the way you are. It's easy and lazy and that's why you cling to it. Only the willingness and hard work you take to change your core values can fix this. As a rule of thumb the hard thing to do, is usually the right thing to do.

>>79392 I don't think majority of people would be good if it weren't for the fear of laws. You aren't unique. Do what you want to do.

>>79448 "being a good person" != "being good", it seems that you interpret this in the sense of "following the rules", but being a good person may well involve breaking the rules, and is typically motivated by compassion and emotional empathy. This says more about you than you probably think

>>79449 >is typically motivated by compassion and emotional empathy Sure, but that's rare. People who are genuinely "good" are abnormal and insane.

>>79439 op should look at this response

This is OP. I'm not sure if this is truly related to the original topic, but I thought I'd post/ask here for continuity's sake. For a little bit of extra background: I had a period of very intense drug use (cocaine, speed/meth binges regularly, xanax and opioids almost cycling in between the uppers) after my initially minor substance use in high school (weed daily, psychedelics occasionally), and during that later period I began to have what would probably be classified as psychotic episodes (deeply deluded, audio & kinetic hallucinations, rarely visual) which led to prolonged self-isolation; I was never hospitalized, though. I am still quite self-isolated albeit in a different way: I have little desire to be around other people. Having taken the advice of this thread, I am in the process of leaving my current employment (note: I am not a hitman as many here suspected). The main issue is a resurfacing of these delusions and hallucinations, but this time I am far more aware that they are in fact delusions and hallucinations. For example, I am deeply aware that it is incredibly unlikely that I am a prophet, or being shaped to be one, which was a delusion I really suffered from once. I can tell as well that there is no possibility of people around me being able to see/hear my thoughts, or that I am being hunted by my smell. But this resurfacing of things I thought were gone is making it deeply difficult to 'rejoin the social', so to speak, even if I were to try to 'be a better person.' What do I do? I am not going to take medication nor seek out a diagnosis; that ruins lives.

Sorry to rebump, but reading through the thread again and my responses I have some more thoughts. >>79433 I think this was me coping. Having dedicated some serious thought to it I believe there'd be nothing more cathartic than for me to open up entirely to someone and hope that they can forgive me as a person. I think I'm actually profoundly interested in 'redemption' and all of its theological-esoteriological connotations even though I am deeply anti-religious. I think a part of me believes that desire is pathological and that I am weak for seeking some sort of 'redemption' or religiosity to fix me. I recognize that it will never happen, but I hold out hope that somebody will recognize who, what, I am and set out to fix me. I am a broken shell, an empty vessel, and I think its deeply obvious to anyone I meet, which is why everyone seems to distrust me now or otherwise think ill of me. In a very childish, basic sense, I want to be unconditionally loved by someone that I in turn love and respect and admire, but I know that, at least for the foreseeable future, that is impossible.

>>79450 That's just what evil people tell themselves to cope.

>>80240 OP Here but I hate to break it to you: emptyness must be actively maintained; nature abhors a vacuum. If you're actually empty thats a (you) problem and you have only yourself to blame. Counting on some rando to stumble in to give you that which you actively resit is a trifle evil.

>>79392 You cannot be "good" or "bad" if there are no other people around. Your problem is strictly about your relationship with other humans. What do you think a relationship is? All take and not give? Nobody owes anybody anything but the most basic of politeness. I'm going to give you a bit of unorthodox advice: Cut everybody off of your life, for a while, and then see what happens. Are you happier that way? Is maintaining a relationship too tiring? It is for me. That's why I don't even bother. The goal of cutting people off is to focus on yourself. Focus on what you have to change. If you can't stand being with yourself, then nobody will stand being with you. >>80240 You see it clearly. You have a "relationship" problem, not a "good, bad, evil, whatever" soykaf problem. Best of luck, lainon.

have you by any chance participated in the selling of any chemical that might be detrimental to the well-being of children

>>80270 >You cannot be "good" or "bad" if there are no other people around Suppose you're alone, secluded in some distant place. You are unhappy with your solitude. Are you good or bad?

Also cutting everyone off is retarded advice. It may be healthy for you to get away from people for a few days as a form of weekends, but no more than that. "Focusing on yourself" is bullshit, unless you're a monk who gets food and bed for free. Survival isn't about exploring bounds of your imagination and delusions, it's about grinding the machine of society. Isolate yourself for too long, and you loose your grip. Regaining it is hard and painful, and in the end, you realize that all of the "internal explorations" are just a meme.

>>80472 No point even living if you become like that. You're already spiritually dead and must be miserable