I don't like this planet or human life

I have realized that i really don't want to live on this planet, and i dont like human race. I think humans are ugly, live short lives, tend to be very vapid and crude. I see that most people live absolutely miserable and pointless lives by doing 9-5 jobs producing stuff nobody really needs. They spend their lives working on stuff they don't like and sleeping, then they get old, sick and die, its hell. There is nothing interesting going on to, the only thing you can do is stimulate your sense organs with images , sounds like going to a concert. None of that provides any lasting satisfaction or even any significant pleasure...

>>31773 Get a hobby Lain, something outside. Start simple and small and eventually start doing it more frequently. Unplugging and grounding yourself in nature alongside drinking lots of water, good hygiene and getting enough scheduled sleep are the kings of improving your mood. Because as you said, there are people out there that aren't like that. And since you can't control besides your actions and beliefs, you should just accept the things you can't change and focus on the small blessings. t. was depressed so started gardening, camping and got goldfish.

>>31774 this desu, passionate people make the world go round. Make your world better, close the rest. It's just very simple, i keep seeing lainons get stuck in the same empty worldview with no openings for any sort of hope, even if everythings is breaking i feel like the key to it is to do what you can and make yourself feel like your life was worth it.

>>31774 I'm not a kid, i know about depression and what people usually do when they get one. This is not a kind of mood, its a cold observation. I don't want any petty hobby just to hide from reality.

I like this planet very much and what humans do to it brings tears to my eyes. I have no problem humans doing things humans do to others, but they do it also to all other life on earth. Seems to me like humans dont belong here or even are supposed to exist, in my opinion humans are not natural beings. This world has been turned from a paradise to a hell, the saddest part is we could change this, we always could have but humans cling to misery and oppression and still somehow can believe that this is the way to go.

>>31776 you certainly act like a kid. Living isn't about reality.

>>31778 I will just repeat what i said I think humans are ugly, live short lives, tend to be very vapid and crude. I see that most people live absolutely miserable and pointless lives by doing 9-5 jobs producing stuff nobody really needs. They spend their lives working on stuff they don't like and sleeping, then they get old, sick and die, its hell. There is nothing interesting going on to, the only thing you can do is stimulate your sense organs with images , sounds like going to a concert. None of that provides any lasting satisfaction or even any significant pleasure... That is what living is about. Normal human beings see pleasure in pain, beautiful in the ugly, they are utterly perverse and deluded. Like they celebrate birthdays which is just celebrating getting closer to sickness and inevitable death, becoming old, even uglier, frail and sickly. Yet they rise glasses for that, and get drunk on poison dumbing them down even more celebrating it. Its appalling.

>>31779 >humans are ugly, live short lives, tend to be very vapid and crude the inherent mistake is judging people as ugly, you're already falling into lookism delusions. and as to the second part - your fault for surrounding yourself with people as such. >I see most people live absolutely miserable and pointless lives [...] what is "pointless"? why care about others? Live your life and care about yourself and those close to you. Why do you care that brando works at mcdonalds and is in crippling debt? he is not you, unless you are refering to your friends and then again - your fault for surrounding yourself with people as such. Stop focusing on others. do what YOU like. Stimulate your senses with things that make YOU happy. Life is a delusion, your point of view is harmful and even more deluded. Don't be a normal human being, be something better than your imagined averages. You are the one deluded, Lain. >Like they celebrate birthdays which is just celebrating getting closer to sickness and inevitable death, becoming old, even uglier, frail and sickly. >Yet they rise glasses for that, and get drunk on poison dumbing them down even more celebrating it. >Its appalling. You are surprised you are getting called a kid when you say things like that. You really sound like a kid and probably are. Why care about others? You are you. You can't fix the world Lain. It's healthier to accept it for what it is and realize you are the creator.

>>31780 You say accept for what it is but you are clearly not seeing it for what it is, when you get older and maybe on your death bed you might take a retrospective look and reconsider. I'm always doing Me, and im totally and utterly out of the system, there is little to nothing but a kind of body i share with the rest of the human population. I'm not saying any of this because of depression, im being real - more real than its possible when you are in the system, seeing ugly as beautiful, pain as pleasure and all the other perverted delusions almost everyone has. Nobody makes a hit movie with average looking people, nobody makes a movie about some regular joes (existing in the billions) boring and petty life. I'm dead certain movie about your average day would not be a huge hit, i think i would probably die of boredom watching it.

>>31780 One more thing i want to add about 'stimulating your senses'. The reality is that that stimulation of the senses is something fleeting, vaguely pleasurable and ultimately dissatisfactory. You experience much more pain and distress trying to constantly stimulate your senses than you experience any pleasure on the behalf of that. Yet you miss that.

>>31776 You can observe, but you're obviously letting external things get to you a lot. Self-actualization is a constant process, it just so happens that only focusing on things you can control is both logical and a recipe for happiness. Bonus points when coupled with good hobbies and positive habits. If you're afflicted by the eternal you don't control, then it's your master and you should overcome it by focusing on what's logical. That or keep struggling forever against what you have no power over. You only control your actions and beliefs, so focusing on that is the wisest course of action imo.

>>31785 I don't see anything as 'external' im the wired, its all in my head I'm also not struggling with anything, its funny that when you mention the actual realities of life which everyone tends to ignore people start to think that one is depressed, well im not, it just is what it is and its not pretty, not anything to delight in

>>31787 I'm defining 'external' as "what (you) do not entirely control". >weather, health, other people, media, etc. I define 'internal' as "what (you) do entirely control". >actions (e.g. exercise), beliefs So yeah, in the context of what I'm talking about there is an external world outside of you and the internal things you actually have power over. Whether you care enough to think about it or not is up to you. Regardless of what you decide upon in the years to come, good luck Lain.

>>31790 There is no kind of power you have, what is going on internally is impersonal, mechanistic process without any agent to do something. Everything just happens in accordance with conditions, its like a machine.

>>31787 I can relate somewhat, as much as such a thing can be relatable to. If you are trapped in your own reality you should find a way to hack it, we all should and im not being sarcastic. You have these powers, all of us do without knowing, we just have to learn to use them. This machine can be manipulated and you can with your reaction chose on how. It sounds hard to believe but im positive this is true.

>>31792 I'm into hacking 'the machine' for quite some time already, i have some pretty interesting results and experiences. I would not say that i'm trapped anywhere tho, the machine just thinks of an agent because natural consequences of how we start to view the world as organisms in environment, but it has no real fixed identity and the machine itself is not an entity, its an activity that is going on. To really get into the hacking you need to meditate and work on it constantly. I don't mean to meditate like the fools do these days, that is all misinterpreted and fake, but there are some positive methods one can find in old buddhist texts or discover for himself. But for average human that kind of thing would be way to alien and hardcore. Those altered states of the machine a psychologist would classify as psychosis ("Psychosis is a condition that ->affects the way your brain processes information<-. It causes you to lose touch with reality.)" just in this case it would a kind of deliberate and thought out altered state. In the old days they did much of that kind of stuff, these days all that stuff is forgotten, everything is mistranslated and misinterpreted or treated as fairy tale. I would talk about it but there is hard to find anyone fit enough to actually follow it through not just talk about it so its kind of pointless. Come to the wired soon.

>>31791 how reductive! Why can it not be that you are both a lump of atoms *and* an agent who makes choices? Would you say that a computer that calculates primes is not actually calculating primes, it is merely following a mechanistic process and no meaning can be extracted from its output? You cling to a model of reality that is insufficiently abstract to properly reckon with it, and then you wonder why you are depressed.

>>31795 Where is the you there? Its just a word you are saying haha

>>31790 Aren't these external and internal worlds interconnected? If so, then one should be able to extend their internal world as to influence the external. Any group is just a bunch of individuals, if one can change individually then the group can change too. >>31777 Theoretically Lain could change the world, but what exactly is there to change? A magnitude of vaguely defined issues, no simple solutions, no guidelines on what action to take. In a broad perspective - humanity is miserable. I don't know how else we could fix this if not by ourselves. Then again, I don't know how to brew the antidote either. Help me out, Lain

>>31781 You are alive and you do not know what will happen after you die. Why, if you're given an opportunity that lasts around 80 years, aren't you using it? Of course you'll look at your life when you're dying and say "well i didn't live the way i wanted to live" because you haven't lived, you were so displeased by everything around you, by reality, people, the ways things are. Sure, people would say (and probably have said to you) stuff like "you should try to..." and you've tried and failed. Moreover, I'm sure you've tried and failed multiple times. However it is never good to stop trying. Do you really think, just ask yourself for a moment, that so much people don't know about how harsh reality is? No. Sure, they may be dumbasses, not worthy, whatever you want to consider them to be. But one way or the other, they've learned the reality earlier than you and now are using it in their own interest. Lain, you should know that what you feel is natural for people to feel. Life isn't roses. It always wasn't great, it isn't great and won't be great, ever. The question stands: Will you try to take the most out of the world, try yourself in different stuff, experience the life? Do the right thing.

>>31804 different Zero Cool than before

>>31804 What you just said is totally off-topic, you have not understood the topic here, im not willing to talk to you as you are unable to devote yourself enough to understand the 'issue' here, you have just skimped over what i have said and give me some generic life advice or something that has nothing to do with what im talking about in reality

>>31798 >Theoretically Lain could change the world, but what exactly is there to change? A magnitude of vaguely defined issues, no simple solutions, no guidelines on what action to take. In a broad perspective - humanity is miserable. I don't know how else we could fix this if not by ourselves. Then again, I don't know how to brew the antidote either. Help me out, Lain Not just theoretically, but you nailed it down yourself, specifics. I dont know how to help you or what answers to give, if i had those answers i wouldnt just turn thumbs but make it known. Ive been studying occult and fringe science stuff for years now and it confused me more, i learned a lot but what i learned most is how much i have to learn. I could and probably will devote this lifetime and some future lifes, if i didnt spend a few past lifes on this quest already, but i feel tired yet restless. I dont think there is an easy way out of this, we just have to keep searching and trying and see what sticks. There are answers out there, some people have found them and formulated them, we need to understand them. Something out there is calling us, something in this matrix is happening, im sure you can feel it too. I dont know what it is or where it comes from, but i do know there is a great destiny that needs to be fulfilled. I have been thinking a bit about this recently, what ran through my mind is we are missing something important, either we cant see it or it wont revile itself to us, either we need find or do or become something, perhaps a leap of faith needs to be taken.

>>31785 This pyramid is completely inverted for me, unless the things at the bottom of the pyramid are of lowest importance. I don't care if I can't eat every day, I want self-actualization. I want to mean something.

>>31798 >Aren't these external and internal worlds interconnected? In a way. You can only completely control actions and beliefs. The external world can be influenced, so using your beliefs as a model for 'how' to act - you then act upon the external to 'try' and bring about a result you want. Normally this approach to life is coupled with a personal philosophy of life that outlines your morals/beliefs and how you should act. So you basically learn to derive most (if not all) enjoyment and fulfillment from the internal (self-actualization). Meaning that even though you're influencing the external world, your internal beliefs and actions are all that really matters. Coupled with internalized practices of gratitude to the people/things in your life and acceptance that they will turn to dust (accepting what you can't control). Life becomes more fulfilling and less stressful. That's how I choose to live anyway, tranquility and fulfillment over hedonism. This approach to life might not work for everyone.

>>31813 you need basic necessities to mean something. Go a few days without food and see if you still think food isn't as important as self actualization.

>>31813 It's more of just a general framework most people can apply. For most people, having basic needs covered and not living in a dangerous environment/situation takes priority over self-actualization. But it's as you said, there's exceptions. There's been plenty of spiritual leaders who found self-actualization in horrible living conditions - so it's more of just the general building blocks that might help you. There's a couple revised versions, but they're much more complicated and have their own issues - Maslow's is good for what it is imo.

>>31822 Worth considering depression and other similar issues can mess with someone's ability to feel hunger, to the point they might need to force themselves to eat enough. Others might overeat instead.

>>31777 >This world has been turned from a paradise to a hell Earth has never been a paradise. Nature as a whole is more cruel, twisted, miserable and oppressive than anything the human mind may come up with. As I see it, nature is a beast that must be tamed and exploited if one wants to see at least some semblance of comfort, stability, leisure and more. Just spare the good parts, like drinking water and breathable air, even though it's a tricky thing to do, considering that nature is akin to a Jenga tower.

>>31782 only you make it dissfactionary for yourself. Theres more to this than you think -- overthinking it won't help you. You'll die alone and you'll rot. Fleeting reality innit? Pleasure is fleeting, life is a struggle for it. Nothing more, nothing less. Realize you are speaking soykaf, there's nothing valuable, nothing of input in what you say. I was giving you advice yet you can't read it because you're very much stuck up in watching others, being bothered by others, caring about average and extraordinaire. Boredom is subjective, unless you want to die working your life off do something, risk it and make a decision. The choice in the end is yours, deciding to complain instead of doing something is what makes you boring, no one likes to hear complaining about things all the time and trust me i am guilty of it, all the time and everyday i fight myself to shut up and live on and not think about others, i try to avoid people and i live in my own social void, it is as simple as that, i don't use social media websites, i don't interact with nobodies and unknowns. I have my business to take care of and better things to do than get sad and empathetic for worthless empty no triers. You are one of them, but you are self-aware enough to complain about them yet you keep being one of them, i am not trying to lead you to be a normalnigger, i am trying to tell you how to fix yourself and live in a fleeting happiness that everybody searches for. There's very likely no afterlife, if there is i am searching for it and someday maybe ill find it. >Nobody makes a movie about some average regular *cough, cough* Gummo... >>31787 god shut up an fuarrrk off you have nothing, you are a soykafty edgy kid and nothing more. >>31793 i hate posers like you, there's nothing more to this thread than b8. move on and live empty like you do.

>>31834 I disagree totally, everything has worked fine and in harmony before mans systematic destruction of everything and putting in its egoistic intellectual fallacies. Human beings are a disease that infect everything, arguably whatever produced it might be attributed back to nature and therefore nature broke itself, but i would argue humans are an anomaly that should not exist. Humanity is a broken parasitic species of misshapen primates. Their uncontrolled ego driven obsessions serve nothing but to destroy everything that there is, even in intellectual space. No natural curlty is comparable to the diseased state of being that we have constructed, eaten by maggots alive is preferable than wageslaving or any other of the bullshit that we have today. Id say mans mistake is hanging on to a state of living that should never be and by trying to avoid the inevitable keeps only making things worse for all involved. I suppose if you prefer toxic and overpopulated environments where all you do is stare at screens to get some sort of state of mind just to not tolerate the idleness of a natural state then sure keep living in this, because its only gonna get worse and worse as we see it right now.

>>31840 >I disagree totally, everything has worked fine and in harmony Not the lainon you were talking to but you have an idea of Nature that is plain wrong. There is no place for harmony in this universe as it's entirely built on imbalance. The Big Bang happened as a result of instability. I've seen a baboon eat a gazelle calf alive, casually holding it down and eating its leg off while this helpless thing screamed its lungs off. The baboon could've killed it. It didn't, because it didn't care since he could eat it just fine without killing it. Cruelty, pain, destruction, misery, injustice are things that Nature has absolutely no concern for. Nature cares nothing for the tens of billions of animals we torture in factory farms. It cares nothing for atomic bombs, Chernobyl, Auschwitz, serial killers or pedophiles. It cares nothing about starving African children, authoritarian governments or pollution or the extinction of tigers. The universe cares so little that complex organisms don't even have a reliable sensory switch that turns off pain once you know there will be a horrible, inevitable death starting right now. Nature cares nothing for this function and has made no effort to make it happen unless you're not oxygenating properly or misfiring in a way that puts the health of your system at risk. As long as everything is working properly while you're being eaten alive, it matters absolutely nothing to this universe how painfully you'll die, because feeling no excruciating pain during those 5 minutes or 20 minutes or 3 hours or 10 hours might lessen your chances of survival by 0.000000001%. This world is Hell. We made it worse somehow, but it has always been nothing but Hell. And what really makes this Hell is that all this horrible stuff, the baboon, the gazelle, human beings, the star that will one day incinerate us, the trillions of galaxies all bearing their own baboons and gazelles and forests and people, all of this is so effortlessly beautiful and perfect thanks to the very cold brutality and cruelty that unmake it.

>>31773 >>31813 It sounds like you tapped into some kind of emptiness. Take a look at Buddhism, there are many similarities between your thoughts and the teaching of the Buddha. It's very systematic and "easy" to follow if you're serious about it. At least it should provide self-realization that's worth striving for. Here are some links to get you started, so that you can investigate it for yourself: Concepts that are worth taking a look at, especially for you: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Skandha https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Avidyā_(Buddhism) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Taṇhā https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Four_Noble_Truths https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Saṃsāra_(Buddhism) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Saṅkhāra https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pratītyasamutpāda#Twelve_Nidanas Resources to get you started: https://www.dhammatalks.org/books/BuddhasTeachings/Section0000.html https://www.dhammatalks.org/books/Refuge/Contents.html https://www.accesstoinsight.org/ptf/dhamma/index.html https://www.accesstoinsight.org/ptf/buddha.html https://www.dhammatalks.org/books/NobleWarrior/Contents.html https://www.dhammatalks.org/books/KeepingTheBreath/Section0000.html https://www.dhammatalks.org/books/WithEachAndEveryBreath/Contents.html If you're interested in meditative practices also take a look at the Yoga Sutras of Patanjali. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yoga_Sutras_of_Patanjali They're not related to Buddhism at all though, but they could be interesting and prove to be useful. (There are a lot of resources and interpretations on them, I'd suggest to look at them by yourself, to learn what to avoid. Especially avoid modern new age interpretations.) A good resource to start (particularly suited for beginners) is: https://www.swamij.com/yoga-sutras.htm If you (or anyone else) have any questions about Buddhism, just ask I'll try to compose a more extensive reply later.

>>31822 >Go a few days without food and see if you still think food isn't as important as self actualization. Not that lainon, but food isn't as important as self actualization. I've often ignored hunger to continue to work on an engrossing project, or as you suggested avoid having food for a few days. Eating is a base activity and is a chore akin to filling the trough of a pig. I only do it now to avoid the distraction caused by hunger not because of a desire to eat.

>>31843 P.S. OP is correct. What people call "depression" is actually "awake enough to realize how sh1t it all is and not need to sugar-coat reality".

>>31844 Well said And what they suggest is basically distract yourself from and ignore that reality ''find a hobby' Ridiculous. Its hard to find anyone proficient for this kind of discussion so I don't really expect anything else but a lot of petty advice like 'go outside more' 'find a hobby' like that changes something. I wasn't asking for any help, the situation can't be helped, the only help would be something like Buddhism but i know for certain that what they call Buddhism these days and how they translate and interpret those things is very far from what the thing was originally. Everything is grossly mistranslated (the original texts are in dead Language and most important terms don't have any English word to translate to) and misinterpreted, polluted by various cultural additions and traditions.

>>31832 >Worth considering depression and other similar issues can mess with someone's ability to feel hunger, to the point they might need to force themselves to eat enough. indeed, I have been there. But the point is that without having food, as in enough to stay alive, it is impossible to be "self-actualized", because you die. Those who imagine that their "self-actualization" will come from suicide are incorrect, they will simply be dead. >>31843 >Eating is a base activity and is a chore akin to filling the trough of a pig. I only do it now to avoid the distraction caused by hunger not because of a desire to eat. and if you don't do it you will become unable to do other things, correct? That's what is meant by it being important.

>>31841 this is just "why does God let bad things happen?" but in atheist language. my guy, you have to realize, that notions of 'good' and 'bad' are made up by humans, humans who only very dimly understand how life works outside their human bubble. You said you saw a babboon eating a live deer... well I've seen a Coyote decide I wasn't a threat and ignore me as it wandered around looking for trash. Was that good or bad? It was neither, it was simply the way the world works. Large predators brutally killing large prey jumps out at us because they feel relevant to us but more than 99% of all interactions in the wild are the kind of boring non-events that humans don't (emotionally) care about, and it is not hard to find evidence that many animals will sometimes help other animals, even those of a different species. Basically: the world is not a particularly cruel place, sure it is not particularly just either but overall it just is what it is. The harmony of the world cannot be appreciated through the lens of such human contrivances. also >There is no place for harmony in this universe as it's entirely built on imbalance. highly odd statement. What does "imbalance" mean? Like the universe is constantly leaking energy and

>>31847 For what it's worth (not much for an anonymous comment on a random imageboard in the ether) - I empathize (which is rare for me, but whatever). You clean the glass and look through it, and everyone tells you to put mud back on it and stop discussing 'conspiracies' like mythical cleaning cloths. >>31848 > (eathing) if you don't do it you will become unable to do other things, correct? I think you are talking about starvation rather than hunger. Starvation will affect the brain and ability to reason to the point where other humans look like a walking meat meal. >>31822 >a few days without food is substantially different from >>31848 >(eating)if you don't do it you will become unable to do other things The first is merely hunger, the latter is starvation.

>>31847 Go outside more Find a hobby Jokes aside, while it is true buddhism is not what it was when it started, there are many assumptions in what you said which I think are unsustained >buddhism can alleviate the pointlesness of human existence How can it be so? It's an inherently human activity and you're pretty much accepting that an arbitrary activity of reading books and sitting still is somehow different from some other hobby >buddhism being different from it's origin means it's lost it's value Buddhism came about as a reaction to the happenings in the culture of a subcontinent halfway across the world, 3000 years ago. It has to be adapted to our reality if it is to be useful in any way. That's kind of what irritates me of the hare krsna bunch, their ideas are all outdated, their actions all try to emulate what was a necessary behaviour in another reality altogether. Hell, you see this in christians today the world over. >Can't access their original literature Just because it's written in a language that's out of use, doesn't mean you cannot learn it. In fact, it's one of the more enjoyable things to do, added pleasure because of it's antiquity and rarity. I like learning ancient languages, in part because it doesn't imply the interaction with other humans as other languages do. I would like to learn sanskrit someday and read the mahabharata, actually. I know the last one sounds like a hobby, it is, but it goes in line with assumption #1; I'll go on and say I actually consider that most of those who follow some religion are larping (pardon the term), and the only true way to claim you actually mean it is to actually study it through, including learning the language and reading the original literature. Krsna followers, for example, like to think they're into the ultimate religion, but they take their information from the comparably scant literature that's available in english, which is, as you said, translated (inherently lossy), and moreover is but the experience of the one guy who did the traslation and commentary. Valuable? sure, but not comprehensive. People now go on imposing absurd little rules of behaviour like not eating onions because their teacher (himself often another guy not too unlike them) said so. I talked about the krsna bunch because those I've known, but it applies to buddhists as well ofc. Excuse the digression, my point is .... go outside more; find a hobby; just be yourself bruh Present Day, Present Time! AHAHAHAHAHA!

>>31854 so the tl;dr version is "live in the now!" Same as the mindfulness, meditation, Buddhism,... No matter how "mindful" you while playing your Xyears long game of blackjack - all games in the casino are rigged and the house always wins.

>>31855 >so the tl;dr version is "live in the now!" Holy cow you actually just read the first and last sentence.

>>31840 >I disagree totally, everything has worked fine and in harmony before mans systematic destruction of everything and putting in its egoistic intellectual fallacies. Balance of nature isn't exactly a thing. Earth's ecosystems are in a constant dynamic state, and they're driven by changes that can be best described as just "chaotic". Animal populations ebb and flow, sometimes rapidly so, species become invasive, terminate others and go exinct themselves, always have, without any human intervention. Not to mention the many changes in the environment and climate that have taken place, and long before us, too. >Human beings are a disease that infects everything, arguably whatever produced it might be attributed back to nature and therefore nature broke itself, but i would argue humans are an anomaly that should not exist. Humans still exist, not only that, they spread and proliferate. We haven't "broken nature". It would take a considerable and deliberate effort for us to completely "break it", or even make ourselves go extinct. >Humanity is a broken parasitic species of misshapen primates. I find it funny how you extol the virtues of nature and bash the depravity and corruptness of humanity, comparing them to parasites and disease, which are all found and are widespread in nature. Plus, saying that humans are a "broken species" or are "unnatural" won't ultimately make us not be a part of nature. In fact, the things that you may find detestable about humanity and its constructs are, at their core, dictated by nature. >No natural cruelty is comparable to the diseased state of being that we have constructed, eaten by maggots alive is preferable than wageslaving or any other of the bullshit that we have today. That's just, like, your opinion, man. >I'd say man's mistake is hanging on to a state of living that should never be and by trying to avoid the inevitable keeps only making things worse for all involved. We've been clinging on to a state of living (or the idea of living) that should never be for pretty much all of our existence as a species. So far it's been working fairly well. >I suppose if you prefer toxic and overpopulated environments where all you do is stare at screens to get some sort of state of mind just to not tolerate the idleness of a natural state then sure keep living in this, because its only gonna get worse and worse as we see it right now. The first half you've described can be meliorated by interacting with the society we've created. Unlike nature, it can be changed. Cultivate values you find beneficial and worthwhile in yourself and others, study urban planning and architecture to improve the situation in overpopulated regions, study politics and economics to liberate people from wageslavery, draw attention to the current maladies of society and work with others to fix them. Not sure about that idleness of a natural state you're talking about. Are you implying people's lives were more carefree back when we were hunter-gatherers?

>>31847 >the only help would be something like Buddhism but i know for certain that what they call Buddhism these days and how they translate and interpret those things is very far from what the thing was originally. Everything is grossly mistranslated (the original texts are in dead Language and most important terms don't have any English word to translate to) and misinterpreted, polluted by various cultural additions and traditions. Literally look at >>31842 specifically the writings of Thanissaro Bhikkhu. He's a very orthodox monk and teaches pretty much exclusively from the Pali Canon, if something is in conflict with it he usually goes with the scriptures. If you're uncertain just look at the original scriptures: (https://www.accesstoinsight.org/tipitaka/index.html). They're not too difficult to understand IMHO opinion. You're right that often terms get misinterpreted, and misunderstood by practitioners. But if you look at the suttas themselves often the Buddha himself defines the terms, so you have a clear working definition of most things in the suttas themselves. For example when someone would ask "What is suffering (dukkha)?" They could go through the suttas and discover: >"Birth is dukkha, aging is dukkha, death is dukkha; sorrow, lamentation, pain, grief, & despair are dukkha; association with the unbeloved is dukkha; separation from the loved is dukkha; not getting what is wanted is dukkha. In short, the five clinging-aggregates are dukkha." — SN 56.11 Or if one wants to know what ardency means >“And how is one ardent? There is the case where a monk, (thinking,) ‘Unarisen evil, unskillful qualities arising in me would lead to what is unbeneficial,’ arouses ardency. (Thinking,) ‘Arisen evil, unskillful qualities not being abandoned in me…’ … ‘Unarisen skillful qualities not arising in me …’ … ‘Arisen skillful qualities ceasing in me would lead to what is unbeneficial,’ he arouses ardency. This is how one is ardent. — SN 16:2 (Or look at below to see the same principle with mindfulness) >>31855 "Living in the now" is not what mindfulness means, nor is it "being present." It's not bare awareness. (I'm not implying you implied that, I'm just here trying to clarify a common misconception.) It's more like keeping something in mind. >“And which is the faculty of sati? There is the case where a disciple of the noble ones has sati, is endowed with excellent proficiency in sati, remembering & recollecting what was done and said a long time ago. He remains focused on the body in & of itself—ardent, alert, & having sati—subduing greed & distress with reference to the world. He remains focused on feelings in & of themselves… the mind in & of itself… mental qualities in & of themselves—ardent, alert, & having sati—subduing greed & distress with reference to the world. This is called the faculty of sati.” — SN 48:10 >“Right view is the forerunner. And how is right view the forerunner? One discerns wrong resolve as wrong resolve, and right resolve as right resolve: This is one’s right view.… One makes an effort for the abandoning of wrong resolve & for entering into right resolve: This is one’s right effort. One is mindful to abandon wrong resolve & to enter & remain in right resolve: This is one’s right mindfulness. Thus these three qualities—right view, right effort, & right mindfulness—run & circle around right resolve.” — MN 117 >“This holy life is lived… with mindfulness as its governing principle.… And how is mindfulness the governing principle? The mindfulness that ‘I will make complete any training with regard to good conduct that is not yet complete, or I will protect with discernment any training with regard to good conduct that is complete’ is well-established right within. The mindfulness that ‘I will make complete any training with regard to the basics of the holy life that is not yet complete, or I will protect with discernment any training with regard to the basics of the holy life that is complete’ is well-established right within. The mindfulness that ‘I will scrutinize with discernment any Dhamma that is not yet scrutinized, or I will protect with discernment any Dhamma that has been scrutinized’ is well-established right within. The mindfulness that ‘I will touch through release any Dhamma that is not yet touched, or I will protect with discernment any Dhamma that has been touched’ is well-established right within. >“This is how mindfulness is the governing principle.” — AN 4:245 >“Now suppose that there is a wise, experienced, skillful cook who has presented a king or a king’s minister with various kinds of curry: mainly sour, mainly bitter, mainly peppery, mainly sweet, alkaline or non-alkaline, salty or non-salty. He picks up on the theme [nimitta, sign, signal] of his master, thinking, ‘Today my master likes this curry, or he reaches out for that curry, or he takes a lot of this curry, or he praises that curry. Today my master likes mainly sour curry.… Today my master likes mainly bitter curry… mainly peppery curry… mainly sweet curry… alkaline curry… non-alkaline curry… salty curry… Today my master likes non-salty curry, or he reaches out for non-salty curry, or he takes a lot of non-salty curry, or he praises non-salty curry.’ As a result, he is rewarded with clothing, wages, & gifts. Why is that? Because the wise, experienced, skillful cook picks up on the theme of his own master. >“In the same way, there is the case where a wise, experienced, skillful monk remains focused on the body in & of itself… feelings in & of themselves… the mind in & of itself… mental qualities in & of themselves—ardent, alert, & mindful—subduing greed & distress with reference to the world. As he remains thus focused on mental qualities in & of themselves, his mind becomes concentrated, his defilements are abandoned. He picks up on that theme. As a result, he is rewarded with a pleasant abiding here-&-now, together with mindfulness & alertness. Why is that? Because the wise, experienced, skillful monk picks up on the theme of his own mind.” — SN 47:8 >“Just as a royal frontier fortress has a gatekeeper—wise, experienced, intelligent—to keep out those he doesn’t know and to let in those he does, for the protection of those within, and to ward off those without; in the same way, a disciple of the noble ones is mindful, endowed with excellent proficiency in mindfulness, remembering & recollecting what was done and said a long time ago. With mindfulness as his gatekeeper, the disciple of the noble ones abandons what is unskillful, develops what is skillful, abandons what is blameworthy, develops what is blameless, and looks after himself with purity.” — AN 7:63

>>31844 >>31847 Hi. I spent time in and out of a mental hospital for suicide attempts since I was 9 years old until my mid 20's. While I felt just in my depression, in the first week the doctors determined it was basically due to some extreme empathy and instead of telling me the real way to fix my problems they force fed me a cornucopia of pills... Look my point of sharing that is that I realize the world is like kicking dead whales down the beach. You need to learn to get over it. Self improvement will give you a little self worth, being physically healthy will help your mental wellbeing, etc. The only reason you think otherwise is because of propaganda and the depression itself. "Hah. You mean to tell me that moving my legs and arms a little is going to just fix it?" - Yes. It is. Why? Because of the chemicals that your brain produces when you are engaging in physical fitness. For some stupid reason, people seem to think that "oh just work out and my depression will go away?" No, it won't - But it makes things easier and this starts a feedback loop of feeling better. I just wanted to let you know that I don't particularly care if someone is or isn't strong enough to pull themselves out and I am pro-suicide. However, I am not pro-ignorance and what you are saying is willfully ignorant.

>>31860 And when I mention the "real way to fix my problems" - Mine specifically were to just help people and do things that help push society towards a less soykafty direction.,

>>31859 >>31842 Don't suggest anyone wikipedia articles or any existing translations of the Pali suttas as a place to gain understanding about Buddhism as it actually was originally intended by the Buddha. All those suttas and articles are GROSSLY, TERRIBLY mistranslated and are full of misinterpretations and each authors own misleading takes on it. It does not covey the original meaning at all beyond some vague feel and that won't and have not helped anyone. Its faux dharma, all of it. Sadly nobody realizes this, well now you know. The problem actually starts at the Pali-English dictionary and the long story short is that the dictionary is imprecise and misleading in crucial parts so what can you expect of the translations and commentaries which then use that to 'explain' what its all about. Its all a huge farce. Real Buddhism has not existed for good two thousand years. If you want to really understand you are faced with a menial and incredibly hard task of decrypting the original texts while not even having any good dictionary. You would have to understand the topics at a deep level, you would have to look into Sanskrit and other languages that share similarities with Pali to get some clues and many other things. You basically need to understand it before you can give any reasonable translation, but you can't understand it because you have nothing to look for that understanding as there are no good translations available at all. So its INCREDIBLY difficult task. When you are sending people to read existing translations or commentaries or to some living teachers all you are doing is giving them false hope and really you are misleading them. None of them are preaching the real Dharma that Buddha proclaimed more than two thousand years ago. If you are a Buddhist or aspire for enlightenment you are incredibly lucky that you get to read this message, because pretty much nobody gets to hear about this and just naively pursue the polluted Dharma and fruitlessly waste all their lives trying to get to the bottom of it. Now at least you know.

>>31862 >Don't suggest anyone wikipedia articles or any existing translations of the Pali suttas as a place to gain understanding about Buddhism as it actually was originally intended by the Buddha. All those suttas and articles are GROSSLY, TERRIBLY mistranslated and are full of misinterpretations and each authors own misleading takes on it. It does not covey the original meaning at all beyond some vague feel and that won't and have not helped anyone. Its faux dharma, all of it. You just make claims without showing any evidence of it. So far you've shown zero instances of a "grossly terribly mistranslated" sutta. If you want to be taken seriously, provide evidence. I'm OK with accepting that the Wikipedia articles aren't perfectly reliable, but the translations of the Pali Canon itself? >If you want to really understand you are faced with a menial and incredibly hard task of decrypting the original texts while not even having any good dictionary. You would have to understand the topics at a deep level, you would have to look into Sanskrit and other languages that share similarities with Pali to get some clues and many other things. You basically need to understand it before you can give any reasonable translation, but you can't understand it because you have nothing to look for that understanding as there are no good translations available at all. So its INCREDIBLY difficult task. It's not, you're overstating the difficultly. People also learn a lot by practicing. Just like when someone would always play the flute, they would be able to understand the nuances of texts about flutes. Because they have experience of it. While it's true that some terms can be more difficult to translate, the dhamma has a pretty intuitive and simple principles behind it. And how do you personally know that all translations are unreliable? You'd need to have a lot of knowledge of Pali itself to make that claim. >When you are sending people to read existing translations or commentaries or to some living teachers all you are doing is giving them false hope and really you are misleading them. None of them are preaching the real Dharma that Buddha proclaimed more than two thousand years ago. How can you know this? To know what the dhamma looked at the time of the Buddha you'd need to have been alive at that time. But because you're not, you can't know what true dhamma would look like. Hence you can not know if there's anybody teaching true dhamma nowadays. Even if nobody would be teaching the original dhamma, some are probably pretty close to the original meaning of the dhamma.

>>31863 I understand that you could only take this on faith but I have done the incredible task and have for myself restored and understood the dharma as it was originally taught, at least to an extent significant enough for it to be incomparably better and fruitful teaching than anything that goes around these days. >> provide evidence I rarely ever teach laypersons and I dont teach people who show disrespect or are faithless. I also don't teach for the sake of 'being right' or proving that im right or for sake of arguing which would be the case if i were to provide you 'evidences'. I dont teach for evidences, only when you have some respect, faith and longing to be deliverated from dissatisfaction you can come and ask me a real question.

>Buddhism I was getting really into it, but I figured out that unless you are a monk you're doomed to playing a token part while living a lifestyle that is built on literally the opposite of what you might want to do to follow the Dharma. This society is literally a pyramid of outsourcing. As it is right now in this world the MORE you are responsible for negative karma (indirectly) the LESS you are (directly) responsible for negative karma. All the blood is in the hands of the guy in the slaughterhouse, technically Buddhist monks can eat meat (as taught by Buddha) if "the animal was not killed for them". Right now nobody kills their animals. Nobody has slaves. It's all outsourced somewhere else far removed, so who is causing bad karma? Unless you consider all the indirect butterfly effect stuff, it's all bollocks. And in any case you're knee deep into it. If you are a monk, instead, you are dependent - by choice - on this society that is sustained by literally the opposite of what they might want to do to follow the Dharma. So you are dependent on an ever-increasing entropic spiral that goes nowhere. Unless someone wants to illuminate me beyond platitudes like "go vegan" when going vegan just means buying a 6$ fake meat patty by the same company that makes the 2$ meat patty, or "do things for the environment" when everything "conscious" is just a commercial venture to prey on people or literal fashion since some 60% of people who claim to be vegetarian are actually NOT... how am I supposed to take any of this seriously?

>>31874 Well karma is emotionally fueled action with body speech or mind, any slightest action that is motivated by any emotion is a karma that will bear some fruit. So if you murder something because hate that is one thing. You could get a birth with a body that is sickly or lives for a short while because that. Another thing is buying a piece of meat in the store because youre hungry. Now the important part is how you are thinking of the whole situation. If you are just thinking ''im hungry, let me eat this piece of meat to get rid of hunger'' that is one thing you are doing mentally, another thing would be to think ''im eating this meat and by this im participating in a scheme where animals get murdered because of me'' even while the bodily part - eating the meat is the same, the mental aspect is different so two different people thinking about the whole situation in two different ways would get two different results. It also only counts where you actually do the thinking, it does not matter what kind of view you hold in back of your head, what matters is what is actually going on in your head each time when you go in that store and buy that meat. If one time you think you are participating in murder scheme and other times you just think about your hunger then you will get a mix of karma of little bit of murder scheme karma and part of just trying to eat karma. So the real advice is this - if you think badly about yourself each time you are buying a piece of meat then definitely don't do it. If you just treat it as eating and curing your hunger then that is a different story.

>>31874 >This society is literally a pyramid of outsourcing. As it is right now in this world the MORE you are responsible for negative karma (indirectly) the LESS you are (directly) responsible for negative karma. All the blood is in the hands of the guy in the slaughterhouse, technically Buddhist monks can eat meat (as taught by Buddha) if "the animal was not killed for them". Right now nobody kills their animals. Nobody has slaves. It's all outsourced somewhere else far removed, so who is causing bad karma? Karma isn't a binary concept, and allows for a spectrum of values. What I mean with that is that there are different kinds of karma that would be called negative, that are created by different actions, which likewise also have a different negative result. Let's first look at what the Buddha said and how he viewed karma: >"'I am the owner of my actions (kamma), heir to my actions, born of my actions, related through my actions, and have my actions as my arbitrator. Whatever I do, for good or for evil, to that will I fall heir'... So, people in our society have different intentions when they do support (directly or indirectly) the slaughter of animals. For example the people who do not care, they would cultivate carelessness, that the intention. Their intention is not caring about it. And that's also a kind of negative karma. But that doesn't mean you need to try to change the world. More specifically you could think something more along these lines: "If there's a real opportunity then I'll try to change the bad treatment of animals." That would bring a different karmic result than pure negligence as in the first group, and it leans likely more to a neutral or positive result even. Now the people who slaughter animals because that's their job have a different karmic result, and their intention is killing. Killing the animals. The group who supports all this and keeps this going in our society has again a different result, their intention is greed and profit, not caring about the people. You see where I'm going with this? Karmic effects are like a mirror of how you acted yourself. If you're born in a bad situation, try to make the best out of it, by simply trying to help the people you realistically can help, and let the people who you can't help be. They have their own life to work out (just like animals). >[The Buddha:] "What do you think, Rahula: What is a mirror for?" >[Rahula:] "For reflection, sir." >[The Buddha:] "In the same way, Rahula, bodily acts, verbal acts, and mental acts are to be done with repeated reflection. >"Whenever you want to perform a bodily act, you should reflect on it: 'This bodily act I want to perform — would it lead to self-affliction, to the affliction of others, or to both? Is it an unskillful bodily act, with painful consequences, painful results?' If, on reflection, you know that it would lead to self-affliction, to the affliction of others, or to both; it would be an unskillful bodily act with painful consequences, painful results, then any bodily act of that sort is absolutely unfit for you to do. But if on reflection you know that it would not cause affliction... it would be a skillful bodily action with happy consequences, happy results, then any bodily act of that sort is fit for you to do. >"While you are performing a bodily act, you should reflect on it: 'This bodily act I am doing — is it leading to self-affliction, to the affliction of others, or to both? Is it an unskillful bodily act, with painful consequences, painful results?' If, on reflection, you know that it is leading to self-affliction, to affliction of others, or both... you should give it up. But if on reflection you know that it is not... you may continue with it. >"Having performed a bodily act, you should reflect on it... If, on reflection, you know that it led to self-affliction, to the affliction of others, or to both; it was an unskillful bodily act with painful consequences, painful results, then you should confess it, reveal it, lay it open to the Teacher or to a knowledgeable companion in the holy life. Having confessed it... you should exercise restraint in the future. But if on reflection you know that it did not lead to affliction... it was a skillful bodily action with happy consequences, happy results, then you should stay mentally refreshed and joyful, training day and night in skillful mental qualities. >...[similarly for verbal and mental acts]... >"Rahula, all the brahmans and contemplatives in the course of the past who purified their bodily acts, verbal acts, and mental acts, did it through repeated reflection on their bodily acts, verbal acts, and mental acts in just this way. >"All the brahmans and contemplatives in the course of the future... All the brahmans and contemplatives at present who purify their bodily acts, verbal acts, and mental acts, do it through repeated reflection on their bodily acts, verbal acts, and mental acts in just this way. >"Therefore, Rahula, you should train yourself: 'I will purify my bodily acts through repeated reflection. I will purify my verbal acts through repeated reflection. I will purify my mental acts through repeated reflection.' Thus you should train yourself."

>>31876 And Buddhism isn't about social justice or changing society, it's more about ending our own dukkha and ignorance, ending the fetters that chain us to samsaric wandering. And that's not just something that only monks can achieve, the ideal for a lay follower was Citta and Hatthaka of Alavi, which were both non-returners. (See the attached image). A lot of people could become stream-enterers if they would commit themselves to the practice seriously. >[...] >“As for the qualities of which you may know, ‘These qualities lead: >to dispassion, not to passion; >to being unfettered, not to being fettered; >to shedding, not to accumulating; >to modesty, not to self-aggrandizement; >to contentment, not to discontent; >to seclusion, not to entanglement; >to aroused persistence, not to laziness; >to being unburdensome, not to being burdensome’: >You may categorically hold, ‘This is the Dhamma, this is the Vinaya, this is the Teacher’s instruction.’” >That is what the Blessed One said. Gratified, Mahāpajāpati Gotamī delighted at his words. — AN 8:53 >“Monks, there are these five faculties. Which five? The faculty of conviction, the faculty of persistence, the faculty of mindfulness, the faculty of concentration, the faculty of discernment. When a disciple of the noble ones discerns, as they have come to be, the origination, the passing away, the allure, the drawbacks, and the escape from these five faculties, he is called a disciple of the noble ones who has attained the stream: never again destined for the lower realms, certain, headed for self-awakening.” -- SN 48:3 >Staying at Savatthi. "Suppose, monks, that the great ocean were to go to extinction, to its total end, except for two or three drops of water. What do you think? Which would be greater: the water in the great ocean that had gone to extinction, to its total end, or the two or three remaining drops of water?" >"Lord, the water in the great ocean that had gone to extinction, to its total end, would be far greater. The two or three remaining drops of water would be next to nothing. They wouldn't be a hundredth, a thousandth, a one hundred-thousandth — the two or three remaining drops of water — when compared with the water in the great ocean that had gone to extinction, to its total end." >"In the same way, monks, for a disciple of the noble ones who is consummate in view, an individual who has broken through [to stream-entry], the suffering & stress that is totally ended & extinguished is far greater. That which remains in the state of having at most seven remaining lifetimes is next to nothing: it's not a hundredth, a thousandth, a one hundred-thousandth, when compared with the previous mass of suffering. That's how great the benefit is of breaking through to the Dhamma, monks. That's how great the benefit is of obtaining the Dhamma eye." -- SN 13:8 >"Bhikkhus, it is through not realizing, through not penetrating the Four Noble Truths that this long course of birth and death has been passed through and undergone by me as well as by you. What are these four? They are the noble truth of dukkha; the noble truth of the origin of dukkha; the noble truth of the cessation of dukkha; and the noble truth of the way to the cessation of dukkha. But now, bhikkhus, that these have been realized and penetrated, cut off is the craving for existence, destroyed is that which leads to renewed becoming, and there is no fresh becoming." — DN 16 (Part) >Monks, I do not say that the attainment of gnosis is all at once. Rather, the attainment of gnosis is after gradual training, gradual action, gradual practice. And how is there the attainment of gnosis after gradual training, gradual action, gradual practice? There is the case where, when conviction has arisen, one visits [a teacher]. Having visited, one grows close. Having grown close, one lends ear. Having lent ear, one hears the Dhamma. Having heard the Dhamma, one remembers it. Remembering, one penetrates the meaning of the teachings. Penetrating the meaning, one comes to an agreement through pondering the teachings. There being an agreement through pondering the teachings, desire arises. When desire has arisen, one is willing. When one is willing, one contemplates. Having contemplated, one makes an exertion. Having made an exertion, one realizes with the body the ultimate truth and, having penetrated it with discernment, sees it. — MN 70 (Part)

>>31875 This is exactly why I think it's all bullshit and it's only applicable to the society of the time, which was rural, and implied that if you kill a man, it was YOU who killed him. If you killed an animal or inflicted pain, it was probably YOU who directly did it. Then even for the monks it's all a big "but it's OK if" because the monks can't go hardline and they have to depend on the lays. Because this is what the religion is about, it's a structure that is built on top of the common people. All in all it's just a service. You wouldn't have Buddhism is every Buddhist temple was a death cult with people mummifying themselves and starving themselves to death. So now that you have a caveats to accommodate for the laypeople, what if your monastery is invaded by cockroaches? Do you call someone else to take them out? The guy who's killing the cockroaches obviously doesn't give a soykaf, nor he thinks >these creatures, for how small and simple they are, still represent a suffering soul in the cycle of Samsara, I should be compassionate- No you idiot! You fuarrrked up now, you lost the game! But if he's killing roaches because they don't even register as "life" to him, if he's completely detached from what he's doing because he doesn't think at all, then he's not contributing to bad karma. He just doesn't know, he's fine. And our monastery is finally roach-free. I PROBABLY have more bad karma by thinking about life and suffering than the guy who sprays poison around and doesn't give a soykaf. I have more bad karma for thinking that my groceries still implied the death of all sorts of critters that the complete NPC who buys meat at the supermarket and not for one second thinks of the animal because he's completely dissociated action from object. It's just stupid and as dumb as this is, I have found no answer to this. > "If there's a real opportunity then I'll try to change the bad treatment of animals." That would bring a different karmic result It's pretty obvious that trying to vouch for change gives you the opposite result if it's something that goes against the majority (the dukkha lovers or whatever they're called), because people will polarize themselves against your position (you're telling them they're doing a "bad" thing that not only they don't think is bad, they also weren't even aware of) So do I >get good karma score for trying to talk to Crunchy McBurgerface? >get bad karma score for polarizing Crunchy McBurgerface? >get bad karma score for giving Crunchy McBurgerface fodder to rally people against environmentalism and animal rights or whatever (he will always get more support than me) >get bad karma for reminding Crunchy McBurgerface that he's doing a bad thing, so now he's aware of it and as he keeps doing it will add bad karma to the world? >You see where I'm going with this? Not really, because people have become less and less aware of their actions. They do not see the slave who made the object when they buy an object, and they not see the dead animal when they buy a hamburger. The businessman does not even see the long-term consequences of his actions. Many people act against their own interests for the sake of unawareness, so as this unawareness increases then - supposedly - people will not have any guilt upon them. At some point, people will stop suffering, and will live in a stupor. It's a possibility that everyone will take a daily pill that makes them happy no matter what. You can cheat the human body out of "suffering" so who cares about awareness if the goal is to end one's own suffering? The awareness of the correlation of slave-item or meat-animal is maybe a blip on people's radar, and as the years go by it gets weaker and weaker. What is going to happen when people will live their lives completely on autopilot, feeling nothing? The Buddha had no idea this would become a real possibility, that people will become just programs, cogs in a machine. Will humans just shortcut their way out of Samsara then? The parables of the suttas talk in terms that are meant to be universal, but in year 2020 this reasoning cannot be applied. You'd have to play 4D chess to know what you're doing, and 90% of the information you need to make the right decision in the sunken part of the iceberg. Again with environmentalism >I should make conscious choices when I buy things so I protect the environment (why do you have to buy things? what do you mean with "protect the environment"? save the orangutans? the oceans? there are already two buzzwords in this sentence >So I'll swap my current car with a hybrid one (congrats, you just fueled the Dukkha machine with money and you effectively polluted the environment more than you would have if you just kept using your car. What is your old car going? Have you thought about that?) >I'll sell my old car and give the money to [charity]! (99% of the charity gets pocketed, you could've given it to someone directly) >No, I'll give it to someone directly! This way I'll know the money will get to who I want to help And then he proceeds to give it to a Gofundme made by professional hustlers while some other guy dies Because he doesn't realize it, this charity thing, this "think about your fellow" thing that he thinks is good Karma and awareness, is nothing but a self-serving network of lies IRL So no matter how you move you're doing bad. This world where everything is reversed is a nightmare for the well-intentioned. You want to do things for others and you end up making their world worse, because the only way you can do it is to buy, and the only way to gather information on what is better is advertisements, which are institutionalized lies. It's just too complex for a simple "think about what you're doing". And you do not even know what's going on because everything is nested into yet another subset of lies that fewer and fewer people know about. All this awareness inevitably becomes "I haven't thought enough about it" While the NPC who just buys products on autopilot driven by basic stimuli is relatively free of woes because all in all, he's not doing anything wrong. He works there packaging advertisements for his company, he doesn't think about how much he's lying for the ad since he's just packaging what his boss tells him. And people like the ad, the ad gives them a product that makes their lives better and more convenient. If they're unhappy they'll get another ad for a SSRI that frees them of all pain. The boss keeps fueling all this network of lies and production because he thinks that all in all, he makes the world go round. If the machine stopped, the nation would fall and a worse nation, say, China, would take over. The animal activist who petitions so that a testing center is removed from his country under EU law doesn't realize that the testing centre will be moved to China where there are worse laws. And so on. The only people who can afford to actually practice this religion are monks, and monks are entirely dependent on the offerings by the people above. I have no idea how Buddhism is supposed to end the cycle of suffering if it stands on these grounds. It's impossible to practice for most, as opposed to Abrahamic religions (DON'T EAT $FORBIDDEN_FOOD, DON'T DO BUTT STUFF, PRAY TO $GOD_NAME AND CELEBRATE RITUALS (RTFM FOR SPECIFICS) AT ESTABLISHED TIMES, THEN DO WHATEVER OK BYE) except for the monks who are implicitly supportive of the very things they're striving for, The only way I see it in a coherent shape is the hardcore self-mummification stuff but that's arguably just suicide. That said, if a number of schools got to this conclusion there are probably faults somewhere when it comes to practice.

Thanks for sharing, but >>31860 >I realize the world is like kicking dead whales down the beach. You need to learn to get over it. >I agree you're correct, but you have to ignore it. >>31860 >what you are saying is willfully ignorant. >What you're saying is not correct. The share is appreciated anyhow lainon.

>>31889 >You are right, the world is like kicking dead whales down the beach. >You are wrong. exercise helps. No. This is how to read it. I specifically went out of my way to even explain that it is not going to "fix it" - Nothing "fixes it". This is more about mitigation. This is why I tend to not bother, I run into these conversation problems like this all the time. I rely too much on others to pick up on context so I do not have to be overly verbose. However, when I tend to be overly verbose as to not create any potential for confusion, people think I am talking down to them. I can't win so I choose to not care as it is not my problem. Cheers and good luck, niggerglitterboy-kun.

>>31853 >starvation Whatever you call it, that's what the pyramid is trying to convey. Prolonged hunger might make one reconsider their values. Inability to fulfill one's needs, especially during child's development, is what shapes the hierarchy as one grows older.

>>31853 >>a few days without food >is substantially different from >>(eating)if you don't do it you will become unable to do other things >The first is merely hunger, the latter is starvation. a few days without food, for most people, is enough to make everyday tasks and basic reasoning difficult. Prolonged malnutrition can also cause very serious problems. The layer on the bottom of Maslow's heirarchy is called physiological need, not complete freedom from physiological stressors. We all know you can stand to eat very little, but you still *need* food to survive, thus making it an obvious prerequisite for any higher aims. The same could be said for water(much more pressing need), shelter(in most environments), and rest(you can die from sleep deprivation).

i kek how this thread got over 50 replies

>>31900 I've done a week no food as a self-experiment in fasting. Surprisingly its not that bad at all. Went even to the gym without feeling weak at the third day.

>>31777 >Seems to me like humans dont belong here or even are supposed to exist, in my opinion humans are not natural beings. Look into the Annunkai. This is basically what ancient scripture says.

>>31912 interesting, were you very fat or something? Most people get irritable and irrational after about 3 days with no food.

>>31919 im the can eat anything type that never was fat in life. That said anyone has expendable fat reserves if they are above the critical ~5% bodyfat limit and i still did drink water to keep hunger down. Some people do extreme fasting with no food no water and in that case the mental fatigue would be much worse, your reports might be about those. There's also a process to fasting. You gradually decrease food before you go dry. If you eat like a landwhale and stop it should be much worse - this is something they warn you against explicit in any guide.

>>31779 >they are utterly perverse and deluded. Congratulations you now figured out how everything originates into this one thing. Delusions. Everything is a delusion, your personality, uniqueness, ego, perverse fetishes, cravings, self, beliefs etc.etc. Religions are a reflection of the truth, science is one reflection of the truth, nothing is truly direct that's why we fall into delusions. We cannot see the truth if we can never truly know or verify the truth. The earth is a prison and we're all deluded {sets,0}. Everyone is deluded. Life is safe to consume because it lives, the earth was never a sanctuary but an abandoned mine. This is why our lives are short. 6/6/6 carbon molecules, gold costs a lot, humans are not allowed to evolve, gatekeepers (not human), hidden history, gatekeepers (human), you will never know or evolve, or go to space. The cave/matrix.

>>31773 I reccomend reading the tartar steppe by Dino Buzzati.

>>31773 You seem to want to claim that the universe is inherently pointless (pls correct me if that's not your point). And because this pointlessness is an objective truth, people who disagree with you are deluded. I think that's soykaf because whether an experience is meaningful or pointless comes down to the emotions you feel during the experience. How can you say X emotion is "inherent" to the universe and those who feel it during their conscious experience of life are "right" and those who don't feel it are "wrong" and "deluded"? You can't, a statement like this doesn't make any sense. This is why I think nihilism is basically a mental illness. When people like you say "Existence is pointless", what you really mean is "My subjective experience of existence is filled with the feeling of pointlessness and void of the feeling of meaning", which simply means your brain has certain traits that are not conducive to an experience that feels meaningful. So how do you do develop a brain that is conducive to a subjectively meaningful experience? I'm not a psychologist or neuroscientist, but I know for sure that exercising regularly has been proven to increase all kinds of positive emotions and reduce negative emotions. The same goes for spending time with people you like or in nature. Of course doing other activities that are conducive to positive emotions ("hobbies") will also make your experience more meaningful and less pointless. What I'm trying to say is, all those "deluded" people who recommend you to exercise, socialize, get out and find a hobby are making completely rational suggestions. If those suggestions don't work for you and you still don't feel any meaning after genuinely giving them a chance, then there seems to be a deeper issue and I honestly recommend to try medication and psychotherapy. Please don't become an hero before exhausting all options just because you think your unpleasant subjective experience of the universe is some kind of objective truth. Btw, for me personally, mindfulness meditation has been the most helpful thing for feeling meaning in the long run. Psychedelics also worked, but only for a short time. >>31793 That sounds interesting, please elaborate on the methods you used and results you had. >>31864 Not sure if you're the same person as 31793 or OP or both, but getting butthurt over someone asking you for evidence after you claim on an anonymous image board to have found some lost "ancient knowledge" is completely ridiculous. This is ever the most convincing bait I've read in a long time or some concerning ego trip.

I also don't like anything

>>33266 Not them, but I'll rebut with my own similar belief. >there is no inherent purpose in the universe, it's basically a sandbox >there is no inherent purpose of life, apart from survival, reproduction and raising our off-spring to reproduce >our human reward system allows us to invent, accept, deny and pursue our own goals, whether short and long term (happiness, superiority, intellectual legacy, improving the lives of others, personal wealth, security, et cetera) >I subjectively see the closest to an objective goal of life (reproduction) to be meaningless and ultimately futile in the extreme long term (due to things like expansion of sun, resource exhaustion, isolation of Earth from other known life) and therefore not inherently worth me pursuing. So I choose my own subjective life purpose as a coping mechanism. That doesn't mean that reproduction is pointless in the short term, of course not! It can be emotionally rewarding and if done well and with some luck, will make your society better, but in the extreme future it's about as inconsequential as any other life goal. I subjectively value other people's happiness more than a DNA legacy, so I would better achieve my own life goals being an educator or entertainer than a parent. I think their argument is along the idea that your own values and emotions are subjective, not objective. The human experience is a subjective illusion. Therefore life has no objective point. Where I different from them is that I don't think that makes everything pointless; subjectivity is real and has objective impacts. I have a slight suspicion they are a certain user of another imageboard who started a fight about purpose being objective and therefore everyone being a drone except them, which is fucκing idiotic. I suspect this is most similar to Absurdism. Life is pointless but that doesn't mean you can't sharpen a toothbrush and make your own point.

>>33893 >sandbox >Life is pointless but that doesn't mean you can't sharpen a toothbrush and make your own point. Off-topic, but does anyone have interesting examples of this in gaming or tech communities, where they have collectively invented interesting goals in a sandbox environment? Like in Linerider, where they still have active communities using it to make art or to essentially hack it to demo complicated physics-bending tricks like teleportation as a skill showcasing challenge, gamifying the sandbox.

>>31773 There are at least four things I can think of to help you and you may need a combination of at least two: 1. Try to understand that you must take the negative with the positive and it is hardship that gives positives meaning >Remember that all things require work >Some work is very physically straining >Some work is soul-sucking for many but it is still essential 2. Talk to a therapist and see about taking mild antidepressants >Perhaps you have intrusive thoughts due to internal brain malfunction >Talk about escitalopram and buproprion 3. Accelerate collapse of corrupt society so that the the world can be reborn fresh and pure >Rebirth follows death >Collapse society so that people can build tribal communities >People work for those they care about in communities in which people work as a functional team >Honor replaces fiat currency >Craftsmanship replaces bland mass manufacturing >Hunting, fishing, gathering, and permaculture replaces monoplanting agribusiness >Wisdom is encouraged and necessary for survival while ignorance, naivety, and laziness are naturally punished by early death 4. Work to build space colonies and then wreck the planet and any humans who refuse to join the colonies >Basically set up Zeon >Become Char Aznable or Zechs Marquis >Drop colonies and asteroids onto Earth >Force humanity to live in colonies while the Earth undergoes rebirth >People somehow learn not to be asswipes to each other >Feel Rhythm Emotion- the rhythm that beats inside of my heart, across the distance I reach out for you SO FAR AWAY https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KfGQfQwlFlM https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Cm38fV8LZ6g

>>31778 >living isn't about reality Lainchan 2020

>>34200 Not him. While I can admit that the other lainon could have been a lot less vague about what he meant by this, I'm inclined to agree with him. Just plain living doesn't require you to know about hard and discomforting truths, it doesn't demand you to occupy yourself with hard questions or any of that other depressing stuff. It's a lot easier and pleasant to be alive if you're ignorant of all problems and disturbing facts of everyday life and of the human condition in general. Isn't that the #1 reason why people still cling to Abrahamic religions anyway? It keeps things simple and you'll be emotionally better off with believing in your own illusions than to trouble yourself with depressing soykaf that you can't do anything about.

>>31773 >I don't like this planet or human life... Tough soykaf. Your happiness is your own responsibility and your own problem, no one else's. Either do what it takes to make youself and your life satisfying and meaningful, or stew in your own misery. Your choice. The universe doesn't give the slightest fuarrrk one way or the other.

>>31773 Plenty feel this way that are not in control of the peasants. It's why they are spouting "space force" nonsense and I feel dirty even parroting propaganda. They want to make sure no dweebs get together to make moon bases nor space stations wherein they could escape nautical laws and laws in general. One could make a giant vivarium that spins to make artificial gravity and then use nuclear powered ion cannons and soykaf to escape. But no, that's terrorism and such. So no. The rich never had to be humiliated nor bored, so they don't feel that way. Degenerates are always high as well, of which angers the egotist that controls them greatly, and the man reprimands them constantly over their life hack. To increase efficiency, though at first glance you'd think they're jealous. To be in power over the hivemind near insectoid race that is mankind is what makes them happy. The most fun game ever, politics, propaganda, land ownership, breaking the laws and getting away with it, laws you make of course, etc. >>31777 Everything on this planet is trying to eat itself. Humans are of the best creatures as they are trying to go vegan, ban murders and rapes, nature doesn't care. it has no ethics, no temperance, no choices. As it is society is ran by such immature egotists, and ran by religion, things like capitalism with awful regulations, it forces people to hate their own kind due to the establishment's effects. It was never a paradise. Screaming sheep are harmed more than the wolf enjoys it's meal. Also humans were not the only extension level event to kill the weaker species on the Earth either. The establishment doesn't have better genes than I, nor ethics, or we'd possibly be thankful for once. As it is, run.exe is in everyone's head that is paying attention.

>There is nothing interesting going on That's just not true Lain. There are so many interesting things to do - write a book - fiction, autobiography, whatever, learn an instrument, write a song, run, lift weights, go swimming, make someone smile. I have my problems with normal people too, but there's just so much to experience that its overwhelming, I hate just having to pick one thing. Of course, it takes money to do all that stuff, but you can't tell me there's *nothing* to do

>>37536 not op but >write a book Writer's block and no one will read it. Also it's hard. >autobiography My life was soykaf and it'd be incriminating. >instrument Takes talent, is hard, stringed harm hands, air causes piles, piano is too hard and takes even more talent, they cost more money than is worth when you never are able to learn nor create anything any time you try. >write a song ............I only like midi now days unless drunk as lyrics are so triggering...... >run Plantar fasciitis. >lift Bad rotator cuffs, weights are so expensive, increase in testosterone will make more horny and hate people a lot, will increase anger on top of it, will be less afraid and will kill someone and end up in the pin, only meatheads do it and dweeb types hate them, etc >swimming I don't own a pool, lakes are dangerously dirty and full of gators, it's hot outside, only the most vapid whores are at beaches and that's too far anyway, etc >make someone smile I hate faux smiles. >>I have my problems with people You know I really doubt it.

>>37537 >its hard yeah, but its worth doing hard things sometimes >I hate faux smiles Who says the smile would be fake? You're projecting >I really doubt that To be sure, its not as bad as some stories you hear around here, but its hard for me

>>31912 there is a big difference between willingly forgoing something and having uncertain access to it; not having the security of knowing where your next meal comes from is more than just lack of food, its a psychological toll as well

>>37537 you just made a bunch of excuses why you shouldn't try to do anything. Every single thing you listed can be overcome... you are sad because life isn't easy.

>>37537 I just want to chime in with the other fellow that your excuses are invalid. Writer's block comes and goes and there's plenty of writers out there who are basically unknown but still write anyway. They don't write for global recognition, they write because they enjoy doing it. I think there is one way to interpret your excuses more positively though and that's to assume that you're looking for a job that can both make you enough money for you to earn a living and also be fulfilling. The thing is though, not many people find jobs like that. I think the default way to live in the modern day is for you and some other roommates to all work part-time jobs doing shelf-stacking or whatever job you can get so you can all pay rent and then, with the free-time afforded by having a part-time job, you work on the creative hobbies that are meaningful to you.

Evolution is not a directed process, so all kinds of suffering happen, but we're not supposed to think about it. Animals only think about their families. Humans are different. We think too much, as a result, we go insane The only solace - sooner or later, it will end. Some 70 years and you're done. You can try to leave earlier, too

I've always hated these threads, people never take advice. It's just a place for people to rant about how fuarrrked up the world is and don't even realize it's fuarrrked up because of exactly what they are doing. Sitting at a keyboard complaining instead of trying to do something. A insider trade of nihilism jizzing on a buffet of wah burgers and french cries. You can try and pretend like you're not just another human but you're but another number to the horde. Either become another of the rank and file earning your paycheck to live a good life, or push to become something even better. There is no in between. All that is, all that you are right now, is just another meat sack taking up resources.

>>37549 I do what I can to improve my life but I also feel I have the right to complain from time to time. I want to, so I will Everyone you don't like is a meat sack but who are you? Who are you to tell me what I can and can't do

>>31773 But these things are just support structures to the final goal. Yes you are in an inevitable process of decay like anyone, but pleasures do not exist for pleasures sake, they exist to get you to keep working and living with the end goal of creating a successor/a child. Your flesh may be temporary, but family is eternal. The family being a contineuing line of traditions and knowledge which gets improved on by each generation with the pleasures of life having the purpose of keeping you motivated and running.

>>31773 You'll probably like Nietzsche's On the Genealogy of Morality In this book he says 'bad' is invented by passive lambs, an error in thinking to do some self confirmation since there's a realization that you'll never be an active person who does what he wants. Yes people don't judge their behavior as good, they judge themselves as good without having to think about it. It doesn't matter what you think because you're led by herd instinct, you're a victim of Catholicist values, judging actions of rulers by their standards made up by other passive lambs, telling the hawks to be lambs because muh behavior. The hawk doesn't mind, he'll grin and slaughter a lamb any day. On another note, if its pleasure you're after, there are a lot of people who think or thought thats the way to go. Its called hedonism, or utilitarianism, or consequentialism. There's also a some criticisms that aren't explained away so easily. Lets take the thought experiment of a pleasure machine, or Huxley's Brave New World. Instead of crying what you don't like and how "real" you are, its mere empty rhetoric. Try to make a real point if you're so much into describing reality

Sounds like to me you don't have any goals in life which is fine but don't be surprised if you keep feeling empty. Me personally I WANT a boring 9 to 5 job so I can get the hell out of this town and move on with my life. How about you just find something you enjoy doing first?

this thread sounds like jack dorsey promoting elon musk lmao

>>31773 > i dont like human race. I think humans are ugly, live short lives... etc >everyone else is vapid get a grip buddy.

Don't worry angst about our lives is mostly possible when things are okay, likely things will get worse and then you wont be able to think about how bad it is and will instead cling to optimism. The world is fuarrrking perfect booya, it's all a matter of perspective.

Like think of this: when life gets really bad and suffering is plenty then most all of the mundane anxieties and fears of life will suddenly not feel like much at all. Isn't that a comforting design?

>>31773 Im a very passionate person and always try to be a comforter, but as I watch this pandemic slip into dystopism I'm losing my will. The future is going to be segregated between one's who took the vaccine and ones who didn't. They used human desire against the vulnerable like they were children, too their toys away by breaking it, now offering poison and their toys but a safer alternative which wasn't needed. I won't take the vaccine and I won't live in this soykaf world if its this evil.

>>39892 >now offering poison and their toys but a safer alternative which wasn't needed You realize once enough people get the shot it won't be needed anymore right? Covid will be endemic and once it is there's basically no point in treating it as worse than the flu. We already have vaccine passports to dengue, yellow fever, west nile, ebola, etc. hotspots. This is nothing new. The third world will be a permanent hotspot that you'll need a vaccine to go to and the rich countries will have "herd immunity" thanks to the high volume of Bill Gates' Nigger Cattle that got the jab. This soykaf will be over by summer, fren. Also the J&J vaccine is a traditional type and probably not poisonous, which is what the US will primarily be using. You've 100% been fuarrrked by psyops. Certain people aleksandr dugin want to spread the idea that VAXX BAD to weaken the west so that pan-Eurasian Nationalism can take hold(which is very bad unless you're into boot on face forever tier tyranny instead of senile tard biden bumbling around trying and failing to do tyranny kek)

>>39921 Now this is a poison post. Anti-vaxx, anti-5G, anti-whatever hs been around forever. These neo-cold war narratives only came about during covid. It's pure psyop meant to dissuae those who are waking up, keep them in the red vs blue.

>>39922 I'm not anti-vaxx or anti-5g either kek, and plan on taking the vaccine myself. That nigger cattle comment was facetious. >cold war soykaf Dugin hates Russia just as much as he hates the west. He's a sketchy cunt that got in on the ground floor of every right-wing movement post buchannan - don't you find that at all odd? and yes retards like Moarpheus and Glenn Beck took these ideas and turned them into absolute poison, but the root idea is valid. that's like saying all socialism bad because venezuela is a soykafhole.

>>39925 I said neo-cold war. As in, using the cold war tempalte to make money and reorganize geopolitics and societies, yet again.

>>39928 How is pointing out that a man that happens to be Russian and believes in some tyrannical bullshit that's making massive headway in the west 'neo cold war' soykaf? That would be blaming Putin and Xi Xinping for this dude's actions. He's just a rich guy who believes in some fuarrrked up soykaf and is willing and able to back those beliefs financially. He used to be close to putin(i think they were both in some cryptography class) but putin quickly realized he was insane and hasn't spoken to him since before his military service. Russia isn't 'behind' him in any capacity and likely views him as a threat which is why he's such a secretive cunt.

>>39930 I feel like you're a bot or not being real with me. You're totally not connecting to anything I say at all. A new cold war is being set up with China, it will be sued to usher us all closer to NWO, and people willa ccept it under that pretext. Vaccines and wireless devices are bullshit and always have been, them being bullshit has nothing to do with the Chinese.

>>39931 I get you now, you're anti-vaxx. I think this is a problem of someone who's really stoned talking with someone who's ESL. >A new cold war is being set up with China, it will be sued to usher us all closer to NWO I doubt it because china is the clear winner and America doesn't want to deal with that soykaf. Biden's already pulling back on the anti-china soykaf. >vaccines always bullshit disagree. still suspect of the mRNA covid vaxx though. most vaccines are safe, the issue is overloading children with cocktails when they're still infants. adults getting soykaf like Hep-C vaccines is no issue. >wireless devices 100% agreed - 5g has nothing to do with it though - it's all about surveillance though not muh harmful waves. >them being bullshit has nothing to do with the Chinese agreed, in fact the chinese vaccine is way safer and more effective than the mRNA neghole-filler.

>>39933 >I doubt it because china is the clear winner and America doesn't want to deal with that soykaf. Biden's already pulling back on the anti-china soykaf. The US was set up as the world reserve currency and propped up after the war (in part via the petrodollar). China is and always has been the testbed for changes to rollout elsewhere. Modern economies are far too intertwined, and debt based, for Great Power aspirations. The overarching course is towards globalism, the US has served its purpose, China has served its purpose. The only way we'll ever fight a real war is if the globalists or some force behind them somehow completely loses control. At that point, militaries may be tempted to use the full extent of their arsenals, including technology that was buried decades ago. It's hard to say. Modern economies are based and predicated on saturating production and consumption, the military industrial complex is no different. It's like in Brave New World, the World State had highly advanced technology, but they kept it from the populationa nd capped them at a certain level. Changes were only introduced slowly and with a great deal of forethought. >disagree. still suspect of the mRNA covid vaxx though. most vaccines are safe, the issue is overloading children with cocktails when they're still infants. adults getting soykaf like Hep-C vaccines is no issue. Nope, fundamental misunderstanding of vaccination. It's not about ingredients and their direct effects, it's about their information content. This is what causes long term issues. Other aspects like nonlinear dose response and excretion of adjuvants is another matter. >100% agreed - 5g has nothing to do with it though - it's all about surveillance though not muh harmful waves. It can be both. You, like everyone else, are stuck in binary mode. One or the other. One thing to hide the other thing. In reality, it can be both. >agreed, in fact the chinese vaccine is way safer and more effective than the mRNA neghole-filler. It's a vaccine, that's all that needs to be said. Without the pretext of preventing disease parents would never allow the state to routinely and arbitrarily inject their children with who knows what. They just want to get access to the adults too. Pretty simple.

>>39936 Why do you think vaccines are bad? I've taken many and had no ill-effects. I think it's dumb to take flu shots every year and inject kids with MMR cocktails and whatnot, but the technology behind vaccines as a whole seems sound by all metrics. I have yet to see any evidence that vaccines are bad that isn't easily debunked by non-political bodies. >information content What do you mean by this? Like, the information it passes to our bodies to force an immune response? Or the information that's passed out by doctors to get parents to inject kids with cocktails? I'll agree with you on one of these. >It can be both 5g is just EMF radiation, which we already had with LTE, and in lesser quantities with 3G. My issue with 5g is that it's easier for the government to track us with it. I again see no evidence that EMF radiation is universally harmful to humans. Sure it can be both but with this I legitimately don't see it. What's 5g doing to us? Is it carcinogenic? Neurologically harmful? I legitimately don't get it.

>>39921 You think there going to stop with just an amount of people? They need everyone to be crippled to engage this nefarious plan. Bill gates wants to vaccinate the world, the media conglomerates and politicans are right behind him. Trump talked to him when the vaccines were proposed. Trump listened to him.

>>39945 not sure if poe's law to be honest. yes, i think they'll stop with an amount of people since having consoomer brand nigger cattle makes them more money than haveing cripple brand nigger cattle. if you believe these retards care enough about the environment enough to do a genocide you've been brainfucked. all the environmentalism soykaf they put on is all a plot to raise your taxes and pat themselves on the back while india basically magdumps the earth with pollution. if you think bill gates is an adrenochrome addict or doing some weird occult depopulation thing then you've just taken a different brand of brainfuck that i shouldn't even need to explain why it's brainfuck. these people are probably all evil psychopaths, but money and power is everything to them. the most likely scenario is that they'll figure out a way to automate everything and fuarrrk off to some space colony leaving the rest of us to rot. that's way more likely than them genociding everyone over the "moderate pneumonia" virus. do you unironically think this is some world-ending scenario? these old dinosaurs ran the numbers and figured out their guys won't get elected if all the other dinosaurs that vote them in every year die. if the obese morons shoving mcdonalds down their throat die off, nobody elects old sleepy joe or orange man anymore. if obese black females die off nobody's electing democratic city officials, you get the idea. they're legitimately doing this because they want to save the absolute dregs of society, themselves, and old people that are maybe still with it enough to vote. and look at that, once the election happened and everyone fuarrrking voted the numbers drop like the stock market on a jewish high holy day. everyone's talking about these token vaccine passports that are about as high security as medical marijuana card and we're getting out of it. and then four years later covid-24 is gonna come around, it's endemic now and this is a bad year. everyone stay inside and get very political. think about politics and vote. vote for candidate x, who totally isn't owned by shady corporations(or the zionist lizards that really killed hitler if you wanna go that route)

>>39938 >vaccines aren't harmful Now this is the post where Ignore your opinion. There's lots of lawsuits involving these things, lots of dead researchers who came forward trying to expose the truth. They harm people so badly they make them depend on the medical industry for their entire lives. And the emf thing, there's studies coming out that it can cause brain cancer. You're living under a rock

u ever notice how many of these anti-5G anti-vaxxers have phones, watch porn, and >>39947 >once the election happened and everyone fuarrrking voted the numbers drop like the stock market on a jewish high holy day. one, this is very America-centric, two, the rate of growth in the US has never been negative (and peaked right after election day) >>39948 link studies? Things like GB syndrome from the H1N1 vaccine are relatively rare. Otherwise we'd all have polio and worse. I'm more inclined to think that having a phone inches from your balls *might* be bad for them. But also living in an urban environment and constantly sniffing exhaust fumes is probably orders of magnitude worse.

>>39949 wew incomplete thought. >have phones, watch porn, and drive cars?

>>39947 You know nothing then, you're a fool if you think politics matters anymore. This is the plot point where they introduce mandatory vaccinations for work or entertainment. Look at what they're introducing in Denmark, a vaccine passport to "get back to their lives", Romanias is doing it with vaccine records and cards. And the thing about this vaccine, is they're going to push and peddle you need to get the new updated shot every so few months because the last one didn't work. It's a nefarious ingenious plan with experimental technology to cripple all who take it. The virus was never isolated it was a lie, it was digitally isolated. We don't know what we're injecting people with. Thank you for playing!

>>39949 https://www.newportri.com/news/20190321/guest-view-unvaccinated-children-are-healthier https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/abs/10.1002/2327-6924.12464

>>39948 >billions of people get VAXXED >tiny percent of them have a horrible reaction and even die, slightly larger percent develop harmful side effects >millions of people take blood thinner >tiny percent of them die, slightly larger percent of them develop life-threatening side effects >millions of people snort blow >tiny percent of them die on the first time, slightly larger percent develop addiction It's almost like this is in the very nature of putting drugs into your body, weather the drugs be immunotherapeutic, recreational, or prescription. >lawsuits It's almost like western society is litigious as all fuarrrk. >>39951 > is they're going to push and peddle you need to get the new updated shot every so few months because the last one didn't work. I think this too, which is why I'm gonna wait a few months to get one that works against multiple variants. This isn't evidence of a conspiracy fren. >We don't know what we're injecting people with. Yes we do with everything but the mRNA vaccine which I've already said people shouldn't get. Johnson&Johnson contains the coronavirus' spike protien delivered through a deactivated adenovirus. Inactive ingredients are sodium chloride, citric acid monohydrate buffer, polysorbate 80, 2 hydroxypropyl-β-cyclodextrin (HBCD), ethanol (absolute), sodium hydroxide and water for injection. We've used this tech for the Ebola vaccine and several others, you need the Ebola vaccine to go to certain countries in Africa, millions get it with almost no reported ill effects. We know exactly what we're getting in the vaccine and if you're too low IQ to understand what that does then just fuarrrk off.

>>39951 nice, an article that makes no citations besides pointing at the VAERS data and a personal anecdote and a paywalled article with a tiny sample size (111)

>>39953 >we used this tech for decades First. No we haven't, the last time we tried an mrna vaccine on animals the experiment was stopped, after a period of time the animals died there immune systems killed them. >>39954 Did you read the online library link? Find the study with your media source, I'm going to bet you there isn't one. The media is on the pockets of the medical industry. We live in a corporate hell world where you're nothing but profit to these people now. Caring and positive emotions died the 20th century.

>>39954 Still proves the point. A sample size does matter, you think that they would let someone do a size of a million children? That would cost the industry alot. And make them lose profit so sad :(!

>>39956 >after a period of time the animals died there immune systems killed them That was for SARS, this isn't fuarrrking SARS. We've used this exact delivery method with the Ebola vaccine, which is widely used. Zika vaccine was made using this tech too. Yes, they say only for healthcare workers but it's also available to rich users that wanna go fuarrrk around in Africa. Don't ask how I know that heh. It bums me out that you're into this retarded conspiracy take because I 100% agree with you about giving kids loads of vaccines. >look into ebola vaccine >see adverse effetcs In vaccine studies conducted since 2015, most of the adverse effects were typically mild. Vaccinated individuals most commonly reported headache, fatigue, muscle pain and mild fever.

>>39958 >>39958 OK so. Atleast we both agree on one point which is giving tons of vaccines to this children. The conspiracy part really isn't a conspiracy at all. It's just giving you the clear picture, ever play the board game life, that's what this is. Its all about the money. I'm a very postitve person, but clear minded on subjects on this. Did you know the polio vaccine gave people over 60k a cancer virus and the risk for it? Shocking isn't it?

>>39949 >one, this is very America-centric, two, the rate of growth in the US has never been negative (and peaked right after election day) you're right, it is. america is kind of leading the world on the whole spreading infectious pneumonia front though.

>>39960 > Did you know the polio vaccine gave people over 60k a cancer virus and the risk for it? Shocking isn't it? Yes, I did. And no, it's not shocking at all. 60k is a perfectly reasonable number of people to have a soykafty effect from ingesting a drug. Look at it practically. If you don't want the vaccine don't take it. It's about as safe as using any other pharmaceutical, recreational, whatever. More people probably fuarrrk their lives up ODing on painkillers they were prescribed every month. I'll be waiting until a vaccine I see is safe is available to me, which according to my locality is less than 6 months. If you don't wanna get it just wait until this soykaf's over. It will end, because these cunts are more interested in getting back to the rat race than pulling a genocide. I also think this is being used to get remote work and UBI more political clout by certain people that are powerful but I don't think they're gonna put us in camps or line us up or force us into some retarded communist way of living. I think the people that work for Facebook and Amazon are all gonna be remote-working from Bali while everyone else flips burger though Like be real about this m8. This soykaf's not gonna fuarrrk us over. Nobody's gonna force you to get VAXXED because enough people will take it that they won't have for FORCE anyone. Lockdowns will end when x amount of people get vaccinated or when y government starts accepting people from x country for whatever arbitrary reasons they cook up that will ultimately boil down to "need money"

>>39957 >you think that they would let someone do a size of a million children? That would cost the industry alot. And make them lose profit so sad :(! This was a long-term study that didn't involve actually administering a drug, all they had to do was get people to sign a paper and then sift through their medical records. >>39956 Did you read the online library link? it's paywalled. >>39963 >Like be real about this m8. This soykaf's not gonna fuarrrk us over. Nobody's gonna force you to get VAXXED because enough people will take it that they won't have for FORCE anyone. That's the beauty of it: most people aren't stupid. I know many many people who were offered it bc of where they work, turned it down at first, then changed their minds. By the time it's available to me(I live in a place where they're really really bungling the distribution) it basically won't matter whether I get it or not.

>>39963 Hey @babe do you use 420chan?

>Like be real about this m8. This soykaf's not gonna fuarrrk us over. Nobody's gonna force you to get VAXXED because enough people will take it that they won't have for FORCE anyone If you saw that the power grab was there and available would you not take it? Bearing in mind of course that the technocratic sort (like Bill Gates) are afraid of the unwashed masses behaving irrationally or independently for that matter... AIDS wasn't enough and Ebola wasn't enough, but now all of a sudden a mild flu condition is enough to stop you travelling. Meanwhile I want to move out of this soykafhole eventually. The upper-classes are getting so bold now that you'd swear it was a ruse if you heard someone suggest it two years ago. >That's the beauty of it: most people aren't stupid. I know many many people who were offered it bc of where they work, turned it down at first, then changed their minds. >By the time it's available to me(I live in a place where they're really really bungling the distribution) it basically won't matter whether I get it or not. I have the virus and it's symptoms already. I'm glad I got it. When I'm ill like this I can self-medicate and self-treat my condition without having to delegate that responsibility, and I know now exactly where I stand with my older relatives (well... away from them). Meanwhile if you wanted the vaccine you would be putting a lot of trust in people who frankly seem to offer their contempt for us. No one going in for the vaccines will have been told the what, when why or how of the vaccines they are being issued. Because if they were told they would reject it. When people know that you've used fetal tissue and monkey experiments to develop the vaccine and given it a trial period of two months, then people would be refusing them. I don't think they were smart for doing things this way, I think they were extraordinarily lucky it hasn't caused more harm than the condition offered. What I'm doing for myself is wearing clothes to bed to raise core body upwards and inducing fever-like symptoms sooner rather than later. I do not like being symptomatic. So far the cough has receeded, but I will know I'm successful when I wake up in a pool of my own sweat (those are the breaks unfortunately). I'm optimistic about recovery by next week. I don't really question that the anarcho-primitive method raises the likelihood of death in many situations but doing things this way leaves me to decide my fate for myself.

>>39966 I did like 4-5 years ago but I stopped going there - not really my scene >>39988 >Bearing in mind of course that the technocratic sort (like Bill Gates) are afraid of the unwashed masses behaving irrationally or independently for that matter... Except that they aren't - they're worried about us gravitating towards different economic systems that make them less money and more accountable. Bill Gates is a spoiled rich cunt that wants to larp as a philanthropist. Real life isn't metal gear, as interesting as that would be. >AIDS wasn't enough and Ebola wasn't enough, but now all of a sudden a mild flu condition is enough to stop you travelling >be china >some people in newly developed city with like five hospitals get bat flu >this makes us look weak - launch complete_overreaction.exe >release a bunch of videos of people dying from seizures and exposure - convince west bat flu very level 10 bad >release videos of trucks spraying scary disinfectant, have some cunts in a hazmat suits run through an office with a smoke machine >west is buying it, scared of virus >new idea >convince them to shut down when they inevitably get the virus >we will convince them to tank their economies while we get back to normal after a month and say we did a great job killing virus - china numbah 1 >basically everyone falls for it and tanks the economy >don't wanna admit to getting psyopped, use it to push for remote work and UBI so Zuck and BASED MARS MAN can just sit at home huffing their own farts all day >use generic template vaccine to end it and get some dubious laws passed this soykaf is fisher price psyops for babby tier and you've been sucked into the narrative. >Meanwhile I want to move out of this soykafhole eventually Then do it? I got a visa to GTFO of here months ago kek. Never had to use it. >i have corona Take megadoses of vitamin C and D. I had regular old pneumonia two years ago and it fuarrrked up my lungs for a few months. never use ice in a bong if you're a filthy pothead heh

>>39938 >I've taken many and had no ill-effects. You've been injected with many over your entire life, and lived around other people for which it was the same. It's all you know, there is no contrast. Degenerative issues and slight neurological changes (at first) can easily be normalized and ignored. >but the technology behind vaccines as a whole seems sound by all metrics. Metrics such as. See Cutter incident, SV40 contamination, instances where no immunogenic material was even detectable, etc. >What do you mean by this? Information content of the material in the shot. You can think of it like this. You write someone a note, they read the note, they ultimately kill themselves. Did you kill them? Did the note kill them? Did the visible light reflecting off the ink and paper kill them? No, it was transduction of the information content which altered their state. It's the same at all other levels of organization, information is transduced and a signal is filtered, damped, or amplified. In this case the target is the immune system. Look up "immunocastration" for an example of what small bits of information can do. >Sure it can be both but with this I legitimately don't see it. How long have you taken to look into it? There are researchers and activists out there who have been active since the 1970's, and the body of literature is far too massive for any lay person to just assume "looks like an open and shut case". The globalists want to create their God and clockwork paradise within SMART citiers, of course, so wireless is going to go ahead regardless. >What's 5g doing to us? Is it carcinogenic? Neurologically harmful? I legitimately don't get it. Yes. It's the same case I described above, transduction and amplification. People like to point to in vitro models as proof RF is inert (and even those go either way) when it's the equivalent of threatening to murder a cell culture's wife and kids and concluding "threats of death to family clearly have no effect on humans."

>>40028 >and lived around other people for which it was the same You don't know where I've lived dude. I actually lived a lot of my life in a country with terrible vaccination rates and zero pre-natal care. There were way more degenerative diseases and neurological issues present there. Americans are sick too, but not nearly as bad - we don't see loads of cripples, deformities, people with club feet and clef lip, various neurological issues that cause people to mong out - this just isn't widely present here. >a bunch of soykaf about polio vaccine which i already addressed Unironically - part and parcel of using drugs. >How long have you taken to look into it? Not much because it's obvious that 5g is just the same tech as LTE but slightly more refined and it's clear it's not going to cause mass-scale harm. >The globalists want to create their God and clockwork paradise within SMART citiers, of course, so wireless is going to go ahead regardless. They'll do it by selling it to normal people not imposing it upon them. Why is the root of all these ideas that the government wants to cripple you? Why do people fear this? Is it because you people want to be reliant on the government and just see this government as malicious? Don't rely on their system and they can't cripple you with it. Are you worried out of some misplaced empathy for the masses that will get sucked into bug-cattle lifestyles? You shouldn't feel bad for them - they want this.

>>40081 >You don't know where I've lived dude. No, obviously I don't know you. Can you tell me more? What you've given me is the stub of a story, and the picture isn't very clear. >Unironically - part and parcel of using drugs. Not sure I follow. >Not much because it's obvious So you have a strong opinion you argue for, but have no basis for it. Got it. >They'll do it by selling it to normal people not imposing it upon them. The delineation is not so clear. Take the old Hegelian dialectic for example, ie make the problem, to spur the reaction, then bring in the change you desired as a solution people will now accept. This is both selling and forcing. People think way too semantically, and way too categorically about large scale processes (which operate on simple parts, mind you). >Why is the root of all these ideas that the government wants to cripple you? I don't intend to seem dismissive, but this is a very frustrating type of discussion where I have quite literally never gotten any direct return on investment whatsoever. Reagrdless. There is no "root" of the ideas, there is no singular organizing principle, there is no single model nor any need for one nor is there any need for the avoidance of dissonance. That's not how reasoning works. The idea that a desired outcome at some layer of an overall process could be to cripple a subset of the population is simply part of the realm of consideration because it's both logical and has strong historical precedent. But it's not the entire realm of consideration. You're not making sense here, I describe God's clockwork paradise, yet all you can see is a "root" desire to cripple the population. Could it be you're just projecting? There are several basic needs and motivations here. You could have a genuine concern for climate change, or it could be yet another tool. You have th desire to stay on top, you have a genuine desire to make people happy (yet you see them as moth to flame, you resent them, so you think I shall save you by managing and severely punishing you), you have the desire to turn others into golem (the psychopath and narcissist), you have the desire to turn others into self (alleviation of anxiety), you have the desire to make everyone know you pain. The list goes on. There are several reasons to dominate, control, and if needed, reduce and remake others. This aspect isn't a conversation worth having because the search space is quite large and most people aren't cut out for it (yet they try to make or break a case on this very level while ignoring the whole!). All that needs to be said is people want, and people dislike obstacles. >You shouldn't feel bad for them - they want this Loose threads don't simply fall away from the modern Great Fabric, they are pruned and discarded. How long, and how far are you willing to run? How long do you think it will take before your back is finally so deep into a corner that you're living in squalor, or simply ground into dust? There are not infinite resources nor infinite space. Other people and the system they serve does not exist in a vacuum. You're not being realistic. Prrhaps you've yet to realize that you're not allowed to use land without paying taxes on it, ie, that you're forced to take part in their system or they come and take everything and put you in jail.

>>40083 >Not sure I follow. Vaccines are drugs, immunotherapy to be specific. When you take drugs, anything from very 'mild' drugs caffeine to very 'hard' drugs like heroin there's a chance you'll have a negative reaction to them. >So you have a strong opinion you argue for, but have no basis for it. Got it. I don't have a very strong opinion on it, in fact I barely think about it. It's all but self-evident that LTE grade radiation isn't gonna fuarrrk us over. people thought similar things about microwaves when they came out, and cameras before that. >Take the old Hegelian dialectic for example, ie make the problem, to spur the reaction, then bring in the change you desired as a solution people will now accept I mean sure, but literally nobody is forcing you into a smart city, or to have weird IoT devices in your home. I don't have any - it has no negative effect on my life. Ideally I'd like to further remove myself from urban living and provide my own power, internet, and plan to take steps to do that(like purchasing a battery and array of roof-mounted solar panels) Where are the logistics for this - they're not even able to force everyone into normal cities despite the fact they clearly want to. There's no way that they can force everyone into smart cities without pulling some totalitarian bullshit and giving foreign countries a green light to steamroll us. >There is no "root" of the ideas, there is no singular organizing principle, there is no single model nor any need for one nor is there any need for the avoidance of dissonance There's an underlying fear of this that I see in almost every anti-vaccine or anti-5G post across the internet. >How long, and how far are you willing to run? Forever, because I'd be running regardless of covid and 5g and all this other soykaf. I want to be as far away from the system - any system - as I possibly can. Maybe that's the difference and why I can see that certain things are just not worth concerning yourself with. People are going to get vaccinated, some of them are gonna get fuarrrked over, and that's not a big deal. You'll probably just see an ad by some ambulance chasing lawyer about how you may be entitled to benefits if you monged out after taking the shot and society will resume its march towards full blown hellworld. We should be worried about growing surveillance, not some potentially real hidden function of 5G that may or may not be used to give us cancer and make us retards. McDonald's is probably way more effective at spreading cancerous poison than any vaccine or radiation-dispenser, and nobody's flipping out over that. Billions of people eating tumorous fake meat every day, altering their brains with sugary drinks, antibiotic-laden meat, and drinking tap water that's full of estrogen from our already castrated female population and flouride that cuts us off from anything "higher"

also just lol you actually got me with that one and got me to say that wanting to live outside the confines of a system that ultimately doesn't give a soykaf about my quality of life and never will is "running" like nah - that's just living the way we've lived for millions of years.

>>40092 throughout human history, living alone has been extremely abnormal this applies to all cultures and all time periods.