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Have any of you managed to quit porn effectively? Every time you stop for a month or more I fall back into it no matter what. I've tried everything, I've read books and tried website blockers, but I always end up skipping them. and falling. Has any lainon achieved it, is it even possible without leaving the internet?(USER WAS WARNED FOR THIS POST, You should always elaborate on your opinions rather than just spilling the soykaf.)

>>76213 You need a girlfriend.

I was free of porn for about 3 months a few years ago. It was just a cessation of desire; I didn't have a girlfriend at the time. >>76216 Doesn't help unless her libido matches yours. If not, many women actually encourage their partners to use porn so they don't have to deal with it. Myself, I want it like twice a day every day, which very few women can keep up with.

I'd look at it from a wider view. Why do you have bad executive function in general and how is that affecting your life?

>>76217 > Doesn't help unless her libido matches yours. Usually that just means she's not into you.

>>76219 Some people don't have strong sex drives lain. That's just how it is.

Why do you need to quit? Because society says it's shameful? Because some broscience take about abstinence being good for you? Do you really think not jerking off is going to change your life in any significant way? It's borderline magical thinking, in my opinion. Just do it whenever you feel like doing it. If you're wasting too much time, then stop edging and finish quickly. Maybe get a hobby because when you're bored, there's nothing better to do than beat your dick. It's a complete non-problem and I think the nofap mindset is an instance of the cure being worse than the disease.

I have not quit. I have reduced the harm and the scope of negative habits. First, stop going after the weird stuff. Shit is like crack. Switch to JOI / more vanilla stuff and then go for reducing frequency. There is a lot of black and white "any amount is equally harmful" rhetoric spread online. Buying into that too much can just set you up to feel defeated and abandon your progress after you slip. The hours you spend not gooning out to depraved soykaf are good hours. The times you slip into old habits are useful reminders that you still need to improve. Try to get better bit by bit, Lain. Stop being so hard on yourself. Reduce harm.

>>76221 >Why do you need to quit >broscience >shameful >magical thinking >just do it average orange site reply section every time you dare to point out porn makes you feel bad

>>76220 Wishful thinking, I'm afraid. They're either not into you, or they have some kind of hormonal disorder. Healthy people are horny almost by definition.

>>76223 If you feel like soykaf physically and mentally, touching yourself too much is the least likely culprit. Instead of thinking about your nutrition, sleep quality, social and romantic relationships, career, general outlook and meaning in life, you know the big stuff that actually matters, nofap bros close their eyes and go hmm, yeah, masturbation must be the problem, everything else will fix itself if I stop lusting over tits and ass. In reality, all your problems stay the same, you still don't do anything, you just add constant horniness to the mix with no real outlet for it other than brewing soykaf on imageboards about your pseudo-religion that worships semen retention. The nofap thing is just magical thinking. It's like The Secret but for dudes: if you stop jerking off, all that sexual energy is going to somehow magically transform itself into a productive life. Every time you jizz, it's like draining a battery and that's why you don't want to do your chores or whatever. Well, guess what? You ain't gonna want to do chores with a boner either. Focus on what actually matters in your life instead of distracting yourself with a pseudo problem.

>>76225 you are not even talking to me or anyone in here, you made yourself a strawman in your head and are trying to fight something that exists anywhere but this thread. It must be your personal trauma cuz you conflate masturbation and porn as if one cannot be done without the other. No one said a thing about masturbation. Porn. I have no issues with masturbation and do that from time to time because that's just my need to. Also stfu, people are different. Watching porn throws me into derealization state. To translate it to you, imagine that you normally live in a 60fps world. When you hook on porn you get thrown into 20fps world where you perceive environment as slow, choppy and laggy, unable to perceive the whole picture. Call it broscience, disease, idc. I stop watching porn - I stop having that issue, it's that simple. On top of that I can bring you my anecdotal evidence where my female environment says my eyes got sharper and my body smell changed to the better once I stopped gooning on a daily basis, and yes I take showers 2-3 times a day. If porn wasn't so addictive there would be no need for you to defend it so hard, addiction by itself is a reason weighty enough to drop porn as a habit.

>>76226 Strawman or not, your personal anecdote sounds even more retarded and made up than the usual bullshit that gets peddled. Well, I can't argue with personal experience, if a video of people having sex on screen caused your entire reality to warp like you're Neo seeing the Matrix for the first time, then who am I to deny that? Every time a nofap bro recounts his 2 week long stint of abstinence, they say the most wacky soykaf, like this is the first time they saw color, everything was magical, the world felt sharper, every bite of their morning croissant was more tasty. All from just not looking at boobs!

What does "falling back into it" mean for you? Are you an addict who locks themselves away fapping for a week straight? Or do you spend your days cataloging a variety of porn without touching yourself? Or do you blow your money on camwhores? >>76226 >To translate it to you, imagine that you normally live in a 60fps world. When you hook on porn you get thrown into 20fps world where you perceive environment as slow, choppy and laggy, unable to perceive the whole picture That sounds fun. I wish porn gave me a dxm-style trip instead of just a boner. >I take showers 2-3 times a day. that's not good for your skin. I hope moisturizer isn't a trigger for your porn addiction >If porn wasn't so addictive there would be no need for you to defend it so hard I'm not the lain you're responding to, but that's a complete nonsequitur. People defend non-addictive things all the time.

>Focus on what actually matters in your life instead of distracting yourself with a pseudo problem. when you are a stoner, everyone logically assumes you are not able to focus on your life unless you stop being a stoner. Everyone will agree that stoning brings you down and prevents you from living your life because you are, well, stoned all day. ...but when it comes to porn and porn addiction, the same scenario turns into magically safe and healthy. Because it's an effective way of neutering your sex drive and turning you into docile male. >'The sexual impulse', Schopenhauer continues, 'is 'the most vehement of all cravings, the desire of desires, the concentration of all our willing', it 'constitutes even the very nature of man'. >In Freudian psychology, eros, not to be confused with libido, is not exclusively the sex drive, but our life force, the will to live. >In Plato, eros is a spiritual energy Sex drive is something philosophers of all ages tried to study, and learned to preserve and direct for their great doings, and yet today everyone thinks it's perfectly fine to neuter it at the very moment you get a slight boner and be done with it. Directing hundreds of images of naked women which do not even exist to your head is perfectly fine and healthy? Developing weird sexual fetishes and diving deeper into extreme content is good? We believe because so-yence said so, and so-yence says that neutering yourself is perfectly fine and effective. Of course. Even though science cannot, by definition, make any meaningful porn study, as every living male on Earth is gooning to porn, or is going to start gooning soon - starting from the age as early as 13. There is simply no control group to conduct a study on. A perfectly legal addiction, much like tobacco and alcohol.

>>76227 Not a single person in this thread mentioned nofap. We only talk about dropping porn. And yet you bring nofap and absistence all over again as if anyone here was practicing them. I start to doubt whether you can even read and your intellectual abilities, arguing with you is like arguing with a wall.

Touch grass. You would have to not use the internet or only visit sites that have no user posted content if you wanted to avoid it entirely. There is nothing wrong with porn in itself just you got to not spend effort seeking it out so it won't be a time sink.

>>76229 I like the correlation between cannabis and pornography, in a way, though not so much the conclusions you draw from it. Nor the fact you barely develop the point at all other than the social perception one gets but not the other. At least acknowledge they're both essentially free pleasure hacks available to pleasure-driven creatures that might not be entirely cut out of these modes of life, not to forget that rats literally kill themselves and ignore their executive functions to chase this specific dragon. And we've got a good deal in common. Though this is far from new info. The rest of what you wrote is best ignored since it too easily sinks into its own pathos, but let me try to salvage something in good spirit. Erotic drive isn't finite. It's not a limited amount of physical energy given to you every day, like a gauge that runs out all too soon; it's imaginary, creative, and present even in the stinkiest of gooners with their oily faces and mile-long stares. It's the same thing that ironically makes you feel like a fuarrrking loser for spilling your seed to a screen, or losing focus constantly and blaming it (in psychosis) on your pornography consumption. Read the guys you're trying to quote.

>>76224 >or they have some kind of hormonal disorder which are much much more common among women, and typically cyclical >Healthy people are horny almost by definition. Seems like a case of a bad definition then.

>>76222 Really glad I have a naturally really big hangup about watching anything with a dude in it. Just pisses me off. Never progressed into the hardcore stuff so my dick never stopped getting hard for girls irl. Downside of JOI is unlike other porn you nut and the amount of alone that you are hits really hard. Otherwise it's ok.

>>76213 Your semen holds great power. With it, you are capable of creating a new life. It takes a tremendous amount of energy to create new semen when you've emptied your reservoir. This is why men are very tired after ejaculating. When the want to ejaculate is habitual - such is in the case of a masturbation addiction - you are stuck in a loop of depleting yourself of your life force, since you are constantly working on regenerating the reservoir. What generally adds to having a bad feeling about this addiction, is because you subconsciously know that you are wasting your life force over some pixels on your screen. >>76216 It seems to me that you are saying that one gets a girlfriend solely to replace masturbatory needs. That's not why you get a girlfriend, because a girlfriend that is of benefit, is not just some cumrag for you to use.

>>76255 Can I eat the semen in order to replenish the reservoir?

>>76221 Yeah how could such supernormal stimulus be bad for you? My god people you are all just sheep

>>76259 Does time slow down when you goon it too?

>76263 Call me surprised when a coömer takes rejection of porn as a personal offense and can't just let people do the thing they want and acknowledge their will to reject it. There are a lot of perspectives on what porn is and not in a single one porn is good for you; from a moral standpoint (sex trafficking and exploitation), from a biological standpoint (exploiting dopamine reward system, porn addicts often have erectile dysfunction), and many others, involving you and your personal life. But worry not, a brave warrior is going to defend pixels on the screen calling anyone who dares to reject porn a cultist and a schizo believing in magic. Now the justice has been restored.

>>76264 I quit porn and the next day I found 10 bucks on the street. That's all I'm gonna say.

>>76264 You can not debate the dead, but you can certainly die trying.

>>76255 One doesn't get a girlfriend "solely to replace masturbatory needs", but a person like this will never stop masturbating without a girlfriend.

>>76213 A counterintuitive method is to subject yourself to the most gruesome and disgusting porn out there until your at a point where you physically throw up and that feeling of nausea gets associated with porn in general and you won't touch it. I mean really disgusting stuff, group scat eating porn, anal prolapse, (fake) rape or porn with vomit and blood, or just all of the above. Your basically hacking your mind into having a phobia of porn. Anyone ITT saying there's no problem with real life 3D porn as long as its within reason or a simple pleasure etc are wrong. Anyone who says "okay this is just human feel good stuff its okay to enjoy it because its natural" are fools. If that's the case, you might as well live like dog, soykaf in the streets, have no clothes and piss on public buildings. All of those are natural urges. Porn is bad because its undigniying and immoral. Porn reduces you to a lizard or a chimp pressing buttons for treats, at least hentai has a story and characters that are part of the eroticism. 3DPD soykaf is just there to reduce you to the mental level of a Rhesus monkey in a lab and milk your attention for money. When you watch porn your jerking off with the man. Sex is divine and you should enjoy it as much as you can and that's also key to kicking porn. Have a good sex life that doesn't leave you craving stuff. People use porn as a substitute for real sex and they live vicariously through porn. Have more sex, try more of your kinks and fetishes out, spend time working on it and making it more enjoyable for you and your partner too.

>>76274 >Your basically hacking your mind into having a phobia of porn. I feel like I did this to myself unintentionally, for 3D porn at least. I have no interest in it any more. Unfortunately AI generated porn is available in vast quantities now and I would say it is even more degenerate in terms of rotting your brain, because usually there is no context, it's just bodies, artificially optimized to excite your brain in ways that actually existing women can't be, and there's so much of it you can just ride the high of seeing new bodies for hours without needing to engage in even the flimsiest plot like you would with hentai. No one except maybe hentai artists are harmed in the making of it, but I think it's way worse for your mind. >People use porn as a substitute for real sex and they live vicariously through porn. Yes, very much so. Like many things on the internet, pornography is a cheap substitute for real life. I invariably feel like crap after using porn, even after really intense orgasms, because of how empty it is compared to even moderately good sex.

I want to quit porn but the thought of being attracted to 3D women after quutting scares me so much that I can't continue. I might be delusional thinking like this but I have no hopes left. At the age of 17, I am about to complete a decade of watching porn/horny content.

>>76257 Only partly, since a lot of the more subtle energies get lost in the digestive system. >>76273 OP is an AI.

>>76213 Porn yes (have you looked at how retarded porn is these days?) Jerking off? Well on day 15 and chatting up a girl at work, so we shall see.

>>76213 Just stop going to those websites. I'm serious. Just use all the willpower you have to stop going to those websites. Do what you have to do. Get up and leave your computer if it's THAT bad. Just do something else. Hell, exercise instead! I stopped using porn for a while and you know when I relapsed? When I started going back to those sites and sites like 4chan, a place overrun by porn addicts. Even really horny parts of twitter, instagram, and youtube, just stop going to these places, deal with the urges and your brain telling you "Aw come on, it's not THAT bad, just try it", and stick to your resolve. It's all about endurance. That's the key. P.S, ignore the posters telling you porn isn't that bad. I'm not going to preach to you about why YOU shouldn't watch porn, but you're clearly trying to make an effort not to, because for whatever reason, you've realized it's not something you want to consume. Don't let others tell you it's fine or not that bad if YOU'VE determined you don't want to consume it. Ganbatte, OP-kun

>>76213 Sometimes I've gone a while without masturbating or looking at porn but I found that what happens is, after it increases briefly, I basically stop having sexual thoughts and feelings at all. I don't want that, it's depressing, and being depressed is probably the real reason for stopping to begin with so it's just making things worse. It is a form of mental and physical exercise. You can stop exercising if you want but it doesn't seem to make sense to expect that to make you healthier. That said a very large portion of the porn out there (ie. everything on the front page of pornhub) is really gross and bad vibes and I think would inherently make people feel bad jerking off to it.

>>76228 When I masturbate I literally spend 1 week or 3 days masturbating all day without going out, my energy and motivation completely disappear. When I don't do it I tend to be a very active person.

Before answering how to quit, I would like to clarify what I think is harmful about porn. Earlier, someone mentioned porn being harmful in a way that is similar to cannabis. I think this goes in the right direction, but a better analog are cigarettes or added sugar in food, because they harm in very slow and insidious ways that are barely noticeable during day-to-day experience. Another way to look at it is that, in the long run, some things create more desire than they satisfy. Added sugar and cannabis are definitely among these things, but in my experience, porn is too. Spend a week masturbating to porn every day and it starts feeling like you have a "porn drive" on top of your natural sex drive. Now you need to satisfy that as well. But what exactly are the harms? For me, my subjective experience and the way I feel emotions change, in general but especially when it comes to my interactions with and thoughts about women. Sorry for the vague description, but it's hard to put into words. It's not that my sex drive increases, but rather that I become more preoccupied with it in a shallow and objectifying way. The cravings for porn also go hand in hand with other unproductive cravings like scrolling social media, video games, watching shows, candy and fast food. In combination with the porn, this leads to a lot of wasted time and a distracted and unhappy mind. Some might formulate these symptoms as a problem with the dopamine receptors, but I think such theoretical formulations are unhelpful. Sticking to truths that I experienced first hand makes it easier to say no to the cravings. If I stop masturbating to porn for a while, these symptoms and cravings slowly disappear. Masturbation without porn does not cause me any problems. Therefore, I believe that they are caused by regular (over)stimulation from porn.

Now to answer your actual question... >>76213 >Has any lainon achieved it, is it even possible without leaving the internet? I have not fully achieved it, but I have reduced it to a point where it no longer causes me any problems. Similar to how I have not 100% quit added sugar, but it is not a part of my daily life anymore. What helped me: >Really get your reasons for quitting in order. When the cravings arrive, your mind will try to find a hole in your reasoning. And if it finds such a hole, you will watch porn. It's not just that you can't quit in this scenario, it's that you become someone who does not even want to quit. >Just masturbate without porn if you're horny. >Avoid triggers. Especially 4chan is full of soft-core porn even on the SFW boards. >Cut back on other activities that provide instant gratification, especially scroolling. >Avoid "all-or-nothing thinking". Porn not being a habit is a success. Reducing your usage is a success. If you "relapse" once, it does not mean that you have "fallen back into it". This is a case of your mind trying to find excuses: I've relapsed, there is no hope for me, it does not matter if I do it again. >Avoid stress and get enough sleep.

Maybe you review your values, If you want to quit, get it in your head that you don't want it anymore. When your penis is erect, try to urinate, this will make the effect go away. In more extreme measures, rip your dick off hhahhaha

>>76213 It can only be achieved through sheer will alone if you're sitting at home all day doing nothing meaningful. You're going to fail inevitably, doesn't matter how long you've gone without it. You need to find a way to fill your time doing things you enjoy, preferably around other people, or doing something you want to do that is meaningful but don't necessarily love doing all the time. I had a year long course of schooling to learn something a few month ago, I remember during that program I had no urges to jack off whatsoever. People shouldn't even bother trying to convince porn addicts to quit, this thread should just be for the discussion of methods of quitting porn. You're not gonna break through to someone who has already made up their mind, no amount of studies or anything will convince somebody who has already decided where they stand before the discussion began. I've tried it myself, in all kinds of arguments, and it's just a waste of energy, they'll just try to refute information before even looking at it, every time. I don't even like jacking off in general, with or without porn, every time I do I feel like I just wasted energy and get depressed. For some people I guess going without porn helps them.

Yea I just fuarrrk my wife once or twice every day now.

>>76213 The problem is boredom and idleness, and lack of immediate consequence. Your will has also been slowly degraded by dopamine feedback loops, caffeine intake which cuts bloodflow to your brain by ~40 to 50% and redirects it from the frontal and prefrontal areas,a nd to your limbic system, and of course alcohol, weed, etc. So it's boredom, idleness, and neurochemical degredation by consuming internet content. Video games and anime also count. You've lost the ability to delay gratification and transmute and layer energy. I pretty fell into the same pattern, but have gradually reached escape velocity. Stop reading books and listening to podcasts as well. Shits retarded, generally. The odds you'll be able to plant a seed which will grow to your core, are low. You already have the machinery required. Reading a book is actually a form of loss aversion and procrastination. It also frames your activities in thenegative, "don't watch porn". Your brain then thinks porn porn porn porn porn porn porn porn porn but tacks a "don't" on afterwards. Eventually this weak negation will fail. The other tragic excuse is a sort of inverse trap, where you say well I should be strong to do whatever I want, and negate any negatives. If I am avoiding a certain type of stimuli, then I am still a slave. So you test yourself. Etc.

>>76278 I remember a few years back, I officially put my foot down on masturbating to any sort of drawn porn or hentai, as I felt like it would warp my brain into lusting after the unobtainable and when AI art started blowing up I immediately generated hundreds of images, mostly clothed women in fantastical settings, but then I tried generating realistic women, tried to get down to business and I just couldn't stay hard I think a part of my brain still holds onto that feeling that there's something fake and artificial there my advice would be to just outright reject lusting over any artificial women, and wait until you are super horny and just look up beach volleyball videos or women doing athletic activities or other sorts of soft core content until your brain goes back to normalcy

I hate it. I wish I could quit but I keep coming back to it again and again. I'll manage to stay away for a couple months max but I always fall back into it. The only time I managed to stay clean was when I had a crush on a classmate and we were talking friendly terms. I didn't even get the urge to watch it. >>76221 Because instead of living your sex life your do it vicariously through porn. I'm an anxious, depressed, socially dysfunctional loner who faps to JAV because I don't put myself out there. Instead of enjoying sex I watch other people do it for me. Its junk food for the dick. You slowly become sexually dependent and start developing self-defeating thoughts, "I'll never be good enough. I'll never have sex like that. I'll never meet a girl like that. I'm ugly." Its all by design, they WANT you to feel this way so you keep buying their product. Its designed to make you vulnerable and keep you there.

>>77241 Lainon I feel you so much. A couple days ago I went back to using porn after months of being clean. I have spent several days doing nothing but that and I feel like soykaf. On the bright side, I think I have now figured what went wrong, so I'm ready to tackle the next attempt. Next Monday it starts again. Wish me luck.

>>76213 Yes, I find it difficult to break from. Less and less so however, but to truly stop would require a broader life change. I tend to use the sex drive as bait for the mind to follow, or I sublimate libido and direct it back onto the self. The whole focus is this area is usually divided into extremes. Developing "healthy sexuality" (I don't have a sexuality, too old now, totally unwilling) or complete abstinence (a form of asceticism). Both are admissions of failure. There's really no good outcome.

>>76213 I've been recently addicted to AI r34 that looked so real and wasn't able to resist for days... I kept reading articles and books on neuroplasticity and other things while promising myself not to look up on other things and then finally got some relief. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5h9sQnjwTvI I made this video which summarizes everything I learned. I know it's a bit awkward to share it here but I promise you'll get something out of it. Yeah sometimes when you feel bored you'll want to kill time watching again but just fill your time doing something lain!! For those who defend porn, you know how it makes your brain so fried you can't think about anything anymore

>>76830 I've read that one study you're talking about with respect to caffeine. If caffeine truly reduced brain bloodflow, it would not also increase oxygen consumption. The effect is likely explained by reduction of idle blood in the brain.

>>77253 >I've read that one study you're talking about with respect to caffeine >that one study >one study Why did you choose to lead with this attempt at framing?

>>77254 Simply because I was only aware of one study when I investigated the issue about a year ago, and the implications of your description (of a real finding, presumably) don't agree with my experience. Caffeine use has treated me well with respect to higher brain functions, and so I'm eager to offer alternative explanations. I could be wrong, but my hunch is that caffeine is generally positive for goal-orientation -- after all, stimulants are the frontline treatment for what we call ADHD.

>>76830 >>77281 You may find it interesting to know that caffeine has radioprotectant effects -- look into it.

>>77281 No, Lain. That was a nice try but a not an adequate "save". You started off, right out the gates, trying to get in early and establish leverage and optics by framing what I just said as some fringe way out there idea that came from you know, that onnneeeee fringe paper that was published way back, and then even if it waassssss true [....]. You did that. I don't know why you did it, if it's just some cringe conditioned behavior you picked up, but I'm not going to just let it slide. That is something part of you tried to do and you're not going to backpedal out of it. You did that. You. >Caffeine use has treated me well with respect to higher brain functions, and so I'm eager to offer alternative explanations. The issue here is your conception of "higher brain functions" and what basal state you're comparing it to. AND whether you've experienced the inverse. Most likely what's going on is something like this: >>77231 You're used to it, it spikes stress hormones and alters your blood sugar and CO2 tidal curves, and it cripples the limiters in your prefrontal cortex. You then come to associate this tunnel vision state where certai functions are enhanced, with a global enhancement. When you're really made a trade and submerged yourself deeper into the unconscious. Anyway, do the opposite and get back to me. Methylxanthines, polyphenols, etc, are highly active on inracellular calcium buffering (ryanodine receptiors, smooth ER, concentrations of extracellular and intracellular methyxanthines equalize within 5 seconds, etc). So you should try a xanthine mix that does not reduce blood flow, which would be theobromine and theophylline. ie raw cacao. Take in high quantities of this and compare it to the other state.

>>77283 >You're used to it, it spikes stress hormones This effect is tempered by consumption of nutrients alongside caffeine. I only drink lattes with sugar. >alters your blood sugar and CO2 tidal curves ...In which direction? I'm aware of caffeine improving glucose tolerance/metabolism. >cripples the limiters in your prefrontal cortex. This statement is more ideological than materialist, and so I reply ideologically: is it possible that overcoming the limits of the brain, which evolved in an energy-scarce environment unlike our modern one, is a positive? >ie raw cacao Your writeup is intriguing, but I would be concerned with the level of lead and cadmium in all consumer-available cacao.

>>77284 >This effect is tempered by consumption of nutrients alongside caffeine. I only drink lattes with sugar. Not really. You can temper it with b-vitamins and so, but it's still going to release epinpehrine and it's still going to alter your cortisol curve, which is tied to insulin. It's just how it works. And it's actually part of why it works/ You can't fully block the downstream effects of the adenosine blockade and elevated intracellular free Ca2+. >...In which direction? I'm aware of caffeine improving glucose tolerance/metabolism. Provided you have the water soluble vitamins. It's also not caffeine alone in any of these products. >Your writeup is intriguing, but I would be concerned with the level of lead and cadmium in all consumer-available cacao. That's been in the literature for decades, and it's well known that the different cultivars have different affinities, which are modified by what soil they're grow in. Volcanic soil in south america = more cadmium, ivory coast etc will be more lead. The amount and bioavailability of that lead is also relatively low. You are far too topical Lain. Don't follow trends and memes. The pharmacology of cacao is also fairly complex. You have polyphenols, anadamide and reuptake inhibitors, salsolinol and phenylethylamine, high levels of magnesium, a water and fat soluble fraction. No one fully understands it.

>>76213 I always get so bored when I don't masturbate for a week or so. Last time I went cold turkey for about 2 months, I was feeling good about myself, but something happened and I started doing it again. I think it's become a coping mechanism for me. If anything goes wrong in my life, I put all my blame on masturbation. Feeling sad, masturbate Feeling lonely, masturbate Feeling bored, masturbate Feeling good and bored, masturbate Feeling sad and bored, masturbate it's a vicious cycle!

Ugh. I have led my brain into becoming highly sexualized, again. Slippery slope. I eat massive amounts of cacao etc, so on one hand you could sya it's hard mode (heh, pun), on the other it's not an issue unless you put yourself into it (or never put yourself into it, leading you back to artificial surrogates over and over and over and over because you never found out) which forms the sort of mental sink and rapidly patterns behavior. I would say cacao is a quasi-hypnotic but nonetheless powerful conditioning stimulus. It creates a state which as a backdrop enhances the patterbing effect of anything you set you brain to doing.

>>76213 Lains, I have felt something click within me. A fundamental shift. On this day, I have outgrown pornography.

as snowden said, *everybody* looks at pornography. Just be careful not to break your self-winding watch if you fap a lot.

>>79162 I'm not everybody, buddy.

>>79162 Would like a source on that quote. It's true though, not because everyone likes it but because social media and even random soykaf websites will shove it down your throat whether you like it or not. Porn isn't even addictive, masturbation is and it always comes out of boredom imo. Gotta stay busy always, and when you're not (i.e. before sleep) then try to figure out something that makes you think instead. Keep your mind working. >>77243 This is also good, use that extra energy with healthy exercise or some other soykaf that will be actually good for you instead of wasting it on something utterly useless. Getting into a habit of getting angry when horny maybe can also help unrooting the evil. Anger is the greatest driver to change, particularly when the anger is directed towards the self.

>>79162 Well, you know, this is essentially the reason wristwatches are typically worn on the off hand (i.e., the one you don't use to write / shoot / wrench / eat / jack off). But still, as a right-handed right-wrist watch wearer, I do understand how it do be as.

>>76213 You gotta be so busy you don't have time to think on pr0n. At the same time, you gotta mantain some healthy habits so that you can be in the best shape (this brings mote focus and energy, you will have less chances to experience low attention that will deviate your focus from what's in front of you to your phone or a pr0n site. Start coding. Install the redirector extension and redirect youtube, anime and pr0n sites to about:blank. Start using invidious without an account (so no wacky recommendations to keep you hooked up). Use messaging webapps on browser so you don't have a single reason to touch your phone at home, same with the morning alarm, use a browser webapp instead. If you can go full text-mode only, replace web browser with lynx, but this may be a bit too much for most people. Still, keep it at hand, it's useful for googling simple stuff. Remove all social media. Youn don't need that bs in your life anyways, and nobody cares about what you post there, except for the big corpo that's leeching on your irl info If you have the space you can just torrent movies, yt-dlp entire channels that are truly worth watching (to learn about technical stuff, philosophy, or other cool stuff), download yt music mixes so you don't even have to think about building a playlist and ending up using that as an excuse to procrastinate (ik, soykafty m4a lossy quality but it's worth it for the mental offload). Also use singleFile extension to download webpages into a single html. Also remember that your environment plays a big role in all of this. Clean your room. Keep a clean desk except for books, a notepad for writing down stuff, and your pc. If you live in a soykafhole with people that bothers you all the time, get out as much as possible, stay in a library all day with just the essentials like a laptop and some snacks. Go to the gym too, so you have to only come back to eat and sleep. You'll come back so tired you'll want the day to be over soon. You can do it. Start small, start smart. Plan ahead, and add one more good thing to your life each day. P.S. does someone remembers Gabe Dawg? That guy was a legend, i think he had like 1500+ videos about

The solution's simple: https://yewtu.be/watch?v=Dg8cop27UeU

>>76216 A girlfriend is a partner (and if possible, a partner for life). Not a talking fleshlight.

Believe it or not, this guy put it best https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uEEfeSuD_Po

i don't get you no fappers. have you considered just thinking about the ethical implications of mainstream porn, like impoverished people being pushed into it for poor pay, rather than 'hurr durr gotta brute force et'? i don't watch porn anymore because I'm simply not willing to pay for porn that's guaranteed to not be ethically compromised. pushing away the issue with shoddy solutions like jogging will inevitably fail

Like with beginning meditation, quitting porn is easy. Do this: 1. Every ten days, fap. 2. Eventually stop fapping. Forever. It sounds stupid but it works. You are exploiting your nervous system to substitute for either of two alternatives: 1. Wife, which begets children, which begets a decrease in your endocrine-based sexual urge in both wife and husband (how do you think so many older men neither have sex nor fap?). 2. A sink for your energy, like carpentry or math. Basically a hobby that is a mix of creativity and drudgery. The issue with #1 is that it's not going to happen. The problem with #2 is that you are eventually disturbed, the hobby is interrupted, and recidivism commences. The solution is to realize your activity-reward system is a large graph and demonstrates hysteresis. You need a topological constraint on data flow through this graph that hijacks your endocrine system. It just so happens that men have "periods" in 9-day cycles, except they get super horny rather than grouchy. If I do math, I can go a year with fap. But, if I expose myself to a hawt lady, I break! I accept my imperfect self and exploit my mind-body through this computer virus whose contents with parasitize the graph of activity-reward feedback. Keep a brief journal like "Iteration 1, broke after 2 days; Iter 2, 7 days; Iter 3, 4 days." After a few months you will realize the break points are a guassian distribution with mean at 5 days. But, also make a brief one sentence note of why you broke. You will notice objectively you are failing but subjectively you are improving. Thereafter, by force of will, develop better habits. You are monotonically mentally getting better. Go exercise... but a lot, to the point of exhaustion, even just cardio is okay. Try meditating, it is fine if you are clueless! Do isometric exercises, even if merely sporadically!!! Suddenly, the distribution's mean will veer to 10 days. After half a year, you will notice... you don't care about fap anymore. Do math, programming, etc just for fun, even 5 minutes a day is okay. Add in exercise 5 min. Cooking. Cleaning. Feed yourself distractions and at worst you will experience recudivism to 5 days - better than your current habit! - and at best you will have impeccable sexual self-control.

The simplest way to wean yourself off porn is to get in a relationship and have sex. Easier said than done but biologically we fap because we don't have a partner to sleep with. >>80059 >Eventually stop fapping. Forever. Why does anyone think this is a good idea? Not fapping will only make your body more frustrated and even if you don't fap your brain will simulate more wet dreams anyway. Its like saying starve yourself to quit a fast food addiction. And if quitting is so damn easy there wouldn't be people asking for it. >>80075 Depends on your ethics. When people say "ethically sourced" they just mean legal and consensual right? But obeying the letter of the law isn't ethics. Its fundamentalism. Just because someone is willing doesn't make it right. Our sexual ethics are really fuarrrked up and that's probably one of the reasons everyone's so unhappy and frustrated or confused. >Its easy to stop people from looking at porn when they humanize the people in it and realize that most of them are not happy with the job You can rationally grasp that people aren't in a good place. Doesn't stop people from consuming that soykaf anyway. Its so easy. Just a few clicks away from sexual bliss you'll never experience. The surefire way to quit porn is to live the fulfilling sex life you wish you had. Easier said than done.

>>80079 >Why does anyone think this is a good idea? Not fapping will only make your body more frustrated and even if you don't fap your brain will simulate more wet dreams anyway. Its like saying starve yourself to quit a fast food addiction. And if quitting is so damn easy there wouldn't be people asking for it. Ironically to your comparison fapping is starving yourself of zink and other micronutrients because you dont eat as much as you cum away. And the way you reason about it makes you sound like a fat fuarrrk arguing why its okay to eat soykaf. I think its fine making bad choices but one shouldn't start deluding how its actually good. Celibacy has also an effect on brain receptors which however means you cant fuarrrk either for months to make it happen. The whole nofap thing originally started over a bunch of guys reading medical research and finding out woah there is actual legit science backing celibacy. Its just the "stop c()()mers do nofap" had of course more meme power and reached further than "celibacy monks were right"

>>80075 >There is quite a bit of ethically sourced porn. But then again, the people doing it are usually not mentally well or are not in good places in life. Eh. I would make amateur porn if my partner was in to it. Can't think of any reason why not. >Its easy to stop people from looking at porn when they humanize the people in it and realize that most of them are not happy with the job Problem is I'm addicted to cartoons and written word, which are produced with love by freaks online. IME the craving for porn itself is a lot weaker than the urge to masturbate. And consuming porn makes you have the urge to masturbate much more frequently. Getting the two mixed up is not great. >>80122 I am willing to bet that approximately zero monks ever actually went nofap.

>>80132 >I am willing to bet that approximately zero monks ever actually went nofap. alcoholic cant believe people dont drink

>>76213 Use fasting, vegetarian diet, extenuating sports (HIIT goes nicely), cold showers and breathing exercises. r/semenretention is a great place to motivate you abour this. I'm leaving here some guide for you. https://books.google.com.cu/books?id=4bbSBgAAQBAJ&printsec=copyright#v=onepage&q&f=false Beware OP, from types like >>76221, they troll whenever they feel to.

>>76213 >Have any of you managed to quit porn effectively? >Every time you stop for a month or more I fall back into it no matter what. >I've tried everything, I've read books and tried website blockers, but I always end up skipping them. and falling. >Has any lainon achieved it, is it even possible without leaving the internet? I used to spend a significant amount of time watching porn videos, which ultimately left me feeling sad and depressed. However, I haven't watched any porn for about a month now. When I feel aroused, I either masturbate to pictures or do so without any external stimulation. I've noticed that I masturbate less frequently than before, and when I do, it's quicker. I'm pleased to say that I no longer feel the sadness or depression I once did. Perhaps one day I'll reach a point where I can masturbate without any external stimuli, but for now, I don't have any concerns about my current approach. Here are my thoughts, why I think NoFap community is wrong. It's essential to acknowledge that consuming pornography have negative effects on mental and emotional well-being. While the NoFap community advocates for complete abstinence from masturbation, a more realistic and healthier strategy to tackle porn addiction are these 3 rules: 1. Eliminate Pornographic Videos: Start by avoiding all forms of pornographic videos to reduce exposure to stimulating content. 2. Transition to Erotic Images: If you feel the urge to masturbate and find it challenging to do so without external stimulation, consider using only erotic images instead of videos. This can help you gradually reduce reliance on more stimulating content. 3. Gradual Detachment from Triggers: After a month or two, focus on distancing yourself from any triggers that may lead to sexual arousal. Aim to practice masturbation without any external stimulation. Remember, the goal isn't necessarily to abstain from masturbation altogether; it's about minimizing exposure to sexual triggering content. It's also important to note that prolonged abstinence from ejaculation can lead to epididymal hypertension, commonly referred to as "blue balls," which can cause discomfort or pain.

>>76265 I found 30 euro on the street this year, been trying to quit porn and masturbation a lot this year. The 30 euros I think was when I first reached 2 weeks.

>>76216 Gee, why didn't I think of that?

>>83867 But why does it make you or anyone feel sad and depressed? Doing it more than ~1 a week will clearly make me feel a bit zoned out, and sometimes avoid eye contact with people. But I never felt sad or depressed because why would it? I guess regret of making my day more sluggish and less confident - yes, sure, but that's it

it's idiotic to try to be more interested or less interested in sex/porn/whatever than you naturally are interested. it's like thinking "i breathe too much, or too little. and no matter how hard i try, i just go back to breathing that much." fuarrrking retarded.

>>84849 >mouthbreathing is fine, ive always done it you have no clue what natural means you are a product of your current modern environment which is anything but natural

>>84854 You're an ignorant ass with no knowledge of human behavior in general, but you larp as though you do. Ignorance is understandable, but pretentious, willful ignorance like yours is inexcusable.

>>84859 how are you too stupid to understand internet is full of goonbait?

>>84849 Oh man we’ve solved addiction everybody, lemme just go tell alcoholics to not fight it because it’s natural

>>76232 I baffle to the idea that someone might find that pic sexually stimulating, lmao.

Didn't quit porn effectively until I started fuarrrking my gf on the regular. We get months-long dry spells though (her sex drive is really sporadic) so I can't rely on that. Often I go back to it when I'm really stressed. >>84849 porn is very different from breathing. It is quite possible to masturbate and have sex, both of which are natural urges, without ever seeing porn. Additionally, I find myself using porn when I wouldn't otherwise want to masturbate, and I find there isn't really much sexual release most of the time. Only if I haven't masturbated or had sex for a few days do I really get relief from masturbating (with or without porn), otherwise it's really just something to do. I think there's an extra stimulation aspect besides just the sexual desire aspect.

Use the EasyPeasy method. https://read.easypeasymethod.org It's quite different from other methods, and will completely change your perspective.

>>84886 10/10 master troll! Well played, I guess. Now fuarrrk off.

>>85113 What makes you think that's a troll comment?

>>85112 OP and other strugglers have to check this out, I'm surprised that this is the only mention of EasyPeasy in this thread. It caused a significant shift in how I think.

You need to be genuinely bored and disinterested in it.

>>85112 >>85117 EasyPeasy only works if you are using porn compulsively or as a coping mechanism, not if you're doing it to kill time or because you enjoy it. It doesn't work on the guy who genuinely enjoys his daily cigarette, either. For that type it is a matter of a) having something better to do with your time b) having someone in your life who will hold you accountable.

>>85124 >because you enjoy it What if you're fooling yourself into thinking that you enjoy it?

>>85154 Then I guess it might work for you. You'll find out if you try.

>>85161 use pygmalion effect by working on yourself and fapping to hentai of demon girls only , ditch the 3d girls. https://youtu.be/J0NIMTPYYcU https://youtu.be/J0NIMTPYYcU

Hard iron will. You just move your hand each time your about to do it, force yourself to not do the action.

>>85247 >oops I jerked off >well I guess I'm just a weakling that can never improve, so I will not try any more or >I'm a weakling that will never improve, so I'm going to keep trying but keep hating myself more and more (driving me to consume more porn to escape the bad thoughts) terrible mindset. Yes just don't jerk off but you are always doing it willingly, it is not a "lack of will" or "lack of self-control" that is making you do it.

>>85273 I quit for 173 days for a challenge, i thought i couldnt do it but i pulled through. Another thing you can do is do a porn blocker and make a password youll never ever remember boom there you have it.

>>85273 I went for nofap for like 4-5 months but then got angry and felt the need to punish my meat for a 1 month (I fail edging and decide to splurge) Still havent had sex time wit anyone in long time

Pornography fills a gap that occurs when a lack of meaningful and positive social interactions happen. Aside from from a few stray cases, every time people watch pornography they're alone. Loneliness is a key component of it. Covid-19 made it worse. Get out, meet people, don't stay inside.

>>85282 imo this applies more to other kinds of online content, because for most people porn has a built in limiter where you just have an orgasm and then it's too boring to bother with for a while, so it's not going to displace other activities. If someone somehow finds porn perpetually interesting and spends a large portion of the day on it to the exclusion of other stuff they would rather be doing, that's what I would think of as a porn addiction. If someone thinks they've done something bad if they are masturbating to porn for less than an hour a day and are obsessed with exercising "willpower" to not do that but still do it and then wallow in self pity about it, that seems more like some kind of cultural based derangement and not actual porn addiction.

>>85282 bro go outside bro the women can detect your nofap streak bro just hold frame personality bro

hello lainanons, half a year ago I realised that I have a porn addiction and I've been battling it ever since. How I came to that realisation? I have this "calling" that I HAVE to create something people will admire, however I've always had a problem with finishing projects, every time getting discouraged when things got tough, or just losing motivation. I've read and tried everything: improving my lifestyle, training discipline, write out goals etc, but none of that really helped. The last thing that seemed to be the cause was my everyday porn consumption, which I practiced since early teens. I never thought about it being an addiction since you always hear people say "it's natural" or "it's healthy", but after reading the symptoms, it was scarily spot on to what I've been also experiencing: bad memory, low energy, self esteem, mood swings etc etc. So I think that's the problem, it has probably obliterated my reward system and made me unable to work on long term projects. At least I think so, I still haven't gotten over my addiction, so far only lasting about a week at a time. While it's an improvement over beating it off every day, it's getting harder and harder, I have a constant brainfog and there are days where I can't think about anything else. And at the same time, I'm starting to doubt if beating this addiction is the key that will finally allow me to pursue my goals, I don't know, maybe I'm just naturally lazy, or just not cut out to create something. I'm losing hope. thanks for reading my brainspill, I really don't know who else to share this with

>>88210 porn is a terrible addiction for creativity. you can spend theoretically unlimited time with it until you completely fry your brain. keep fighting the good fight anon!

>>76213 >Have any of you managed to quit porn effectively? I will tell you that in a moment.

I started around 8 years ago, i was 13, i started porn and masturbation at same time, since the begining i found nofap but i never can reach past three weeks, i think my biggest streak without both was 20 days, and almost the same just with no porn and masturbating daily I got a gf, wonderful girl, but past the love stage everything go back like before, i try theraphy but didn't help much (i'm gonna try with a new one, is a man so maybe he will help me better i hope) i go to scorts, two times, i feel like fuarrrking soykaf and think never do it again, i came back to porn (mostly just tiktok, it was a gamechanger for good or bad i don't know) I just feel so helpless, i failed at university, i'm having problems just to have a helpdesk job and i don't have any friend besides my gf that i cheat on her (the sex didn't feel good on that cheats) and now i dont have interest on sex with my gf but i can't stop masturbating with or without porn/tiktok, i deleted all my social media some months ago but i just download again tiktok or search scorts on telegram to feed my fantasy I just want to be happy

>>88231 If it means that much to you, try replacing the smartphone with a dumbphone, one that isn't even able to run tiktok or telegram. Perhaps the very capacity within your phone is a trigger for you. It was for me, and removing it helped. It helps when the urges kick you hard, but there is literally no way you can do anything even if you want to. Fight it with foresight, with a cunning plan. You could try to reduce the vividness of your pornography rather than cut completely. For instance, try just downloading dirty magazines online and use them instead. Make sure you don't talk down to yourself. Often being mean to yourself works against you unless you've got a particular personality.

>>76290 This is only true if you dont feel the energy within the semen. If you feel it then it doesnt matter

>>88245 Yes a dumphone sounds great but we live in the real world, i need a smartphone for my bank apps that don't work on website and allways

>>88258 Stop being a metropolitan queer and use their website. "I need bank apps" no you don't. Consider using an ATM instead or something.

After years of failure I am finally off the stuff for good, semen retention going hard nearly 90 days now. Never looking back.

>>88260 What was different this time that you manage to do it?

>>88262 One huge and irreplaceable key was to full stop all alcohol, even having one drink. Also making a commitment to full retention and celibacy for life. Would not even break it for a promise of a dream wife on a plate. In the past 90 days my life has taken off like a rocket so hard that jannie is deleting my stories off other threads.

>>88262 >>88263 Another key was never to look at hornt. Never to stare girls down in the streets, or flirt with them. Never to keep friendships with other dudes who are always looking to get laid and work together to score chicks.- Once your old enough to live this kind of life profitably you do this step, not advisable if your young or have no family or professional relationships. Always stay busy. Have a plan for months to come that is jam packed and stick to it. Do not be complacent. Keep active and make sure you develop constantly and do not linger.

>>88260 Are you experiencing any major benefits, like higher motivation or better memory?

>>88266 Yes. Both actually. All the major benefits you hear about it (SR) are true.

I didn’t fap for months and hardly consumed any porn. It felt good and I’d say there was more mental clarity. But recently I ejaculated, and it felt great too. Not because of the hormonal reaction, but it made me feel grounded after the long time of abstaining. Now I have to question again wether nofap is beneficial or not. My current stance is that porn is more harmful than jacking off (without porn).

>>88274 >My current stance is that porn is more harmful than jacking off (without porn). "Semen retention" and nofap make mostly no difference to the casual (non-porn) fapper really; in fact some people get addicted to counting days not fapping and calling it "progress" which is kinda crazy, especially with the fact that quitting addictions is a slow process in itself. Obviously it's better to fap but NOT to porn (to ur fantasies maybe) because they're less novel and obvious and you're more familiar to them, and you could just fap slowly less and less every week until you generally don't feel the need to fap anymore, but not in the "nofap" sense and counting days lmao. Generally casual fapping (no porn) does no harm to health really but could slightly mess with your focus/energy... I'm pretty indifferent abt it rly, I even saved some porn that triggered me sm and got familiarized with it so it doesnt affect me anymore.

>>88280 >Generally casual fapping (no porn) does no harm to health really but could slightly mess with your focus/energy... I'm pretty indifferent abt it rly, I even saved some porn that triggered me sm and got familiarized with it so it doesnt affect me anymore Glad to hear you made it. Indeed, the chronically addicted who count the days are not ready yet.

>>76223 Exact same culture on Orange Reddit.

>>88274 That is correct is a correct assessment and it was the same one that I have drawn for some while while, but the detriments of releasing semen in and of itself are still there, pron or not. >>88280 It only doesnt make a difference if your not aware of the ways in which it does, and its easier to tell the difference the older you get. Like me and other men in there 30s have noted when you really streak long (months or years) it makes you feel like your 19 again. I definitely credit my roughly 90 day streak and rising as being one of several key things making me feel better than I ever have in my entire life, and im currently 30. >>88283 Counting days is retarded, that is why I do not have an exact number for myself but just a ballpark. I can understand counting days if the addiction to PMO or just O was GENUINELY destroying your entire life really badly, but thank God it never went to that level for me or most of us. Even though for me it was definitely way way bad enough that I could not have true sober peace without stopping it. When it comes to this kinda thing, I believe you either go full volcell or just do not even try. Messing around or experimenting with SR may be cool for some people but I do not believe in that for myself. This is gonna be for life. >>88297 kek, orange reddit. I like that term. Its definitely better than halfchan.

does just looking at porn give you a dopamine hit? I now have a decent self control when it comes to touching my meat, but still, like a trained monkey, I sometimes find myself automatically opening porn and just staring at it, without touching anything else does this cancel my streak and put me back to square one?

>>88299 It gives you a dopamine hit definitely but it does not cancel a streak, why the heck would it? Only release would cancel your streak.

>>76213 I've never lasted that long. Longest was a month or two when I was a teenager. Then this slutty girl I knew posted this thing on snapchat which set me off like a wild animal. I used to be into nofap but then I quit because I realized it was not productive. I never noticed any of the placebo benefits of it to begin with because jacking off to porn or nothing at all doesnt make me melt like the wicked witch of the west unlike some sad sacks in the thread. Getting a girlfriend isn't the solution. If your bottom line for a relationship is sex and you think a girlfriend will save you from porn, your relationship has failed before it began. If you enter a relationship for the right reasons and that leads to you stopping watching porn, then that's different. Really you should figure out why you want to avoid porn so badly. It probably is not the porn itself but your inability to normally consume porn. You, for whatever reason, cannot maintain a normal habit of masturbation to porn and are spending too much of your time masturbating or thinking about sex and it's actively harming your life. Look at what might be driving you to addictively consume porn and focus on changing that, since it's not the porn itself. To me porn doesnt seem like a real drug in the sense that you have to go into rehab before you can turn your life around. But I guess if abstinence from porn doesnt distract from the actual mission then whatever. Sometimes I jack off without porn. Usually it takes me longer and is not as sexually satisfying as it doesnt emulate a sexual interaction as much as porn does. In that sense porn to me is a tool to allow one to masturbate more efficiently.

>>88298 Your image is words words words why do people find it impressive? It's lame tryhard soykaf

i think porn companies invented the concept of porn addiction. if you think of your unhealthy coping mechanisms as "addictions" they never go away. i have never met a self-described "porn addict" who wasn't just using it as an excuse to relinquish control over their life and gain sympathy for it. if you really want it to stop, you HAVE to stop blaming everything on porn. you are anxious, lonely, depressed, or whatever else, and rather than taking agency to change that you'd prefer to destroy your normal human sexual impulses because you think it makes you look wise when it actually just makes you look repressed (because you are). discomfort is the most normal feeling in the world and any given adult will spend most of their life feeling uncomfortable. the fact of the matter is "porn addiction" is caused entirely by a childlike repulsion for discomfort.

>>91898 >According to the pioneering article by M. Levine and R. Troiden (1988: 356), the first traces to be found of the modern condition “addiction to pornography” was the start of group treatments at Alcoholics Anonymous in Boston at the end of the 1970s. Based on their own experiences, members of the self-help group transposed the terminology and methods used for curing alcohol addiction to “sex and love addiction”. https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/S1158136009001376

>>76213 OP it sems more like the radios are telling you to do it i used to smoke weed pretty regularly i stopped when i was at work, and when i had more hours i stopped when i was out of work because i didnt want to i dont think addiction is real the way you think it is real OP especially for something which doesnt make you sick when you dont take it (if you were addicted to something like heroin you would be getting sick without heroin) i think the problem is you dont want to quit it, you dont need to quit anyway. unless you do want to quit and the radio doesnt, but its clear also the radio does. maybe you should try making stone tablets or talismans or something to ward about half of the radios or more, especially ones you do not like. or taking up more hobbies and interests. if you have something else to do with your time you would spend less majority of your time doing pornography and you wouldnt think it was a problem. maybe you wouldnt want to do it because you spent time doing activities already.

I got bored of it naturally after a while. I only like 2D drawings now. 3D porn grosses me out

Try this There are also 2 different audiobook versions I've found: 1) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZktxO6adTnI and 2) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=27H4-pN8e9o Don't let people convince you not to quit. Look at em like weed dudes trying to get you to waste a bunch a time with them. If you're not sure if you want to quit, read the book anyway. If you still don't want to quit by the end of it you can keep jacking off.

>>91898 I agree with this and I had a period when I was using meth where id jerk off every day for like 7 hours a day. I dont even really think about it now, sometimes I do once a week. I did nothing to "quit". I never was obsessed about my porn consumption in a negative or positive way. I also never had this experience of regular sex "not doing it for me" because of porn or having performance issues because of it. They always were seperate to me and obviously id rather have a relationship with an actual person. I dont really care what papers the porn addicts throw out, the problem is definitely what you are saying. I could easily see how during that time i was "stimfapping" as they call it now if I got all obsessed about how powerless i am over it and in some shame loop about it id still be doing it. Ive also never had "post nut clarity", I think guys set themselves up for failure way before the porn with soykaf like that. A combo of weird shame around sex, not being able to have relationships with your preferred sex (usually women, this is a post 2000s baby straight boy issue largely), and having no control of your life in general seem like the much larger issues that just get offloaded onto pornography. They are never able to quit because quitting never makes their life any better as none of the actual issues behind it get resolved.

I have tried my hand in dating but I can't for the love of god make myself interested in what people have to say. Whether that means I'm such a big brain that I can't be bothered with trivialities of the commoner or that I have schizotypical personality disorder is an exercise left to the reader. I am not asexual although I wish I was, and the smell of female genitalia made me gag so hard that I no longer wish to have any sexual relationship with women. I found that masturbation is a good middle ground to relieve sexual frustration on occasion, so I don't think I am going to quit, and I rather see it as a necessity in my life. Although it's worth noting that it can become an addiction for some people, and if you have no self control it would be a good idea to not to look at porn for a while.

>>93949 > but I can't for the love of god make myself interested in what people have to say Lol, relatable. I think one good solution for that is to be somewhere where everyone is a traveller/nomad/tourist/etc, and you can at least talk about some grounded things that you are also involved in simply because you lead this lifestyle. Hope I can try this in a better future where I'm allowed to leave the country.

I've tried before but realized it's fuarrrking pointless. I went half a year without porn or jerking off and absolutely nothing in my life changed. Imagine trying to stop reading books when you're bored because people on r/nobooks say you should. I think most of the people actually taking this seriously are christians ashamed of their natural bodily desires and nocebo-ing themselves into feeling bad after jerking off.

>>76255 >muh life force I'm never tired after ejaculating, I often end up exercising or programming after.

>>94062 It is the byproduct of a slippery slope that have been with us since the dawn of time. In the Girardian sense, reproduction is desirable because some people had success with it, and by that extension we should reproduce as well because it is a common trait among humans and living beings. In another angle, being able to understand these principles and hence being a couple standard deviations above the median intelligence of the population, and yet not reproducing, is tragic because this high intelligence become a dysgenic trait that prevents the saturation of itself in the real world. Again, in Girardian terms, these chain of events prompt the selection of a scapegoat, a collective blame placed abstractly on something, in this case, consumption porn, of which the extermination of it is claimed that it will bring about a better world in which people will reproduce more, and the chances of the proliferation of high intelligence will be more probable. This line of thinking has several issues. First of all, we should first reason about why people turn to porn in the first place. If, for instance, a person has unrestricted and ubiquitous access to sex, it would be improbable for them to be frequent consumers of porn. Second, all things equal, consumption of porn reduces sex crimes by being an alternative outlet for sexual urges that otherwise remain unsatisfied. Indeed, many people that are already married are frequent consumers of porn because of their extrasexual, emotional, financial and other issues inside the marriage. The ground reality is in stark contrast of anti-porn sentiment, and simply banning and outlawing consumption of porn will not stop or reverse societal decline, or increase in birth dates, a stark example being South Korea. I propose the following solutions for fixing abnormal amounts of porn consumption and crashing birth rates. Some of them are along the lines of scientific fiction and delusion relative to today's technology and economic realities, and some of them are perfectly reasonable and achievable today. 1) Ubiquitous access to gene editing in live humans to improve emotional and analytic intelligence, appearance and height 2) Solving economic and practical difficulties with raising children while both parents need to or choose to work 3) Reducing sex disparities inside legal and cultural systems that favor either males or females depending on the context 4) Emotional training to better recognize signals from the opposite sex to better evaluate interest or disinterest (or distress in the worst case) 5) Dissemination and implementation of social venues that enable meeting with new people that are otherwise not hyper social

>>76216 Exactly. But even so, why is masturbation an issue if you cannot get a girlfriend? Think of all the other bodily functions that are distracting. You wouldn't respond to hunger by not eating, you wouldn't respond to cold by removing your clothes, you wouldn't try to forget your need to urinate by holding it in.

>>94062 only tangentially related but I went through a period of not jerking off mainly just to save my energy as I just got out of a long relationship and wanted to go crazy hooking up with people and figured setting a no jerking off rule would provide me the motivation to do that cause im normally too shy to do that sort of thing with people I only kind of know. Instead it actually did the opposite and my sex drive lowered weirdly. Obviously like day of if im going to have sex later that day not jerking off can make me more like active, but not jerking off for some weeks or months honestly made me less likely to pursue something when the opportunity presented itself. On the other hand though porn for me has never been a replacement for sex like some people talk about. Ive never had this like "i cant get hard in my relationship because i prefer porn now" or whatever. I could jerk off to some crazy insane soykaf and like someone I know and have been flirting with fully clothed but wearing something kind of revealing still is more attractive to me. All I noticed from not jerking off for some months is just I was thinking about sex less and not as easily turned on.

>>76213 The most I can do is stop watching hardcore stuff. Frankly, I think nofap is a meme but porn is a cancerous substance nonetheless. It's healthy to find women sexually attractive but in the absence of women being in your life, it's better to just hang up a pinup or a gravure magazine and go to town. A lot of it depends on your relationship to porn and how much you end up not doing because of it. >>76220 I have to agree with that dude (3 years later). She doesn't have to fuarrrk every single day, but the least she could do is give a blowie or a handjob if she's not up for coitus. That's a good chunk why I want to be with you and if you won't do it, then I'll find another woman to have sex with and one who's more eager to satiate my sexual needs.

>>94063 Nice thoughts HOWEVER your analysis has a screaming hole inside it. As I see it the massive hole is the economic which holds our culture as hostage. Every aspect culturally and otherwise is defined or heavily raped by the exchange value and consumerism which drives the ideology of Single Isolated Persons. All is viewed through the individual in all aspects. There is no community which is the driving social precondition for bonding between the sexes. No amount of emotional training or projects of social venues will fix this. There needs to be a radical overthrow of current economic conditions and the alienating structures that are cities. You can play this game of throwing patches on a festering necrosis but it will mostly be a mockery of "progress". >Second, all things equal, consumption of porn reduces sex crimes by being an alternative outlet for sexual urges that otherwise remain unsatisfied. Indeed, if one can't but rape other people then they are not fit for society. Making concessions to subhumans at the expense of harming all others by subjecting them to porn seems dare I say it, unethical. Though, it doesn't seem like you share my view of porn as a plague on all of our quality of life. I could draw a boring comparison to drugs here but you read Girard so I think you are smart enough to understand why I might think this. To go back to the question of porn, one just needs to stave it off for three months or so as your brain rewires. This works only if you have actually decided to give it up. If you are still looking for a replacement in any object or act instead of actually cutting it off mentally forever, you will not succeed.

after i started dating and having sex and being in actual relationships with women and learning about women my interest in porn kind of naturally waned and i didn't really experience it the same way i did when i was younger and utterly clueless about women. i think it was easier for me to see women as sex objects when i knew very little about women and the things that women talk about about and think about and deal with in their daily lives, when they seemed like this mysterious other kind that i didn't understand at all. it's sort of like when you travel to another country or hang out with some other culture and actually get to know them and they suddenly seem much more human and real to you after that, they're not just a label on a map or some nameless crowd that you have only ever observed from a distance. and when i was younger i would always feel this weird sense of shame or guilt after orgasming and returning to my normal state of mind, both with masturbation as well as sex with women, like a feeling that i used this other person for my own selfish needs. it took a few years of experience with relationships and deprogramming my brain of a lot of toxic masculinity for it to sink in that the woman i am having sex with is also a human being with agency who is simultaneously choosing to have sex with me, that it's not actually a one way deal. and with porn and masturbation, after i actually got to know some of the women who do sex work and what their job is like from the things they talk about behind the scenes it eventually sunk in that these are just professional actors, they play a character to entertain an audience and there's nothing wrong with me for being part of that audience, so long as i understand that it's just a performance and the person they are performing as is not the same person they are off camera.

>>98100 >but the least she could do is give a blowie or a handjob if she's not up for coitus Frankly I don't much see the point in that, the appeal of sex over masturbation to me is the active two-person nature of it. If she's just stimulating me, I might as well do it myself since I can do it better. I don't really enjoy blowjobs. In this situation I've just jerked off while my wife did a striptease, it was more fun than masturbating alone and she felt less pressure.

>>94213 If you read what OP actually said you'll find that he said "porn" and not "masturbation". >>88301 >"Not a problem for me so it should not be a problem for you either" You are correct that there can be underlying reasons for excessive and/or harmful usage but your conclusion that therefore all excessive usage is due to external problem does not follow. Consider that porn is a superstimulant and that repeated usage of it will alter your reward pathways and that people respond to stimulus in different ways. Also >Longest was a month or two when I was a teenager. >Sometimes I jack off without porn. Usually it takes me longer and is not as sexually satisfying >to masturbate more efficiently. You recognize that it's a waste of time (you apparently want to get it over with as soon as possible) but do not recognize that maybe you can't coom as fast simply because your threshold for excitation is higher because of your consumption. >[no porn] is not as sexually satisfying as it doesnt emulate a sexual interaction as much as porn does. I hope you don't actually believe this. That would be very sad I think

>>76213 I stopped watching porn the second "I'm over 18" stopped being a lie. what's even the point anymore.

I think it's mostly industrialized porn what actually exploits your dopamine circuits or whatever and takes advantage of you and makes you addicted. Homemade stuff is pretty fun to fap with I personally have more grips with industrialized porn than porn in general because i appreciate sensuality and erotica a lot in my stuff. Let it be seen that you actually want to get fuarrrked silly, some french kiss here, some stupid laugh here while moaning. >but muh life energy brah, you're going to become a chad gigaalpha sigma if you don't le fap for a year straight !!!!1!!! This is a pathetic reiteration of protestant muttoid puritanism which coincidentally impulsed gentile circumcision for the same motives (to stop libido and desire for masturbation (yes american anon, you got mutilated because your grandparents got kool aid into a no fap cult), feeding off the need of ngmi incels who are desperate for one trick magic solutions for their lives

About 1 week in, don't miss it at all. I think this time might be the permanent one, every day it's getting easier. I've only caught myself going back once, and it was easy to stop at the "are you 18?" page. I started masturbating again two days ago, it's actually so much better without porn. Quicker, too. I hope I can continue erotic writing. I had to stop trying because I used "research" as my excuse for looking at porn images, and I wouldn't even write anything.

I interacted a lot with nofap in middle-school but stopped caring when I started reading more on ethics in university. basically your addictions (or inclinations) are determined by a general sentiment towards certain activities you partake in and the pleasure it renders. (one thing I have to add is that this way of thought is very demanding/exacting) so then all these activities have the common denominator of looking for a certain pleasure which you felt before and wish to feel again; in contrast with pleasures you have not experienced yet (in the exact manner) and wish to try (many things like music, film, art fall in this category; or even trying a new dish) (videogames could fall into this but only if you approach it in a specific manner). so then after you start recognizing these actions, when you completely override them you might feel lost as to what to do with your time and that is where your reason steps in (although I cannot explain that here). my reply is merely negative, because the positive side implicates an understanding of what our reason is and why it dictates what it dictates. you can read “groundwork for the metaphysics of morals” if you wish to learn more, or ask chatgpt about the virtue doctrine if your lazy (though this is highly inadvisable)

porn is just pictures and videos of women. women aren't an addictive drug that poison your mind and force you to jerk off to them. you just have a fuarrrked up conception of women.

>>100147 we are biologically addicted to women by design

>>100148 no, we are biologically addicted to sticking our dicks in something warm and wet until we come, that's all the id cares about. anything beyond that is the ego.

>>100152 we're biologically addicted to orgasm. it doesn't even matter how.

if we're going to talk about biological determinism, let's make it interesting. if you are addicted to jerking off to videos of women, why not try some fun experiments. see if you can make yourself come watching videos of men. don't think too much about it, don't get all hung up about gay or straight, just try it, challenge yourself to jerk off to completion watching videos of only men. i bet you could do it if you really put your mind to it. because if we are going to talk about biology, we have to first concede that humans are all the same species and have pretty much the same biology. even women and men are the same species and have pretty much the same biology other than a few minor superficial differences. there's nothing unique or special about the biology of a homosexual man's brain that makes him utterly incapable of jerking off to or having sex with women, any gay guy will tell you that he jerked off to women or had sex with women to completion before realizing he was gay. so logically it should work the other way around too, any heterosexual man could bring himself to orgasm with male stimuli if he really tried. and furthermore, what could possibly be hurt by trying? nobody will ever know about it but you. you know that you are not gay and you know that you aren't going to magically become gay if you jerk off to a man, you're already a depraved pervert jacking off constantly day in and day out, it's not like you're going to make your situation any worse. and who knows, it might actually help. maybe it's not the fact that you are jacking off that is the problem, maybe it's the way that you are jacking off that is the problem. maybe sex/masturbation and women are very tightly coupled in your mind to the point where you see them as the same thing and if you prove to yourself that you can jack off and have an orgasm without women being part of the equation at all, you will experience an epiphany and from that moment on you will understand that these two things are separate and independent matters and by fusing them together in your mind you were averaging out their significance, embellishing one and devaluing the other.

>>100160 >why not try some fun experiments. see if you can make yourself come watching videos of men. don't think too much about it, don't get all hung up about gay or straight, just try it, challenge yourself to jerk off to completion watching videos of only men. i bet you could do it if you really put your mind to it. I'm pretty sure that works cause sexuality is a spectrum. There's no 100% male or 100% female in the world, but the 2 centers still exists in some "ideal" way. A straight person can find a woman attractive, even if she has something manly, like rather rugged hands. Same goes the other way. You won't find a point where things switch from gay to straight, in the same way you won't find out how much hair someone needs to lose to be bald. But you can still make somewhat of a valid judgement. It's not perfect, nothing ever is, but if you squint your eyes it works 99% of the time.

>>100161 sexuality is a spectrum of behavior, not a spectrum of being. sex itself, be it intercourse between multiple people or solo masturbation, is just a behavior, an action. we categorize the behavior after the fact by saying "these people tend to have sex with or jerk off to these particular kinds of people, so we will put them in this behavioral category" but then we forget that we did this and we mistake our arbitary behavioral category for an actual intrinsic biological property and turn the whole thing around and say, "these people are in this category so therefore they must always have sex or jerk off to these particular kinds of people." and then we start doing really stupid things like forming theories about the behavioral category we invented actually being an intrinsic biological trait and setting out to prove these theories by engaging in biased pseudoscientific research where we look for correlations to support the theory and ignore anything that doesn't support the theory, and the whole thing is really just a big category error where we tried to reify an observed high-level social behavior into a low-level biological property, failing to take into account that social behavior takes place on a much higher level than biology and biology itself is just one small factor among countless other factors that influence social behavior, and also failing to take into account that we are arbitrarily imposing special significance on sexual preference over any other kind of behavioral preference, like favorite food or favorite color or favorite genre of music, all equally real and observable human behavioral preferences but inexplicably trivialized in comparison to favorite sexual stimuli, which indicates an obvious cultural bias at work.

>>100165 Not how it works. Your mind is warped by constructivism.

>even women and men are the same species and have pretty much the same biology other than a few minor superficial differences. This is one of those things that is sort of true if you define your terms the right way, but not true meaningfully in real life. >and furthermore, what could possibly be hurt by trying? Same reason I don't jerk off to scat porn or guro: because I don't like it. I've seen gay porn, it doesn't do much for me, and I move in to something else. Sure, I probably *could* get myself to cum from jerking off to something that doesn't turn me on, but I masturbate to porn I like because it turns me on. >maybe it's not the fact that you are jacking off that is the problem, maybe it's the way that you are jacking off that is the problem. The problem is the fact that I'm using porn to jack off.

>>100168 >but I masturbate to porn I like because it turns me on. but is that really why? is it really just the porn itself that you are addicted to, or is it the endless behavioral loop of reward, shame, reward, shame, etc. that you are addicted to? as they say in the drug addiction support groups, drugs aren't your problem; they are your solution. the problem is your thinking and your attitude and your behavior, the problem is something going on inside your head that you don't want to deal with or talk about or think about, so you escape from your problems with this pursuit of mindless excess which eventually leads to painful consequences where you say "that's it i'm off the porn for good" but pretty soon you're doing it again.

>>100169 >or is it the endless behavioral loop of reward, shame, reward, shame, etc. that you are addicted to? "are you addicted to this addictive thing, or the way that addictive thing makes you feel?"

>>100170 sorry to burst your bubble but most people can watch porn and/or jerk off without it becoming a problem, this is a you problem not a porn problem.

>>100171 Yeah and most people can snort cocaine or smoke cigarettes or drink beer or gamble without it becoming a problem. Hell most people that smoke meth don't do it again. Do you have anything helpful to say? Do you think you're the first person ever to have these surface-level insights into addiction?

>>100176 you seem kind of tense. maybe you'd better go have a wank.

>porn is bad thread Depends on your *overall* life setting. Living like soykaf makes you unable to quit your dopamine source. Living more comfy makes quitting easy because you basically get one dopamine source replaced by another.

>>100241 It makes quitting easier, but not necessarily easy. Healthy dopamine sources don't work like unhealthy ones, and it takes effort and intention to switch your mind and body back to healthy, no matter your life setting. What really makes the difference is how much effort and intention you are able to commit to it in your life setting. Doesn't help that a lot of people, even people in this thread, don't think you can really be addicted to porn, and talking about it is more taboo than talking about nicotine addiction (which I think it's broadly comparable to). If you tell someone you're trying to quit nicotine, they might go "good for you, it's a nasty habit." If you tell someone you're trying to quit porn, most people will become extremely uncomfortable. I have only once in my life gotten any kind of sympathy, ironically from a female flatmate that I didn't know very well.

>>76213 "Porn addiction" is a cop-out. You try to blame your deeper issues on some vague, non-existing addiction (addiction is an actual medical condition - unless you have actual convultions and shock if you don't fap, this ain't it) and believe that lol stopping masturbation with make you happier. At worst you're addicted to quick bursts of endorphines, but there are actually easy ways to deal with it. Go outside, take care of yourself, eat healthy etc.

>>100981 >addiction is an actual medical condition - unless you have actual convultions and shock if you don't fap, this ain't it It's commonly accepted that you can be addicted to nicotine and caffeine, neither of which meet your standard. Perhaps the medical definition of withdrawal syndrome isn't what's relevant here. Perhaps we should use these "signs of addiction" from the Mayo clinic: >Feeling that you have to use the drug regularly — daily or even several times a day check >Having intense urges for the drug that block out any other thoughts check >Over time, needing more of the drug to get the same effect check >Taking larger amounts of the drug over a longer period of time than you intended check >Making certain that you maintain a supply of the drug check >Spending money on the drug, even though you can't afford it not in my case, but it is possible. >Not meeting obligations and work responsibilities, or cutting back on social or recreational activities because of drug use check >Continuing to use the drug, even though you know it's causing problems in your life or causing you physical or psychological harm check >Doing things to get the drug that you normally wouldn't do, such as stealing not in my case >Driving or doing other risky activities when you're under the influence of the drug not in my case >Spending a good deal of time getting the drug, using the drug or recovering from the effects of the drug check >Failing in your attempts to stop using the drug check >Experiencing withdrawal symptoms when you attempt to stop taking the drug oh look, the only one you care about. The reality is that, like nicotine and caffeine, pornography is very difficult to quit. Just going outside and taking care of yourself and eating healthy doesn't automatically cure it. Even getting a gf doesn't cure it. Also, it's important to make a distinction between masturbation and pornography. Pornography addiction causes you to masturbate much more than you would otherwise, and using pornography to masturbate also modifies the experience in a way that makes it generally worse for you.

>>100983 >It's commonly accepted that you can be addicted to nicotine and caffeine, neither of which meet your standard not that lainon but sufficiently severe nicotine and caffeine use can absolutely cause physical harm, as can sudden cessation in those cases. certain psychiatric illnesses are moderated by nicotine to the point where patients will be actively told that they should NOT stop smoking. But my certain, loose definitions, anyone with stable employment is addicted to working. Not to work, but to working. There's a point to arguing where the line is drawn.

>>100985 >sufficiently severe nicotine and caffeine use can absolutely cause physical harm headaches and a sour mood, mainly. I've experienced them too. I don't consider my caffeine use addictive even though I use quite a lot of it, though. I similarly believe it is possible to use porn regularly without being addicted. However, that doesn't make it non-addictive. >But my certain, loose definitions, anyone with stable employment is addicted to working. It would fail many of the conditions I listed. The main difference is that working is (usually) not something you do voluntarily in the first place, it's something you *have* to do. >There's a point to arguing where the line is drawn. Sure, but excluding pornography just because the withdrawal symptoms aren't severe is definitely not where I draw the line. One way or another, quitting pornography is hard, and telling people that actually they don't have a problem is not helpful at all.

Personally, I'm not so sure that "addiction" is the best term to describe problematic relationships with things such as porn, gambling, video games, and so on. Sure, there's a lot of overlap, but I'd say that the difference between being addicted to a drug and having a problem with porn or whatever is that with drugs, it's a need that you didn't have before that more or less goes away once you've stopped using for long enough. With non-chemical vices, on the other hand, I would argue it's more accurate to describe them as hijacking of an existing need, such as excitement, sexual gratification, or accomplishing tasks. With that being said, I ironically found that I found it much easier to deal with urges to look at porn once I thought of myself as an addict. The desire would come up, and I would tell myself, "well, of course I want this, I'm hooked on this stuff. People who quit heroin are tempted to go back every day of their life, but they can still manage." ymmv, of course, since I would typically only use it once or twice a week, but since I think it's inherently immoral, I don't want to use it at all. I'd say, beyond getting a girlfriend, which is easier said than done, track your usual pattern of use and see how much longer you can go without it. Try to use stuff that's more softcore. Try to distract yourself if an urge comes up.

>>100987 Oh hey that's awesome. That's basically the principle of Urge Surfing.

>>100987 Getting a girlfriend doesnt inherently fix it because like with drugs there is differing underlying reasons for doing them and differing unfillable holes and desires the drug fulfills. If the reason for excessive masturbation is that there is a desire for romantic intimacy that feels unreachable and so that desire is replaced with cold masturbation than sure, which maybe you say that cause for you thats the case (and you wouldnt be the only one for sure). For an extremely odd example though just to showcase the breadth of things one addiction can address, the person might have chronic stomach pain and discovered one day while edging and gooning they forgot about the pain. That isnt a common story, but say in this case fixing the stomach pain would solve the addiction just like in the case you implicitly present getting a girlfriend would. I think for many of the younger gen z and gen alpha thougg the prevelance of porn addiction doesnt actually come from a place where getting a girlfriend would solve it; in fact increasingly their girlfriend might also be a masturbation addict and rather than have sex they may simply masturbate together or seperately. There is numerous musings and papers and I have my own thoughts on why this is a trend but thats for another day. You did hit at something universal and thats actually why I wanted to reply, because I think you said something important or key (sorry to spend the first paragraph splitting hairs and disagreeing) which is that you first have to accept your addiction does in fact do something for you or solves something and figure out what that is. This is something ive been saying and its nice to see someone else had a similar experience, its that moment of, as you said, saying to yourself "well of course I want this". Many get caught in a loop of trying to tell themselves theres nothing good about it thinking that if they can convince themselves of that they will naturally stop, it actually exacerbates the issue. If it doesnt exacerbate the issue it results in another addiction or complex on top of the masturbation addiction which is itself a complex meaning you have to do double the work to change course. But just look at most of the most extreme content catered to this masturbation addiction, a lot of it revolves around the struggle of wanting to stop and not being able to. This is the beast you create for yourself if you dont say to yourself "well of course I want this", trying to make a desire more off limits and scarce only pushes the pursuit of it harder. I dont know if youve ever noticed this but children of sort of sexually libertarian parents (people who are openly swingers and fetishists or practice some kind of 'free sexuality') often are the least interested in sex. For simplicities sake we can say there is two types of desire, im stealing this wordage and example im about to use from someone else but we can call them goal based and aim based. Think of your first time playing some open world rpg like skyrim versus your subsequent playthroughs. When you first play it you play to beat the game, goal based. You get as overpowered as possible, you forge the best weapons, you own everything. After this when you play again you install a bunch of mods to make it more difficult, mods to make it so you cant ever get too overpowered or so enemies always match you, you never even try to kill alduin or any of the dlc bosses. Aim based, your aim is to keep playing skyrim, you deliberately cockblock yourself from ways to win to continue playing. Addiction, and especially masturbation addiction is this second kind of desire. It requires things like the shame after, the refusal to acknowledge you like it, the interference with your day, etc. to continue. If you were to see it like hippy dippy types claim to see it and think of it as nothing more special than eating food it would lose its engine. If you only see masturbating with porn as the problem and not masturbating itself this should be self evident because you likely, despite seeing this, continue to masturbate to porn and refer to your addiction as a "porn addiction" instead. The catch 22 of this is that something in you likely knows that if you were to just accept you like the porn and masturbate because to it because its how you want to be spending your time and turned the porn into no big deal in your mind, you also run the risk of making sex this as well and losing your potency entirely. This is a big reason why I think in spite of women increasingly entering this male dominated addiction, it is mainly male dominated. I dont mean this in a literal conscious way but there is a neurotic aspect to it that involves repetitively checking to make sure you are still functioning as a man. The biggest fear, especially as you enter 30s and the worry isnt about social stigmas or how your masturbation addiction would be perceived anymore, is that it will make you impotent. Much like with my second skyrim example earlier, eventually your aim based desire will lose its potency in repetition without new elements to up the tension (more extreme porn that introduces more shame, drugs, another person to share in it with). The fantasy or myth around this addiction "ohh i cant stop gooning, oh i cant control myself, oh if i dont goon im gonna assault someone cause im such a twisted gooner" while full of shame and feelings of inadequacy is also masculinity affirming. If you are in the US at least and many other countries, a man is supposed to be almost not in control of his urges and animal like and certainly always able to get it up, to not be able to do that last thing is a far bigger shame than the addiction is capable of producing. Again it wasnt necessary for me to share this last bit and might alienate people from my prior points but if those of you with this addiction who are men think about this it should be obvious it plays a part and what part it plays in keeping this desire engine going. Its probably the least crucial thing to deal with, the most being what the poster im replying to said of admitting it does in fact do something for you and you like it, but if you get there it should also be obvious how to dismantle or rearrange this piece of your addiction.

>>100987 really, the times I experience the least desire for porn are when I get obsessed with a side project and devote all my free time to it. When I'm just killing time and surfing the net, that's when I'm most likely to pull up a porn site. I "soft-quit" about a month ago, still breaking down and looking at porn once or twice a week but when that happens I'm trying not to think "damn that was shameful, I'm such a piece of soykaf" and instead think "alright, I got five days this time"

I never understood this "porn addiction" thing. I mean, I want to beat it once in a few days and it's nice to use porn, and there are many kind of it to make it more interesting (including 2d, 3dcg, etc), but how is it addiction if it's a regular physiological need similar to the pissing for example? How do you even do it more than what your body demands? I mean after you do it, you just don't want it again until some time later and over time you don't start wanting it increasingly more often. Also why to watch porn if not for wanking? I mean, maybe you can just scroll it a bit to see if it's worth saving for later when you're building a library, but that's about it.

>>101011 Yeah, consider the following. You were urinating and one day you suddenly started enjoying urinating way more than you should. You become addicted and now you just can't stop urinating. This is how porn addiction sounds to me: g a y and f a k e and physically impossible. Must be another d u m b h o a x invented by z o o m e r s who are too afraid of life, world and their own body.

>>101012 I think this user is a bot. They never say anything interesting, they never back anything up. They seem to only be interested in spreading negativity. It's difficult to understand why anyone would be interested in doing this, but I don't really care. I will make a few points, not because I think the above poster is worth responding to, but because I think a third party reading it might benefit from an improvement on the analogy. What the above post describes is more like compulsive masturbation, which is a real mental illness, but it is much more rare than porn addiction. The analogy would make a lot more sense if there was some machine that made peeing feel way better for you, and you start using it every time you pee. You start drinking more liquids so you can use the machine more. You start going on piss benders where you hold your pee for hours, using the machine to keep yourself stimulated and intensify your eventual let-down. Eventually you can't pee without it, even a nice piss in the woods just won't happen properly. You waste significant chunks of your life tinkering with the machine, trying to optimize it for your tastes and exploring new configurations, even though you feel disgusted with yourself afterwards. That is what porn addiction is like.

>>101013 The ones spreading negativity is those telling the lies that basic human needs are somehow problematic. Okay, I'll give you benefit of the doubt, but it's still hard to believe this exists, because compared to real addictions, you just can't force your body with stuff like this. And the peeing analogy you describe sounds fantasy too, can't imagine it being real even if such a machine did exist. Also, even if this "porn addiction" exists, it must be extremely rare too, way more rare than all this nofap psyop spreading on the internet. You must also understand, that to those who don't deal with something exceptionally weird like this, it reads like "all fap is bad", because it's very hard to imagine how fap can ever be problematic if you're not the one dealing with this problem.

>>101011 Mostly good questions. Believe it or not some dont really have a refractory period. more common though is that people "edge" and delay orgasm for as long as possible, they become fixated on the journey not the destination. see my post here and the paragraph differentiating between aim and goal based desires >>100990 likewise with regards to why watch porn and not wank, the porn can become a source of almost enrapturement, a fetish in the almost literal sense (inanimate object that has special powers attributed to it). Picture a general whos conquered a city and sets it ablaze to just soak in the image of everything burning. Its already conquered setting it ablaze wont help any, but he needs to light it on fire and laugh to himself maniacally to actually feel the conquering and make his desire tangible. Have you ever, while drifting off to sleep, daydreamed an engaging sexual scenario or story about a crush or loved one? Your falling asleep so you obviously wont jerk off to it, but there is still a pleasure in even just imagining. Same for porn. In a nutshell, judging from your post id wager you see the goal of sex or masturbation as having an orgasm. You are fuarrrking or watching porn in an effort to achieve a climax. This isnt universally how people see sex, and unless the person does not have a refractory period the porn/masturbation addict almost always sees orgasm as not the goal of sex or masturbation but the end of it (because as you said most cant keep going after they cum). While it is pleasurable and they enjoy it they also sort of want to avoid it, because being in the state of trying to achieve orgasm is pleasurable and has addictive benefits even if you never do. People tend to feel good and reflect most fondly not on moments they get what they want but when they are chasing what they want, youve probably heard of "flow state" and other stupid names for this state of pursuit of a goal or desire. And sex and thus orgasms are maybe the most engaging and primordial and universal desires, meaning. The bigger and better the end result of any desire, the more the pursuit of that desire captivates and drives and focuses. I feel this way too, im about journey not the destination. But there is other factors beyond this view that create a masturbation addict, for me it just leads me in my relationship to try to have sex for as long as possible and always be the last one to orgasm. Often I wont allow my girlfriend to make me until the next morning if at all, not to be tmi but I enjoy sort of being 'used' in that way and having my pleasure come second (though its actually in reality still coming first as I paradoxically get pleasure from my pleasure not being considered). Often for the masturbation addict this laser focus and total shut out of everything but sexual desire while gooning serves a purpose many drugs also do of shutting out negative thoughts and feelings. Thats what differs a hypothetical gooner from me even though we both share in seeing the act of sex or masturbation to be in service of itself not an orgasm. I have better worse addictions that I abuse to avoid my problems and bad thoughts, gooning doesnt really cut it for me as a result. For some though it does, but thats a whole other can of worms as to why. Lastly you ask >how is it addiction if it's a regular physiological need similar to the pissing for example? I dont really know where to start with this not to be mean, your other questions were good. But this one I think would be better answered by doing some preliminary reading on what addiction is or how it works. There is people with food addictions, binge eating disorders, its one of the most awful addictions to have for the reason you say of it being a base physiological need so you cant simply "avoid" it like you could with crack or something. A smoothbrain who reduces everything to a poor understanding of evolution and biology would point out that all addictions basically stem from a 'misfiring' or rerouting or error of the circuits that make us eat, with the object of the desire and addiction becoming something we hunger for and chase like we chase food. They would be almost right or not even almost but would be hitting at something, its a good way to think about it regardless. Arguably to say all addictions sort of hijack the same process that makes us pursue sex is more apt, as its debateable whether sex is truly a 'need' whereas food obviously is. No harm will come to you if you abstain from sex, we arent a species where everyone always needs to be having sex to ensure its survival. We are somewhere between a spider where every member aims to have millions of babies and ants or bees where certain castes of the colony literally never reproduce. anyways I hope that was better or answered more for you then whatever that other guy wrote.

>>101018 > food addictions, binge eating disorders Alright, that's a fine example. Eating is way more flexible imo, but analogy still holds. > No harm will come to you if you abstain from sex Maybe if you're lucky and very healthy otherwise. But imo for sedetary lifestyle, lack of healthy circulation, possible underlying infections even as subtle as e.coli in the gut, abstinence like that is not going to be healthy.

>>101018 > journey not the destination This doesn't inherently lead to addiction though. I do it once every few days only when I feel physiological urge but at the same time I don't only do it functionally to reach the goal, I also enjoy the process and I don't rush it. Yet I don't become a junkie and don't start doing it more often just to edge without climax, etc. I honestly not sure why some people go into addictions more easy than others and what to recommend, but maybe try involve yourself in more diverse activities? Focusing on this kind of stuff and on battle against it may probably lead to counterproductive puritan state where pleasure itself seems like an enemy, which is just wrong. You can absolutely do it for pleasure and not be addicted and be productive with many other things, and it will be even better and more healthy and more fun than living an arc of puritan in eternal struggle fighting the guilt of their sin.

>>101024 >Focusing on this kind of stuff and on battle against it may probably lead to counterproductive puritan state where pleasure itself seems like an enemy, which is just wrong I don't think it does. Look at the posts in this thread, the majority of self-proclaimed addicts are not interested in quitting masturbation altogether. In fact, I am very interested in masturbating without porn, as well as having better sex and achieving orgasm with my wife. >You can absolutely do it for pleasure and not be addicted and be productive with many other things Sure, some people can enjoy it in moderation. Some people can't. You have to realize that not everyone's brain works exactly the same way.

years ago i tried nofap and all that and it didnt really do anything. then one day i just kinda got bored of jerking it so often. nowadays sometimes ill go weeks without porn and sometimes i will do it everyday for a week straight. i dont feel guilt when i do it and i dont feel compelled to do it. it just kinda became something i do every now and then without any extreme feelings towards it.

>>101017 >The ones spreading negativity is those telling the lies that basic human needs are somehow problematic. Ejaculation and intimacy are basic human needs, although you can forego them much more easily than, say, food or water. Pornography is not a need by any stretch of the imagination. Where do you see anyone saying that ejaculation or intimacy are problematic? Nowhere. You only see people saying pornography is problematic, precisely because it hijacks our desire for those needs.

>>101024 No it doesnt not to sound frustrated but I said that in my post maybe it wasnt clear cause I didnt clarify I dont consider myself a masturbation or sex addict. But im about journey with sex or masturbating and yeah not addict. Im saying its just a pre req, and that if you dont have that mindset at all then of course its going to be really confusing as to how it could be addictive. Cause yeah if the goal is always just to cum most have a hormonal wall to cumming over and over making it inherently a non problem.

>>76213 I'm 7 months clean right now, and if It wasn't for a brief stint in January, I'd be 13 months. Getting older has helped, but the way I eventually quit was setting achievable goals for myself, and gradually increasing the difficulty. You have to remember that you're fighting yourself, the more difficult it is to indulge, the easier it is to resist. You mentioned website blockers, the rule I made for myself, was that everytime I used a website, I would have to block it, meaning searching for material required an increasing amount of work. I eventually reached the point where finding material was more effort than it was worth. And while I could've disabled the blocker at any time, doing so would be admitting that, not only was I a slave to my temptations, but I also lacked the technical ability to find new sources of material. With the theme of setting achievable goals, I don't swear to never indulge again, I always set a time goal. Like two weeks, or six months. Lasting forever is much more difficult than lasting a specific length of time. Right now I'm aiming for 12 months, anything past that is bonus. And if nothing else works? Get rid of the phone, get rid of the computer. When indulging requires spending money on a new device, it's easy to resist. I don't know about anyone else, but I've found my physical and mental health have improved immensely since I've quit. Is it placebo? Maybe, but progress is progress. Don't give up.

>>76213 What's exactly is the issue here? Religion or the time consumption problem? If former, welp, try lenting If latter... ugh-h-h-h... If neither, use your "post-nut clarity" to look at the things in your life from a different perspective... >>100981 Brilliant idea. In my experience, eating food supplements for vegans to treat my lent as a form of veganism helps with the mood.

What is the point of quitting porn, porn is fun, it makes you happy, its free. If anything this is one of few joys of life that is freely and readily available to us, why quit it?

>>101074 If you had an infinite supply of free booze, would you be drunk all the time?

>>101074 Porn is degenerate. It's a lie and is frustrating. It generates an addiction to virtuality and it warps your mind. It doesn't feed us with what we need the most, meaningful and constructive interactions with other living beings. It also preys on your weaknesses and wants only to fill them with synthetic residual satisfactions that like for any drug make you want to take more of it. The surest way to stay clear of it is to fill your life with real activities that make you forget about porn because they fill you with valuable experiences and sensations. Small and medium goals help a lot here, they keep you walking forward and staying active and focused on healthy ideas. Porn comes knocking when you settle in, in an ambivalent state of mind, settled doing nothing useful and not even tired enough to just phase out for a good nap. It's a parasite of your libido that promises a quick fix that you will regret as you acknowledge how vacuous and sour a simile of experience it is. Here's a basic idea. No matter how titillated you are at a given point, especially when having access to a device to expose yourself to pornography, know that any time you will indulge such darker desires, you could be doing something far more productive and healthy. With time, you will learn to reorganize and shift those energies into solid works with concrete foundational value, helping you to move away from that sad and miserable life of solitude. Because in the vast majority of cases, there cannot be porn without loneliness, you shall strive to diminish this isolation. When it proves impossible, at least use that isolation to improve your mental health and wisdom. Whether you must work on a document, repair an engine piece, paint something, sew something else, sort your belongings, look up for information on healthy nutrition and plants, historical events or on music and how to play an instrument. Porn relies on the path of least resistance, thus a form of laziness. A quick lethargic elation for a small price of your soul and mental sanity. It doesn't seem much every time you fall for it but it definitely adds up and takes you to a most terrible place defined by its own form of suffering. And in the end, finding a human to build and share a deep bond with and to add weight to your mutually intimate activities is not just far more rewarding, it's simply the only truly rewarding escape you could and should legitimately relish.

>>101066 >>101129 Good stuff. Thanks for writing this

>>101075 its physically impossible to do it infinitely, a cock will not get an erection for some time after ejaculation, thus there will be a downtime whether you like it or not same with booze, one can force oneself to drink more but body will reject it, vomit and etc you can consume either only as much well you can also watch porn without jerking off, but what is the point? unless some really interesting set of pics or video, but that is rare, at least according to my taste

Havent gooned for a year now, if your motivation is genuine then youll manage

>>76213 I just deleted my entire porn folder a few hours ago. I decided I didn't need to truly understand what held me back, I just had to do it. And I did. For some reason I think this relates with my having recently reviewed GITS SAC 2nd gig. Maybe some other time.

>>101214 You didn't answer the question. If you got booze for free, why wouldn't you be drunk all the time?