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Do you think COVID-19 will be the most important event of the century? I'm starting to think so. Every aspect of our current society will probably fundamentally change for good. 9/11 will seem like a minor event in comparison, even to Americans. The prevailing ideology of our time - neoliberalism - is quickly showing its catastrophic failure to function against any sort of setback. The Keynesian attempts at stimulating function are not working. The popular ideas of unregulated trade and movement have lost most of their credibility. It's also a pretty serious blow for left anarchists and libertarians, who are quickly finding themselves unable to justify their position in the face of a pandemic. Politicians are showing their incompetence and states are showing their frailty. The maps might not look the same once this is over and the world will be another shade more authoritarian for the foreseeable future. The world is splitting into two camps: those that blame the USA for everything that happens, and those that blame the PRC for everything. And this might become violent. Chinese descended will probably suffer discrimination for the foreseeable future. Many people are getting used to working at home. States and companies are investing a ton into remote work and decentralization in order to survive. I feel like working from home will become the new normal for many businesses and workers. I feel like socialization and romance will change, too. Big parties, hookup culture, and crowded concerts might never come back. Society will become much more distant and cold. The dieoff of older populations will probably mark the de facto end of religious relevance in the western world. Technologically, people are demanding more safety measures and surveillance. Microchipping is being discussed, there are measures to abolish end-to-end encryption, people want constant location monitoring, privacy as a concept will probably cease to exist entirely for "safety concerns." So do you think this will change the world as much as I do? Or do you think it'll prove to be nothing in a few weeks and life will go on as usual?

I will retreat for as long as i can from society. I rather take the bullet than a vaccine, it just so happens i have a 9mm and one bullet oddly enough. We should by now all know what their true intentions are. Things will not go as smooth as over as they like, regaredless of how well they think this might go over, its obvious this is a rush move out of desperation. All too well we have seen in the past the failure of technology as all and everything solution. We can resist them, eventually one straw will break the camels back.

>Do you think COVID-19 will be the most important event of the century? Not even close. The most important event of this century will be the total collapse of the American empire. >Every aspect of our current society will probably fundamentally change for good why would it? >It's also a pretty serious blow for left anarchists and libertarians, who are quickly finding themselves unable to justify their position in the face of a pandemic. I disagree, but then again, I'm a left libertarian. >I feel like socialization and romance will change, too. Big parties, hookup culture, and crowded concerts might never come back. Those things will be kicked into overdrive when the lockdown is over. I fully expect a few weeks of orgies once they're legally allowed. >Technologically, people are demanding more safety measures and surveillance. Microchipping is being discussed, there are measures to abolish end-to-end encryption, people want constant location monitoring, privacy as a concept will probably cease to exist entirely for "safety concerns." This has been happening for a long time. Any time something bad happens, "concerned parents" demand that the government be given draconian powers.

COVID is not lethal enough to leave such a mark. You can feel it on the wide disregard it has among the young population, that seem to think the measures taken are a gross exaggeration due to a total lack of empathy with the older ones. What this shows is just the cult of me in modern times, that thinks 15 days of isolation to protect others is asking way too much.

>>23303 That's quite the prediction, what makes you so sure about it Anon?

>>23308 GWP is predicted to drop by 25% or more this year. if something as pansy-ass as COVID-19 can fuarrrk things up this much, think how bad it will be when soykaf starts really hitting the fan

>>23306 It's more than just people getting infected and dying, though that is a big part of it, the issue is that the economy has been crashing hard due to the pestilence on a scale that hasn't been seen in decades, and much of the countries around the globe have had to shut down almost everything because of it, the question that remains to be answered is what impact it will leave on us socially, politically, and economically.

>>23309 Okay? But how and why will America collapse and why will orgies and big social events be pushed into overdrive?

>>23309 oh *US GDP, my bad https://markets.businessinsider.com/news/stocks/us-gdp-drop-record-2q-amid-coronavirus-recession-goldman-sachs-2020-3-1029018308

>>23311 >why will America collapse already answered this question. The pandemic is displaying how unstable America is. >why will orgies and big social events be pushed into overdrive? because people will have been prevented from doing them for months, but they still want to. Not hard to figure it out.

I'm a more centrist libertarian, and I think the big outcome of this will be the huge blow to the state when it turns out the lockdown was hundreds of times deadlier than the virus. Using top-down power to drown your economy in the bathtub isn't a way to "save lives", and it's only the economically illiterate/logically impaired who would think so. Will it be the biggest event of this century? That depends on how long it takes for people to snap out of their feel-good "but, but, saving lives!!!" claptrap.

>>23303 >This has been happening for a long time. Any time something bad happens, "concerned parents" demand that the government be given draconian powers. It's completely inevitable that the world will go to soykaf one way or the other, this is a conversation from today with person who is not retarded and uses a computer daily for work >Hey can I vid call? >OK call on WhatsApp >Can I video call on desktop for once so our families can see each other comfortably in HD instead of being crammed on a phone >*brain malfunction* >Just go on the computer, open the browser and go on meet.jit.si and enter the name of the room, you have to install nothing, no accounts, just- >I don't want to go on weird sites >It's literally a videoconferencing software, it's just from a browser >Just call on the phone??? >Can you install Skype at least? >Ughhhh call on the phone???? >*Proceeds to call trying to fit 4 people on handheld phone shakier than Blair Witch Project, battery runs out in 10 minutes* I'm not even mad, the human race is literally too dumb to exist on anything more complex than a hunter-gatherer lifestyle.

>>23316 it is very odd how totally resistant people are to trying *any* new technology that they didn't learn about in an ad

>>23317 People are lazy. They don't like to do new things because it means they have to think, and thinking is effort. Even I fall into that trap sometimes, and I like weird and obscure stuff.

> It's also a pretty serious blow for left anarchists and libertarians, who are quickly finding themselves unable to justify their position in the face of a pandemic 20-25 years ago, some anarchists were saying that this sort of thing is inevitable with global capitalism. There were always epidemics in history but only an integrated global economy could spawn a global pandemic. They would be well within reason to say " told you so" now but I haven't that from their camp personally.

I wish things would change because as they are now everything is like kicking dead whales down the beach. But nothing ever goes the way I want so I guarantee everything will go back to "normal" by the end of the year.

>>23317 >Holy soykaf what's with all these .doc attachments in your mail, can't you clean that soykaf up? >I have to edit the document and send it to another person via mail every time >What the fuarrrk? Dude you have a Google account for work, why don't you use cloud, Google Drive? >G-googa druh? >Why doesn't your enterprise use a cloud? You can send the link of the document to the team you're sharing it with and you can edit in real time, no need to send it and receive it back, holy soykaf I can't believe you do that >*brain malfunction* People just teach each other a rote like go on menu a, click on b, click on c without learning how soykaf actually works, it's like I'm talking to apes sometimes. All areas of work are just this soykaf done by rote with no understanding, it's unbelievable.

> stay indoors > avoid social contact > touch no one How does this change my life in any way? Besides: > wash hands obsessively ?

>>23323 Wait until the delivery truck with the block's food will be assaulted by bandits.

>>23324 It's me. I'm the bandits.

>>23325 >It's me. I'm the bandits. [ ] Get a cool desert bike with spikes and skulls on it [ ] Recruit a gang of mutants [ ] Learn martial arts [X] Be fat and disgusting you can do it in 1-3 weeks, I believe in you bandit-lainon!

>>23310 The economy is crashing because the government is shutting it down and creating an artificial crisis. The people this virus actually affects don't even work, if we just ignored it everything would be fine.

>>23327 You can't just let demented 90-year-olds with diabetes and cancer living in hospice care die, lainon. That's evil.

>>23328 It almost seems like this virus was designed.

>>23327 >The people this virus actually affects don't even work I don't know what kind of spoonfed reality you live in, but lots of people actually go to a physical location to work, and commute through crowded stations to take trains and buses and metros. You mom has to go to a supermarket to buy your food, you know. >>23328 This is also nonsense, people who are old or already ill are the more prone to dying, but this doesn't mean you can allow thousands of people to develop pneumonia on the basis that you can just hospitalize them. There is simply not enough of a framework to do that which means people will die, and you don't even know if the virus has long-term complications. I hate the higher ups as much as everyone else, but this idea that the virus is non-existent threat and the gubbaments are artificially creating a crisis makes no fuarrrking sense. If anything, people are being stupid for only following the rules when it's too late and there are way too many cases to handle.

>>23331 If you wanted to design a virus in plague inc. to kill the weak it would probably be something like this.

>>23332 Most people don't get pneumonia from this. Also, people go to work with viral pneumonia all the time anyway, so why is it suddenly a big deal when it's this specific virus causing it? Pneumonia isn't even some automatic hospitalisation symptom any more than bronchitis or diarrhea are.

It can all also kill young people with a pre-existing condition and I think they deserve a chance at life to be honest.

>>23336 Jesus fuarrrking christ dude do you even live on this planet. Read some fuarrrking research papers on covid-19 ASAP or just read some fuarrrking news.

>>23316 I met people like this every now and then.At first I couldn't grasp how a person can deliberately use something like WhatsApp or something so boated as the Youtube app(or website without filters).To this day the reply is always >It's the "official" thing ts should be safe. >the ads don't bother me too much. It's just sad.

>>23339 I do read research papers. I don't read CIA-cowritten "news." Maybe that's why I'm more informed than you.

>>23336 Are you a doctor? 'Cause the consensus is that it's a pretty hard to treat form of viral pneumonia and you have to intubate the patient and hope it goes away on its own. There would not be enough hospital stuff to treat all the people who would get pneumonia from a mass contagion. >inb4 doctors are lying and I know better because I get my info on flatearthnews.com >>23342 >I don't read CIA-cowritten "news." I rest my case.

>>23343 Have you found Saddam's WMDs yet?

>>23343 *staff Assuming it's possible to coordinate all the doctors on the planet to tell the same lie, what is it exactly that these people have to gain from their country's economy collapsing? You know that doctors are not all billionaires living in forts, right?

>>23345 What "news" have you been reading that makes you think all doctors are unanimously agreed? There are doctors, nurses, virologists, and epidemiologists all over the Internet doubting the reaction to this.

>>23319 True, but just about every modern anarchist considers anti-globalization to be cryptocash

>>23349 Cryptofash*

>>23348 You don't need to coerce a doctor to treat a patient. It's their job. Stop it with the Gish gallop, Christ-glitterboy.

>Do you think COVID-19 will be the most important event of the century? No, I think it's a case of much-a-do-about-nothing >Politicians are showing their incompetence and states are showing their frailty. Whi;e the first part of this statement is true, I'm afraid this looks more like a move to consolidate populations' reliance on their governments. I think that's why they're littering the media so badly with this soykaf and showing empty streets all over the world and whatnot. Don't mind the economy too much. It's resilient. It may take some time to get back on it's feet but it will eventually...

>>23347 >There are doctors, nurses, virologists, and epidemiologists all over the Internet doubting the reaction to this. Can you please link me to videos of researchers saying we should do nothing to stop spreading the contagion? The fact that researchers consider the pros and cons of countermeasures is part of their jobs, it does not mean that what the WHO, ECDC etc. agreed upon is a lie, unless the virologists you follow publish on your favorite conspiracy site. As you have probably found out, much about the virus is unknown and there is no vaccine or surefire treatment. The workplace shutdown that governments are employing is due to social distancing being the only reliable way to mitigate the spread of the virus.

>>23353 There have been various hospital people saying its overblown simply based on the attributed deads that were in hindsight mislabeled but initially reported as corona victims and the people affected being one feet in the grave either way. It's probably not the answer either you or the other dude were looking for though.

It's not the end of the world, but you can see it from here. Present Day, Present Time! AHAHAHAHAHA!

>>23354 I know that, but I doubt this is what conspiracy lainon was talking about. I'm not saying that everything that reaches us is 100% correct, but I doubt the data is intentionally poisoned or the safety measures are being employed for no other reason than crowd control. I am sure that someone will capitalize on this scenario to make things worse, that's a given.

>>23356 hospitals problem is people rush the hospital by the slightest suspicion of covid. So now you have ordinary sick getting blocked by these people and assuming one of them really has it everyone else waiting in same space has a good chance receiving it too. Overblown panic is what kills their ability to handle it well. None of these people should be at the hospital. What's worse the elderly visit the hospital to get their regular prescriptions. On one hand you have all these measures. On the other people make a mosh-pit at the hospital.

>>23357 True, people are kept off their workplace so the economy is tanking but at the same time there are people going out when they shouldn't. At least it's not full-blown panic yet but people are acting way too irrationally. The stress levels are off the charts yet nobody follows the rules and only rush to buy masks they don't even know how and why they should use.

>We’re dealing clearly with a pandemic for all intents and purposes, but the vast majority of us who are going to contract the disease are not going to be significantly impacted. washingtontimes.com/news/2020/mar/11/media-fueling-coronavirus-panic-under-fire/

Even if it turns out the mass death paranoia is overblown (novel coronavirus simulations in the past show roughly 70 million people die btw), there will be a significant amount of people with lifelong disabilities from lung scaring. One big change I'm reasonably sure of is that STEM working from home will become commonplace now that people are getting used to it and enjoying it. I think people will initially flock to in-person work once the quarantines are lifted, will remember how much it sucked, and then everyone asks to work from home again. Oh, and a minor thing: I predict the USA will finally join the bidet world.

The media overhyped this whole deal in order to get clicks on their soykafty articles, which scared people and made them panic, which made the politicians feel like they just HAD to do something otherwise they would lose support and votes, which led to our entire economy being shut down. These media fuarrrks need to be strung up.

>>23353 >The workplace shutdown that governments are employing is due to social distancing being the only reliable way to mitigate the spread of the virus. Why do we want to mitigate the spread of a common cold virus even at the expense of the entire world economy, likely killing countless working class people in the long run? Because the rich and powerful happen to be elderly men, who are also the only group under real threat here. They're throwing the rest of us under the bus to extend their own lives by a couple extra years, and if some poor die and our rights are eroded along the way, that's all the better for them.

>>23363 >Why do we want to mitigate the spread of a common cold virus Because 1 in 5 people affected need to be hospitalized.

>>23364 >one in five affected One in five people DIAGNOSED in a specific region notorious for air pollution. Nowhere near one in five Koreans diagnosed went to the hospital, because they were young and had clear air.

>>>>23363 This recession is intentional. We were going to have one this year no matter what, so this disease crisis was massively hyped up in order to force the crash early. It also gives them cover for government bailouts because they're more easily swallowed "emergency measures". This would prevent a better organized Occupy 2.0 from showing up. Many leftists are seeing through it all, but the quarantine and social distancing rules ensures that they can't properly assemble.

>>23366 The number of leftists siding with the geronto-pluto-kleptocracy here has been really disappointing me, but people do seem to be waking up little by little. Sucks that it's probably too late, just as planned.

>>23362 This isnt the first disease the media ran big. Swine flu even caused losses cause people weren't scared enough to care and too much vaccination didnt get sold. So why is it different this time? The media didnt act different. >>23361 Do you really believe everyone can do stem?

>>23365 >Illness due to COVID-19 infection is generally mild, especially for children and young adults. However, it can cause serious illness: about 1 in every 5 people who catch it need hospital care. So the WHO is lying about a statistic to induce mass panic. Give me your source that says otherwise.

>>23363 The elderly men happen to be a lot more than just the rich and powerful This is a very obtuse comment, disregarding a real danger for a big sector of the population because you think it is just a common cold >>23368 Spot on, if anything as we are forced to go back to normal it will show how much we overrated of stem, consumer behaviour will try to realign with reality once again

>>23363 >even at the expense of the entire world economy, likely killing countless working class people in the long run? 90% of what the world economy does is useless. Give everyone a UBI to prevent mass starvation and homelessness, and this will make life better in the long run, not worse.

relevant https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oTysV3EfSyM

>>23369 Keeping in mind the WHO is running off lab-confirmed COVID19 numbers from very specific countries, here's a good comparison: https://www.health.ny.gov/diseases/communicable/influenza/surveillance/2019-2020/flu_report_current_week.pdf To summarize, about 15% of lab-confirmed common flu cases go to the hospital. That sounds awfully scary, too, until you realize nobody cares to mass-test everyone with symptoms for influenza viruses. Also, to note, the WHO is run by the World Health Assembly, which is a group of politicians selected by the UN member states. It also employs doctors and scientists, who have no real decision-making power. Its budget is paid in the same way the UN's is, which mostly means "by the Americans." If you care at all about conflicts of interest, the WHO is an unreliable source for fact-based, non-politically-motivated info (or policy).

>>23370 >This is a very obtuse comment, disregarding a real danger for a big sector of the population because you think it is just a common cold You misunderstand. I'm not disregarding the danger to very old people because I think it's minor, but because I think trying to keep the elderly and decrepit alive is a waste of time and resources. And if they're elderly and in good health, they won't die anyway. 99.9% of Italian COVID19 deaths have been in people who were already ill.

>>23374 mass testing of *entire* populations has revealed that COVID is still about 10x more deadly than the flu even when controlling for these sampling biases.

>>23377 Stop making soykaf up. No one has mass-tested their entire population.

>>23378 https://www.cbc.ca/news/health/coronavirus-canada-testing-symptoms-italy-1.5504780 https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2020/mar/20/eradicated-coronavirus-mass-testing-covid-19-italy-vo https://www.voanews.com/science-health/coronavirus-outbreak/south-korea-britain-aggressively-test-coronavirus randomized or whole-population testing is being carried our in many places.

>>23379 Your articles outright say they're only testing people who have presented themselves to doctors with symptoms. On the other hand, they are trying to test a random selection of the populace for antibodies in (I believe) the Netherlands, but there's no data from that project yet.

>>22380 do I have to read it for you? >But in the last two weeks, a promising pilot study here has produced results that may be instructive for other countries trying to control coronavirus. Beginning on 6 March , along with researchers at the University of Padua and the Red Cross, we tested all residents of Vò, a town of 3,000 inhabitants near Venice – including those who did not have symptoms. This allowed us to quarantine people before they showed signs of infection and stop the further spread of coronavirus. In this way, we eradicated coronavirus in under 14 days.

https://www.thecanary.co/uk/analysis/2020/03/18/the-tories-just-revealed-the-most-terrifying-part-of-their-coronavirus-plan/ Looks like the Brits get to finally have a taste of fascism. Boris doing what Adolf couldn't, courtesy of Corona.

>>23381 >Vò, a town of 3,000 >randomized or whole-population Oh, you're such a kidder!

>>23383 yes, the whole population of the town. Are you actually retarded or just pretending to be?

>>23384 There are 60 million people in Italy. Are you retarded or just a bootlicker?

>>23314 >already answered this question. The pandemic is displaying how unstable America is. We have actually been handling it better than other countries, while many businesses and schools have shut down, the students and workers have started working from home online and have been keeping the system going, as well as that, more people than ever are using online services to buy the goods they need, the federal government is also helping the economy and people by giving out benefits and stimulus packages, preventing the situation from getting worse, things are far from chaotic, in fact, they are more orderly than ever. >because people will have been prevented from doing them for months, but they still want to. Not hard to figure it out. They aren't though, it isn't martial law Anon, you can still go outside your house during the day time and do whatever you please.

>>23386 they are being prevented from large social activities such as parties. Which is what I was talking about.

US Department of Justice demanding Congress suspend constitutional rights indefinitely, EARN IT act blocking encryption about to pass, Bill Gates up to creepy soykaf involving microchips it's like we legally entered the cyberpunk world over the course of a few days

>>23395 What, were you expecting any different? Cyberpunk 2020.

>>23396 i expected it to be drawn out over the year, not going from 2010s pre-cyberpunk straight into the thick of it over the course of a week

>>23395 Days? Have you been living under a rock? Also it's not happening (or going to happen) overnight. Always slow but steady, mankind is begging for it. Nothing is without the consent of the mass.

>>23397 Just wait until, with all the small businesses crushed by the quarantine rules, megacorps snatch up all the land and buildings and establish their own private countries. Fast forward a few years and... Enjoy living in a personal storage unit! (I hope this doesn't actually happen, but at this point...)

I'm only speculating but this seems to be engineered: - Get people used to "justified" authoritarian policies - Distract from legislation process - Create a fear beyond anything "terrorism" (lol, muh terrorism) could create - Kill off weak stock, or otherwise thin the herd These factors are brought about by multiple facets: - The disease is mutating at an astounding rate, making the likelihood of an immunization or "cure". - Panic behavior is being encouraged rather than discouraged (impulse buying of essentials, self-imposed quarantine for the healthy, "social distancing" (more on this later), avoiding any gatherings, and so on) - The virility of the virus is exceptionally high, being more contagious than the flu (but lesser than previous pandemics). This suggests it has been tuned for fear effect above and beyond what would occur naturally. - Endless "thinkpieces" about the benefits of "social distancing" and other mitigating behaviors based on pure speculation. - Possibility of health care collapse. If enough severe infections come about, there's a very real possibility that the system will fail to bare the load. "Social distancing" in particular is the thin end of the wedge. A fundamental right that must be (taking the position of authoritarian "leaders") curtailed is the right to gather in groups: free association. By moving discourse online, it can be better censored. By avoiding gatherings, protests for anything can be avoided. By creating distrust ("he might be sick, oh dread") it further atomizes society. This is essential for authoritarians, as it directly is a subversion of the possibility of meaningful resistance. Authoritarian policies, such as travel bans, curfews, limiting of store access, and so on, represents a two-prong attack: legitimize authoritarianism (it's for your good citizen), and expand authoritarianism (you let us do X, all we want to do is Y). This ties into promoting and slipping deleterious legislation like the EARN IT bill through, unopposed. Fear-based ruler-ship is not unprecedented. It works for China, worked for the Soviet Union, and works for North Korea, etc. It's better to fear some speculative distant possibility than the government, since the goal of an authoritarian government is to be accepted unconditionally. By pretending to be the good guys, the authoritarians are able cloak their misdeeds in the cape of legitimacy.

>>23299 I think COVID-19 has allowed more people to not completely trust their government. A significant number of Chinese people went out of their way to discuss their distaste for how the PRC handled the outbreak when it first began. Of course, they're all in camps now. And what about the USA? You have someone like Mike Pence as the head honcho in keeping the virus in check in America. A lawyer who is devoted to his religion and actively shapes and influences the state based on what his own prescription of morality. No, not someone who understands infectious diseases with a proven track record of risk management. With each death and with each case that arises in the US, Americans are slowly beginning to realize that governments don't necessarily have the interests of their own citizens in mind -- even the Red hat-wearing lower-middle-class Republicans who are ardently against socialized healthcare, immigrants, and critical thought. I predict that those affected by the virus, especially those who worship the GOP, will become quite disenchanted once this pandemic blows over. Trump, I imagine, is working fervently on marketing the blame on the Chinese people and, undoubtedly, his opponents (most of which are pro-socialized healthcare). I'm not saying socialized healthcare would completely solve the crisis here, either. As for socialization and romance - I don't think it will change that much. Those who partake in hookup and party culture are primarily extroverted animals. The moment that a social event comes up, and once the risk is over, it's pretty safe to assume that they'll be back on their bullshit. It's in the extrovert's instinct to be with other people and for them to deny their own instinct is their version of hell.

>>23401 This isn't really surprising at this point. I just hope some disaster, whether it be war or nature or something else, interrupts all this and throws a wrench in the process. If not, maybe I should look into hopping ship to Russia or India or something. They can't really be worse than "the first world" anymore.

>>23401 I think you're right for the most part. "Preventing pandemics" will be the new "preventing terrorism". Can't have an encrypted internet anymore, you might be spreading information that encourages breaking future quarantines. Can't freely assemble anymore, what if somebody has a new disease we don't know about and spreads it? Can't get into a relationship without tinder, we need to keep track of this in case the new HIV pops up. Can't have any parties without Houseparty, we need to make sure everyone whose there is accounted for if a new disease shows up, etc. Travel restrictions become permanent and heavily monitored because people will be terrified of pandemics. All work that can be done at home is so that you can't communicate dangerous ideas to coworkers without being monitored. Everything to prevent one of mankind's worst fears: disease.

>>23401 it is far more likely that the pandemic is a convenient, not engineered, excuse for authoritarianism. >- The disease is mutating at an astounding rate, making the likelihood of an immunization or "cure". which they would want. The government that discovers a cure/vaccine will be heroes to their people. Meanwhile stocks are plummeting, which is good for absolutely nobody. >- Panic behavior is being encouraged rather than discouraged (impulse buying of essentials, self-imposed quarantine for the healthy, "social distancing" (more on this later), avoiding any gatherings, and so on) aside from hoarding, which is being encouraged because retailers and wholsalers can make a buck off it, none of these are panic behaviors. >- The virility of the virus is exceptionally high, being more contagious than the flu (but lesser than previous pandemics). This suggests it has been tuned for fear effect above and beyond what would occur naturally. it suggests something only if you're looking for something for it to suggest. >- Endless "thinkpieces" about the benefits of "social distancing" and other mitigating behaviors based on pure speculation. along with suggestions from pretty much every medical professional >- Possibility of health care collapse. If enough severe infections come about, there's a very real possibility that the system will fail to bare the load. which would be extremely bad for any government which created the virus, since they would definitely want to keep things functioning throughout the pandemic. >"Social distancing" in particular is the thin end of the wedge. A fundamental right that must be (taking the position of authoritarian "leaders") curtailed is the right to gather in groups: free association. By moving discourse online, it can be better censored. By avoiding gatherings, protests for anything can be avoided. By creating distrust ("he might be sick, oh dread") it further atomizes society. This is essential for authoritarians, as it directly is a subversion of the possibility of meaningful resistance. It also makes your government plain less effective. Police aren't responding to non-life-threatening calls any more in many cities. Plus, I think in about a month it will become abundantly clear to everyone that there's no more need for such measures. Unless, of course, they drink the government kool-aid... but I think most people have an urge to be social that overrides simple ideology.

>>23405 the tinforil hat argument here is that all those stock crashes, healthcare system failures, etc. aren't bugs, they're features. the illuminati/jews/reptilians/girl scouts want everyone to lose faith in their government so that they accept a one world government and currency.

>>23405 >Meanwhile stocks are plummeting, which is good for absolutely nobody. It's great for the ultra-rich. They pull their money out early, make bank on shorting the market, invest in other things (like real estate), and watch as all the small businesses and middle class go bankrupt and lose their retirements. The rich keep most all their money, perhaps even make some, and watch as everyone else burns in the crash they engineered. It's a huge win for them. Why do you think they wouldn't want that?

>>23405 >Shîllîng for the government Most of your objections are baseless, and some of them incoherent. Try harder anon.

>>23408 >It's great for the ultra-rich. They pull their money out early, make bank on shorting the market, invest in other things (like real estate), and watch as all the small businesses and middle class go bankrupt and lose their retirements. real estate value is also going down. A few individuals might find this good. But no corporation or investment firm would make such a risky move. >Why do you think they wouldn't want that? I think they would do a quick risk assessment and realize that they would be better off just letting the economy continue to boom.

>>23411 sorry: real estate value will also be going down. When unemployment skyrockets and people are talking about mass rent strikes and UBI, land value will go wayyy way down.

>>23411 >real estate value is also going down. For now. Where do you think it goes when you have a lot of newly-homeless people from the crash and you've now bought up half the homes? You'll have a lot of people willing to work three jobs full-time just to have a single room to sleep in at night. >I think they would do a quick risk assessment and realize that they would be better off just letting the economy continue to boom. Do you actually think the kinds of people who get mega-rich and invest in stocks are the same people who shy away from risks? They're gamblers. Hitting the jackpot is how they got where they are, and they'll gladly do it again, any number of times.

>>23413 >Do you actually think the kinds of people who get mega-rich and invest in stocks are the same people who shy away from risks? Yes, I think exactly that. People who make money from risky behavior are rare. And investment firms, corporations, etc. are *always* risk-averse. They need to show investors that they can increase profits, year after year, quarter after quarter.

>>23414 https://edition.cnn.com/2019/10/03/success/risk-takers-to-ceo/index.html www.ipedr.com/vol25/15-ICEME2011-N00024.pdf

>>23412 These measures are temporary though Anon, the government doesn't want to do this, to prevent an already bad situation from getting worse they are considering implementing things like UBI, lowering interest rates, and more in order to get things back on track as soon as possible if this panic ever ends then the measures will probably go with them, but I do not doubt that there will be a lot of debate around whether or not to keep some of the measures permanently.

>>23416 Anglosphere is definitely going to see some political shakeups. I don't see the Tories in the UK or the Australian Liberals making it out alive. USA will probably get free healthcare and I think the Democratic party might die if they don't change their tune quickly. New Zealand seems fine, Canada is on shaky ground but Trudeau might come out on top.

>>23416 You're much too optimistic and trusting. People who gain power, however they do, will seek to retain and expand it. >>23417 I doubt your assessment of the US minus the death of the democrat party. They're impotent, and their soon-to-be-leaders Joe Biden is senile. It's bad news for them.

>>23418 Presidents have been senile in the past. I'm starting to think whoever manipulates the elections prefers it that way. It definitely wouldn't kill off the party.

>>23415 Imagine being suspicious of everything except what self-aggrandizing CEO's say pro tip: most of the ultra-rich are not entrepreneurs

>>23420 Which obviously means zero of them are, and also they're all incredibly risk-averse and would rather put their money in a safe buried out back like some nutty prepper than invest it, because investments are sooo risky. When you come up with a coherent thought, let me know.

>>23418 >>23416 Naive. The word is naive.

>>23402 >I predict that those affected by the virus, especially those who worship the GOP, will become quite disenchanted once this pandemic blows over. You should really read opposing opinions occasionally. MSM is beginning to rot your brain.

>>23375 >I think trying to keep the elderly and decrepit alive is a waste of time and resources. I'd rather invest into the elderly than a bunch of trannies' sexual fetishes

It is indeed a Fresh Hell. This article outlines some possibilities for what comes after. We are pretty much looking at a post-apocalypse type society of some kind. Either far more authoritarian in its approach to containing viruses or worse. Terrifying, I dont know if any of us can really fathom what is happening now. https://archive.is/AEO4V

On the one hand I don't want to correct conspiracy schizos / libertarians and just let them select themselves out, but there's a high risk that, once infected, they'll spread the virus to functional people.

>>23327 >The people this virus actually affects don't even work, if we just ignored it everything would be fine. It'd be even worse - what, you think nobody did the maths? Assuming 4% mortality rate that's 15 million deaths in the US alone, possibly more because of obesity epidemic and overwhelmed health industry. Something like that would completely trash the economy. The civilian mortality rate of Iraq war was around 0.4% to 0.5%, depending who you ask, spread over decades. We're talking ten times that in a matter of months at the minimum. That's WW2 numbers. For example, Japan lost 4% of the population throughout the war and they got nuked and fire bombed.

>>23435 And all we have to do to prevent it is STAY AT HOME Sometimes the hardest course of action is to do nothing but we must be preparded to isolate as much as we can. I dont want this to be true but atm its the only way.

>>23401 I agree with you this seems like an engineered crisis they did a tabel top simulation of this very event called Event201 on october 2019 2 months before the virus got reported by china Coincidence??? http://www.centerforhealthsecurity.org/event201/ The Rockefeller Foundation and Global business network also discussed this very pandemic crisis scenario and they suggest "LOCK STEP – A world of tighter top-down government control and more authoritarian leadership, with limited innovation and growing citizen pushback" https://archive.org/details/pdfy-tNG7MjZUicS-wiJb/page/n17/mode/2up a verry interesting article . some of the insane "top-down control schemes " are Scanners using advanced functional magnetic resonance imaging (fMRI) technology become the norm at airports and other public areas to detect abnormal behavior that may indicate “antisocial intent.” Driven by protectionism and national security concerns, nations create their own independent, regionally defined IT networks, mimicking China’s firewalls.Governments have varying degrees of success in policing internet trafic, but these efforts nevertheless fracture the “World Wide” Web. and other wonderful things to implement in varous other scenarios to "protect" the people

>>23438 Plus it looks created in a lab http://archive.is/GUFNW

>>23436 >Sometimes the hardest course of action is to do nothing Do you actually have so little insight you don't realize what you just said? You justified a mass-scale, draconian civil rights violating unconstitutional military-backed crackdown on anything even resembling freedom of movement/assembly, then pretended that's "doing nothing." I agree doing nothing would be the best course here, for most people. And by doing nothing I mean ACTUALLY doing nothing, also known as just going about our business as usual. And to that other Lain, how deluded do you have to be to actually think a random generic coronavirus is going to genocide all the CoNsPiRaCy tHeOrIsTs on your behalf? Come back to planet earth whenever you're ready... Also, if anyone here actually believes anything the state and corpos tell us, they really don't belong on a cyberpunk-themed site. The second half of the compound is "punk" for a damn reason.

>>23349 You need to define what you mean by globalization then because I'm still using the old definition which means capitalism on steroids. I think you might be confusing ONE LUV new age hippies with anarchists anyway. Not the same thing at all.

>>23431 Exactly because they are paranoid, they are the least at risk. They'll be sitting in the basement with the ten years of canned goods and stockpile of ammunition they saved for this occasion, laughing at the sheeple like us who weren't prepared.

>>23446 "Anarchism" was co-opted as a hip label by Marxists and SocJus a good while ago. It's really hard to find actual traditional anarchists these days.

>>23299 >>23308 The United States Government is trying to get emergency powers, including one of the more alarming ones that you can be detained indefinitely during an emergency +1 year after. While I am not too concerned about the virus itself, the effects it has on culture is far more concerning. Due to the nature of sensationalist media, we are already seeing panic. The food industry is doing great, if you are in the trucking or transportation industry, the panic buying that people are doing means stores cannot keep the shelves stocked, and producers are buying up all the trucks that can, drivers are getting paid to illegally work overtime (and very large sums) just to keep the shelves stocked, because they are making so much money fines are just a small expense. I wonder how much prepper culture will explode (I vaguely remember the 2012 fad that went on) seeing how people are stockpiling equipment they are not even competent enough to use correctly, I wonder how much the consumer culture will move back into survival goods instead of luxury goods. The other concerning part is that people are no longer interacting face-to-face, to which one could presume they are only communicating via social media, else isolating themselves to the point of extreme stress and psychological breakdown. One sociological observation is that after a "Crisis" people band together, and resilience becomes a cultural concept where people care for each other (In the United States, crime went down following 9/11. And cultures that experience extremely traumatic scenarios will use socializing to normalize and effectively eliminate PTSD). I am interested to see how many people will develop some form of psychological trauma response thanks to coronavirus. Someone told me this morning that porn sites started giving away premium content for free, fuarrrking degenerates I did not confirm because I really could care less. It's like people cant go a single day without some kind of sexual release, and like other anons were saying hookup culture seems to be at least on hold.

>>23449 Thats straight out of deus ex, i also recently heard many such scifi like stuff is leaked to artists intentionally to manipulate the public, to some that is, others can learn the lessons.

>>23444 I'd have more respect for you conspiracy boys if you didn't just replace the state and corporate propaganda maaaaaaaan with random soykaf from youtube and 4chan. I've yet to see anybody get into conspiracy theories and actually become *more* scrutinizing instead of less.

>>23299 >fundamentally change for good. >fundamentally change for bad. >>23306 >COVID is not lethal enough to leave such a mark It is 100% lethal. Now it is lethal enough for you? No one "recovers". Once infected you have the disease for life. You'll find out later in the year if you didn't know this yet. People started behaving like the zombies you saw in movies when they realized they were going to die soon, so did whatever the fuarrrk they felt like - "T strains" or "Terminally strained people". e.g. Mass orgies in parks and other really weird soykaf. At the end of this month (March 2020) the infected will pass 1 million, and by mid April as the infected passes 10 million you will see every night as Purge night, until the days become Purge days also. You are being culled and sterilized. Feel free to soykaf on this post until it looks prophetic if you make it to the end of the year.

>>23421 ok, let's go through your scenario. Because some rich people are stupid and over-estimate benefit and under-estimate risk, they *must* have created a crisis they could not reasonably expect to control, in order to enact some sort of master plan that revolves around real estate. Meanwhile, what they lose is a market that was going great guns, which would have allowed them to pull large profits from much less risky maneuvers. Even if they had this master plan worked out, they could have just prepped it and *waited* for something of a similar magnitude to happen(lord knows they're coming fast these days) and not put in money into cooking up a bioweapon they couldn't control. Which sounds more likely, that there are some vultures taking advantage of a convenient pandemic, or that those vultures invented the pandemic? Which one requires them to take greater risks for the exact same benefit? If they're stupid enough to make such a bad call, how did they manage to pull it off? Think carefully. >>23425 cults of personality be cultin' >>23439 >looks like it was made in a lab I've seen that claim before, was it corroborated? Keep in mind that China's already trying to point fingers. >>23447 honestly I'd rather live while the livin's good than sit around waiting to die in a bunker. >>23449 > I am interested to see how many people will develop some form of psychological trauma response thanks to coronavirus. probably a lot. I've seen people say that we need to stay this way for *years*, and that's just intolerable. I don't think we could live this way for more than a couple months.

>>23454 >100% fatality rate, recovery is impossible and it keeps coming back until you die broof-a-doodle-doo I have heard this claim made about literally every virus that has emerged in the last 20 years

>>23455 You guys are mixing soykaf up. The economy is not stable either way. A crash was mandatory longterm. Using corona to blame everything on it is an easy way to get away with it while avoiding all guilt. The economy has been on life support for over 2 years now. People were already prepping for a crash. Corona is just a useful scapegoat and trigger to finally make it happen. I mean seriously, did you miss feds starting to pump trillions out now to keep it going? As for the second point, they have a viral lab in wuhan that has been said to have soykafty security 2 years ago already. Western virologists who worked there visiting warned about it. It's not the first case either. Germany had a rna-virus escape 1967 the lab, to this day it wrecks havoc on the african west coast. This is also why i have no positive outlook on this round. This soykaf is gonna stay with us.

>>23457 >You guys are mixing soykaf up. The economy is not stable either way. A crash was mandatory longterm. Using corona to blame everything on it is an easy way to get away with it while avoiding all guilt. The economy has been on life support for over 2 years now. People were already prepping for a crash. Corona is just a useful scapegoat and trigger to finally make it happen. I agree, but I think that anybody who was waiting for a crash would have waited for it to happen rather than try to hasten it. There was still money to be made while the economy was on life support.

>>23455 >I don't think we could live this way for more than a couple months. Try a week. You really must be a passive shut-in to think people are going to put up with this soykaf more than a single week. People I've talked to are already deciding to ignore the news and just continue on as normal. People with real jobs can't afford to sit in their mom's house watching anime.

>>23458 The gains right now are excellent. You can bet on losses too and they were very predictable for things like airlines. In general profit as an investor is made from a volatile market. You cant profit if its perfectly stable. And secondary every crash is a huge bargain sale if you have the breath to hold through the recession and buy at the bottom. It's a good thing for anyone with money. Honestly the only thing im worried about is police-state growing significantly bigger. The terrorism scare was a one-way street and i bet this will be the same.

>>23459 I am a bit of a shut-in, but I know that in a lot of places they're enforcing it with armed guards. I guess the extroverted types probably have even less of a stomach for it than I do

>>23461 Germany just announced 25.000€ fine for disobeying curfew.

>>23462 I'd disobey it consistently, every night, and then refuse to pay the fine. The only rights you have are the ones you're ready to fight for. The "first world" has been so cushy for so long that they've forgotten that.

>>23463 They must have some way of enforcing it. They'd either take your car or put you in jail I guess. It's not a speeding ticket. And simply breakin' the law like Judas Priest ain't the same as fighting for anything.

>>23464 Laws only work for so long as enough people follow them that the rest can be contained. If you want to change a law, you have to first make it unenforceable.

>>23465 Exactly my point. You simply breaking the law accomplishes nothing unless you get a thousand people to do it with you, or have people on the outside to raise a fuss when you've been arrested, and to work to convince others who are unconvinced that your cause is just. Marijuana is legal here. It didn't happen just because someone smoked it on the street corner one day.

>>23467 But if no one was willing to smoke it at all in the first place, it would still be illegal.

>>23469 What... people smoked in in secret. It became legal because there was an organized movement to change something, and finally even most conservatives here agreed that they had no problem with it. You running around with riot police or national guard chasing you while everyone watches it on TV does not change anything when people are afraid to leave their houses because of zomg germs. They will just write you off as a pointless trouble maker during a time of crisis. Go ahead though, I can't stop you.

>>23471 Nelson Mandela spent many years in prison due to blatantly breaking countless laws. And then he won.

>>23472 Oh my god... you didn't read a thing anyone said. Nelson Mandela had hundreds of thousands of supporters in his own country and plenty of international support, including world leaders. You going out and breaking curfew results in you going to jail, alone, and later being released to zero fanfare. You have not done the legwork of getting a movement of some kind to back you and in this case, jail will probably soon be the easiest place to catch the plague. Who will listen to you then, rather than saying "told you so". You do not understand the concept of civil disobedience, or how it works as a tactic, so don't preach to anyone about Nelson Mandela.

>>23474 I've already had "the plague," you fuarrrking sheep.

>>23474 Also, try reading about the propaganda of the deed and learning some theory instead of whingeing on about how anyone who disagrees with you is an idiot and will die horribly of quite possibly the least deadly "pandemic" in human history.

Maybe when a significant amount of people have caught it, survived and recovered, since they are no longer susceptible they can start filling in certain vital roles in society while everyone else remains indoors. This will be limited since they can still carry the germs even if they are immune now. That was a half-formed thought, just thought I'd throw it out there.

>>23477 It's a virus, not a germ. The only way you can really carry it if you've already had it is on your clothes (possibly), because your body will kill any virus that tries to set up shop inside.

>>23476 I know about "propaganda of the deed", what you need to learn about is tactics. The amount of radicals in history who tried your propaganda of the deed and accomplished nothing whatsoever beyond death and imprisonment far outweighs the number who succeeded. You're just arguing with other chantards on a website anyway. You're never going to act on any of these ideas.

>>23479 Then why did they rope off the seating areas in the mall? Inanimate objects like chairs and clothing and bathroom taps can't carry it? Why is everyone freaking out then?

>>23479 No. Where the fuarrrk do you even learn this? There are permanent retro-viruses that stay in your dna forever. Were have some in fact as part of our genome and they amplify our mutation rate.

>>23481 I'll act on the ideas I want to act on. But I'm not going to spin up some detailed account of everything I'll ever do and how when it would take a single warrant, if that, for the state to track me down and neutralize it all. But I guess you don't think about that sort of thing, because you're a law-abiding media-trusting good little liberal.

>>23483 First, coronaviruses are RNA viruses and don't/can't write to your DNA at all. Second, your DNA can't just hop from you to another person through the air at random, whether it has fragments of viral DNA in it or not.

>>23483 But you're not infectious with all those virii. Your immune system has eliminated the virii and your DNA repair mechanisms have made it so those chunks of DNA do not produce proteins. Plus: Coronavirii are not retrovirii.

>>23486 First you were talking about all viruses, second the whole point of retroviruses is they can randomly go live and flare up at which point its not just in your dna. It basically writes itself into dna and then your regular apparatus can create copies of it whenever it stumbles upon it and assembles the rna. Covid is not a retrovirus but it doesnt mean you are save. Flu is a good example. You dont even get permanent immunity because it mutates and new strains restart the entire process.

>>23488 "usual" flus are not as dangerous as this virus because so many people have already gotten similar diseases, it's much easier to adapt new antibodies and fight the virus. Right now nobody has any immunity to this virus, which is why it's so dangerous.

If this has ADE then society will never be the same. It will be impossible to vaccinate against and each following infection will be worse. We'd probably end up in some ultra distant world where a police state rigidly watches and seperates everyone 24/7. There would be no rebelling because this is the ONLY way to prevent extinction.

>>23492 Frankly if that turns out to be the case I will just say fuarrrk it, carry on eithout these crazy measures, with a little better hygiene . I think most people will think the same. The reason why people are okay with it now is because they believe it is temporary.

>>23491 That's why it's so dangerous to immune-compromised people, who struggle to mount a defense against novel pathogens. People with healthy immune systems are fine for the opposite reason; children, with their highly adaptive/"plastic" immune responses, especially so.

This whole thread is a virus, what is even happening anymore?

>>23494 People quickly become okay with authoritarianism when they feel threatened. Some are already begging for martial law.

>>23498 authoritarianism, sure, but not with this "social distancing" and quarantine stuff. people are naturally social animals. Social distancing goes against our biological programming.

>>23499 not him, but I've heard news medias already asking the the government to take "drastic measures" to slow this down. In some of the democratic states they are literally giving people no other options but to stay inside or face consequences, and some people are fine with it. I think this virus will get people prone to listening to the government "for their own good", I could be wrong tho

>>23501 yes but I believe that, over time, people will be much less okay with it. Especially when it becomes clear that the danger has passed(in a month or two, depending on where you live)

>>23499 People will eventually become accustomed to it. VR chatting would replace in person hangouts and intimacy. In order to hang out with friends you need state approval that is handed out for good behavior and a thorough screening. Death penalty is brought back and dished out liberally for those who move improperly. And the worst part is, once again, this is the ONLY possible way to prevent human extinction if the virus has ADE. All other ideologies will become immediately irrelevant.

>>23502 that is a big if. No evidence shows a current cure.

>>23503 It's crazy how sane this sounds, I can even see automation taking care of everyday need now that people are quarantined. There just seem to be something bigger behind this

>>23503 Thats bullshit. Small groups can safely interact as units. Even if the whole unit dies it doesn't affect the whole. There is zero justification to put everyone in solitary confinement.

>>23506 Who exactly are you defending? the government? you know not everybody is thinking sane about this right?

>>23503 Those are poor replacements and everyone knows it. I don't believe it is possible to get people used to such levels of distance. I'm a very introverted person and it is already giving me a little bit of cabin fever. I believe we will see giant riots if people perceive the quarantine to be unnecessary, and I believe that eventually they will(whether it's true or not). Please note that China has already started loosening its restrictions. >And the worst part is, once again, this is the ONLY possible way to prevent human extinction if the virus has ADE. All other ideologies will become immediately irrelevant. If it's between extinction and living like a caged animal, I choose extinction. I think most people would choose the same way. Please note that the aftermath of the Black Death plague was actually lowered authoritarianism(in most places). Most governments fell apart, and those that remained ended up having a much more powerful peasant class due to die-offs. >>23504 cure shmure. Once the first wave of the outbreak subsides, a virus without a cure just becomes another risk you take in your daily life.

Thoughts? https://news.sky.com/story/german-chancellor-angela-merkel-in-quarantine-after-doctor-tests-positive-for-coronavirus-11962030

>>23509 I think it's extremely odd that virtually every world leader seems to have a close acquaintance with it, but none of them seem to have it themselves. Also, fuarrrk Merkel and the CDU.

>>23430 Could you absolute cattle niggers stop posting obfuscated article links please? Archive.today is behind Cloudflare with extremely retarded settings lately, even their onion domain, which makes it inaccessible for most non nigger cattle persons, and instead of posting the direct source itself or at least an archive link that preserves original address, or archive.org caption, using any of the other dozen web archival sites, you do the worst thing and choose an obfuscated archive.today URL. Don't be a cattle nigger. Thanks.

>>23454 >Feel free to soykaf on this post until it looks prophetic if you make it to the end of the year. After reading your post, the first word to come to my mind: Nostradumbass Present Day, Present Time! AHAHAHAHAHA!

So much doom and gloom in this thread, and the street corner prophets chastising the uncouth world for what they perceive to be the causes. It's mighty sad for the level of quality I've come to expect from lainchan. We're going to stay home for a little bit, a vaccine will be engineered, and society will churn back to life as bright and vibrant as ever. This isn't the 1600s, it's the 2020s.

>>23565 >so much doom and gloom >society will churn back to life as bright and vibrant as ever >bright and vibrant as ever >it's the 2020's

>>23565 This is a second 911. The govt won't give back control. vaccines are poison and the pandemic is fake. just like how 911 was a deliberate demolition.

>>23570 The funny farm called, they're looking for you.

>>23569 You must be a basement dweller

>>23565 Realistically, vaccines will probably amount to being a means to calm people down. Vaccinating against this would be pointless because it'll mutate too much. It's so deadly now because our bodies aren't used to anything like it; most likely, the virus will mutate into a less dangerous form in order to further its own existence and will become another seasonal nuisance. The real reason to worry is because states will use our fear to push "emergency measures" that they never roll back and bills that were waiting for a crisis to push through under people's noses. Like the EARN IT bill that's in the USA.

>>23598 Coronaviruses are actually very common. Why is there so much disinfo out there about this particular bug?

>>23598 >Realistically, vaccines will probably amount to being a means to calm people down. Vaccinating against this would be pointless because it'll mutate too much. It's so deadly now because our bodies aren't used to anything like it; most likely, the virus will mutate into a less dangerous form in order to further its own existence and will become another seasonal nuisance. whether vaccination in general would work is impossible to say, even whether a particular vaccine works is extremely difficult to determine. >The real reason to worry is because states will use our fear to push "emergency measures" that they never roll back and bills that were waiting for a crisis to push through under people's noses. Like the EARN IT bill that's in the USA. This is true. This whole virus panic thing will be over in a few months, the tightening of the noose will be with us for the foreseeable future.

>>23606 >why is there so much disinfo out there about this particular bug? It's being used to push political agendas.

>>23609 A vaccine won't work. There's over a hundred known strains at this point. >>23610 Political agenda AND social engineering the populous. People have been getting really uppity over the last few years, and it's time to segregate them and prevent any organizing or uprising.

>>23613 >there are over 100 known strains at this point post proof. I've only seen one paper that claimed there were two distinct strains and it was widely discredited by epidemiologists.

>>23615 Your one paper is incorrect, this is well understood. Don't spread misinformation. It's referenced in this article under "Herd Immunity and Virus Mutation" (chart 6 shows it graphically). https://medium.com/@tomaspueyo/coronavirus-the-hammer-and-the-dance-be9337092b56 . >This graph represents the different mutations of the virus. You can see that the initial strains started in purple in China and then spread. Each time you see a branching on the left graph, that is a mutation leading to a slightly different variant of the virus. >This should not be surprising: RNA-based viruses like the coronavirus or the flu tend to mutate around 100 times faster than DNA-based ones—although the coronavirus mutates more slowly than influenza viruses. >Not only that, but the best way for this virus to mutate is to have millions of opportunities to do so, which is exactly what a mitigation strategy would provide: hundreds of millions of people infected. >That’s why you have to get a flu shot every year. Because there are so many flu strains, with new ones always evolving, the flu shot can never protect against all strains.

>Donald Trump wants to end the quarantine early >Republicans are saying that the elderly should sacrifice themselves for the sake of the economy >Democrats keep blocking any stimulus bills because they aren't woke enough What the fuarrrk? This is going to be catastrophic for the USA. Literally millions of Americans will choke to death on their own blood because extroverts can't stand a week alone + Republicans can't think of anything more than economy + Democrats refuse to compromise on diversity pandering. It's going to be a nightmare if this trajectory doesn't change. It would take the USA a lifetime to recover, assuming it doesn't just balkanize.

>>23616 >This should not be surprising: RNA-based viruses like the coronavirus or the flu tend to mutate around 100 times faster than DNA-based ones—although the coronavirus mutates more slowly than influenza viruses. vaccination works fine for influenza virii. Why not coronavirus?

>>23625 >vaccination works fine for influenza virii Pppfffff bahahahah Citation needed Come on, let me call you on that baseless bullshit

>>23625 The vaccination only works for the most common flu virus, there's many of them every year. Your chances of catching flu with the vaccine are only lowered relatively based on the average base rate of the strain selected for immunization. The Kung Flu is mutating rapidly, and each strain is geographically segregated, but the strains are spreading wildly. It would require several vaccines to have an appreciable impact.

Oho. The century is still very young. 4/5ths left to go. This is doubtlessly big, mainly because we have decided as a herd mentality that this is big. But the biggest thing is probably going to be some other ramification of climate change. Hell, this is likely influenced strongly by climate change (and also obviously globalization, which is one of the fundamental causes of climate change). There is still worse to come. I'm not dooming, and I know there's always been lots of catastrophe obsessions in the past. But this one is credible, and nobody is doing anything. Ironically this disease is helping more than any measure humans have taken, but that's not going to last. Eventually the system will become too stressed from "sheltering in place" and they'll abandon the epidemiologists and medical professionals and go back to globalized industry. They'll decide to cut loose the few million old and weak, things will stabilize somewhat (although perhaps not return to the exact same normal we were used to) and emissions will ramp up again. We're going to have a reckoning about this sometime in this century. Maybe not the final reckoning, but something much worse than this.

>>23622 >Democrats refuse to compromise on diversity pandering. The fuarrrk is this? That's not what it was about. It had to do with how the cash wont help average citizens most just going to businesses.

>mainly because we have decided as a herd mentality that this is big lold, how did you miss all the people ignoring it? Media is bitching 24/7 for not enough panic cause people still go to the beach etc. , italy got the way it is cause they still held family gatherings and didnt give a fuarrrk. The only one making it big is media&politics forcing people to care with fines.

>>23625 >Vaccination works fine Mercury and aluminum injected into children repeatedly ain't too grand, but there's also an immunogenic damage component as well as immune mediated alteration in function. Look up microglial priming by Blaylock in particular. There are a number of mechanisms. Nonlinear dose response of aluminum. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/27908630 Neuroimmunology https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3589867/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3784951/ Immunoexcitotoxicity https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5909100/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3307240/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4609793/ Hepatitis B vaccine induced brain dysfunction. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/27501128 https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/29751176 You have the well reported alteration of antigen presentation in the gut, massive inflammation. That's against a background of other environmental factors which destroy proper gut flora. Section 13 of every vaccine insert, as its sole content, contains a variant of the following: "[Vaccine] has not been tested for mutagenic potential, carcinogenic potential, or impairment of fertility." Look up immunocastration. A variant of this was tested on girls in Kenya. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/?term=immunocastration Inserts are here: https://www.fda.gov/vaccines-blood-biologics/vaccines/vaccines-licensed-use-united-states Purported vaccine content is here: https://www.cdc.gov/vaccines/pubs/pinkbook/downloads/appendices/B/excipient-table-2.pdf Vaccine manufacturers were given blanket legal immunity over 30 years ago. Vaccines are thus a liability free product. To sue for damages you have to go through a lengthy process up against DOJ lawyers in a special vaccine court. If you win the settlement comes out of a pool allocated with a small fee per vaccine. Flu shot has been shown to be largely ineffective, completely ineffective over 65. Wipond 2018 - Reporting flu vaccine science https://www.bmj.com/content/360/bmj.k15.full Historical data on disease rates indicates vaccines are introduced only after other measures have reduced rates of disease. Actual treatments and prevention have been suppressed in favor of vaccination, simply things like vitamin C and vitamin A for measles. Polio was successfully treated and partially reversed in its flaccid paralysis staged with injections of sodium ascorbate and a small amount of copper salicylate. Polio itself only became an issue after other vaccines, indicating immune disruption and inability to handle organochloride pesticide bombardment, diethylstilbestrol, mercury in the water from mining operations, people were putting mercurochrome on open wounds, gargling with it, DDT in the wallpaper, etc. A matter of total toxic load. Contamination with the old polio vaccine with SV40 gave many people cancer. Think about those in your family who are dying of cancer in their 40's to 60's. Historically vaccine contamination has been frequent. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/10472327 https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5404636/ https://doi.org/10.1016/j.biologicals.2014.07.003 Notably some independent testing found various "contaminants" in human vaccines, but not veterinary. http://medcraveonline.com/IJVV/IJVV-04-00072.php Worth noting as well, prior to the "cutter incident" work was being done to weaponize polio at the Rockefeller Institute for Medical Research. Risk of severe side effects: https://pediatrics.aappublications.org/content/134/2/325 https://www.eurekalert.org/pub_releases/2019-04/pas-nrr042619.php Infection in fully vaccinated children, increased susceptibility to other infections after vaccination, role of the vaccinated as asymptomatic carriers or "resevoirs" https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2627963/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/20200027 https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5378080/ Other resources: Look up Suzanne Humphries, MD. Her book "Dissolving Illusions" as well. "Murder by Injection" by Eustace Mullins. For those who like to complain about "conspiracy", he's simply compiling the contents of documents found in the Library of Congress. Quite a lot of information https://ses.library.usyd.edu.au/bitstream/handle/2123/20198/Rogers_T_thesis.pdf Vaccination is a primary component of a house of cards. An excerpt from a post by another Anon: There are plenty of evidence vaccines are not to be trusted without a case-by-case analysis and personal opportunity-cost analysis. [...] Further, I strongly believe that negative effects are severely underreported because of the shunning effect that the population has decided on and the cult-like adherence to the idea that vaccines are perfect. Moreover, even if an event is believed to be caused to a vaccine, what are the parents (or worse, kid - who doesn't understand these things or why that would matter) going to do? They'll nurse the kid to health or go to the hospital and that's it. No record of the link between vaccine and event will ever be made.

>>23667 Yeah. It's hard to argue with the fact I don't know anyone with polio or smallpox, though. Flu is different; it reached a critical mass of spread long before modern medicine and thus mutates within hosts in the wild too often to make a vaccine that eradicates it. Covid is likely similar. We're probably just going to have to live with this from now on.

>>23664 People ignored it early at the moment they should have taken it seriously--containment was still possible then--and then freaked out about it in a delayed fashion when it's essentially impotent to do so. I believe the cognitive bias at hand is called "hyperbolic discounting." At this point, the thing will spread and shut down hospitals and cause a few million deaths. Most likely. But people going bananas and only listening to doctors and not economists will not fix that. And I'm not just talking about the stock market; we should have a system that doesn't kill millions when the economy goes bust, but we have what we have at this moment and we must play the cards we're dealt. Or else fight for extreme changes right now. Which is unlikely when people can't organize or engage in direct action outside their homes. We will "flatten the curve" but we will also fatten the curve. We've all seen that graph. What happens if the flat curve gets longer but still doesn't quite dip below the horizontal line of maximum hospital capacity? We will get hospitals that are inundated for months instead of weeks. We will. It's happening. And the economic forces of.. y'know.. having to pay rent and eat and stuff--that will ruin our ability to socially distance the way the authorities naively advocate. We'll do too little too late once more and we'll not only lose a few percent to the virus; we'll lose enormous amounts of people to hospital delays. And then we'll lose many more to poverty, and the ramifications of that will last for generations. Remember how long the great depression and the dust bowl affected those of the 20th century. That's the real killer, damn it. People act like a crashing economy is a problem for rich stockholders. No. They weather well, hold out, buy while it's low, and end up ahead at the end of the day with a very tidy profit. Happened in the 1930s as well. It's absolutely fatal for the poorer among us, however. This is what happens when our financial instruments are tangled up in everybody's livelihoods and indeed our currency itself. I say the authorities are naive because they only seem to value one category of expert opinion at a time. Works better on cable news. Today they are all about epidemiologists and doctors, but it's too late for them to fix it. Soon there will be a storm of economic experts and pundits, but then it'll be too late for them as well. And most importantly, they're all out of touch with the realities of common working people. They think people can just work from home and order delivery. That the only challenges are bougie "anxiety" and self-care. They freeze mortgages but not rent, while the people who can't work from home are realistically all renters. They just don't understand how the other half lives. They don't know they're signing a mass death warrant, and on top of that they're being sanctimonious about it too. Acting like everybody who is persisting with their lives is arrogant, careless, wanton. They can't (or won't) even understand that some people have no choice. They have to support their families, and even though they hate to do it they'll gladly risk the life of 2% of the general populace if you hold a knife to their loved ones. The shelter in place thing is obviously doomed. There's no way people will do it for as long as needed. It's a non-starter. We need to either a.) enact wartime-style expansions of medical infrastructure to deal with whatever fuсking curve it throws at us or b.) enact unprecedented social protections and essentially make half the country a ward of the state for a year and a half. The US government at least has made clear they intend to do neither. So we're going to crater the economy as long as we can stand and then do another Italy regardless once the general populace can no longer stand the heat. We're using Italy as a warning, but what we are doing to avoid it is probably even worse. Flattening the curve is only worth it if a state can enforce it very strictly. Otherwise we'll just prolong the crisis. An overloaded hospital is a binary state. Either they have capacity or they don't. If the curve is still over that line, we've made a grave mistake and should just accept our fate and lift the quarantine and take the hit. Because it will happen eventually when the populace revolts. And they definitely will if we do this for eighteen fuсking months. May as well make it quick if it's still going to be just as painful.

I dont know about century. I do know 9/11 was enough to shape a decade for America and that was a day, a global phenomena and of this length will surely shape more than that.

>>23671 >We're probably just going to have to live with this from now on. Is this what the media is saying? Genuine question, not a comment on you.

>>23673 One could make an argument for opportunism. One could make an argument for intent.

>>23674 Some are, some aren't. But "coronavirus" isn't a specific strain; it's a large group of viruses. We're seeing a novel mutation of one right now. We saw others in recent history that nearly (but didn't quite) spread to pandemic status. But they do seem to share the traits of flu in that there are too many wild hosts (of multiple species, it turns out) and too many variant strains to contain. One can't train human antibodies on such a rapidly-diversifying organism with vaccines, unfortunately. We can try to enact the strategy of racing to formulate a new one for the most widespread new strain each season, like we do for the flu--but it won't ever get rid of the flu for good. Nor will it prevent some people from getting other more rare strains of the flu from time to time, even assuming a 100% vaccination rate. We could sure use a penicillin-style discovery for a real antiviral drug, but viruses are so strange and varied due to their nature as hardly being living organisms at all; more like they're anomalous, organic capsules of genetic information. They're so fundamental that it's outrageously hard to figure out a drug that targets them specifically without also destroying parts of your cells as well. All we've managed to reliably combat them is to give our own naturally-evolved and (usually) very discerning immune system a crash-course. Tutor that system on how to recognize a very specific strain with very specific markers. It's miraculous for certain diseases, but it's highly contagious yet not-as-fatal ones that proliferate and mutate too fast to get them all in one generation, wipe it out for good.

>>23661 Pelosi refused to compromise on adding a section that said that minority owned companies and banks had increased priority.

USA infections seem to have gone exponential.

>>23496 City kids yelling at each other to cope as far as I can tell any more. Dont do Marxism, kids. It rots your brain.

>>23679 Ugh. I'm on the left (the real left damn it) and I fuсking hate Pelosi. All she wants to do is pander to wealthy, coastal fashion-progressives and means-test everything and keep it from actually helping anybody. The dumbass libs have really figured out a way to get all the PR of doing progress or whatever without having to actually do any work or spend money on poor people and funnel it into their cronies instead. They all need to catch this virus from their little communal bowl of jelly beans and choke on their own foaming blood. God damn bunch of freaks. I mean minority-owned banks? If they own a bank, they aren't in need of help. They act like they care about minorities but they really only care about the ones wearing nice button-down shirts with french cuffs and suits and pointing at quarterly earning graphs in corporate stock photos. They wouldn't spit in a poor minorities' ear if their brain was on fire. Couldn't give less of a ѕһіt about the ones that are actually hurting, black or white or whatever in-between. Fuсk 'em. Fuсk 'em all.

>>23687 Yeah, the wealthy bougie ones seem to think the biggest challenge of routing the whole economy is merely getting bored and doing self-care while being stuck in bed watching netflix and "working from home." (Hint: if you can work from home, you have a bullѕһіt job. I know I do.) They think being vaguely anxious and scared is the biggest risk of all. But they're oversocialized and neurotic, so it wouldn't even matter if the disease happened or not. I was raised in a trailer park. Got lots of friends still there; I got lucky and got out. They're all basically becoming homeless as we speak. They are the ones who will have to cope with truly horrible ѕһіt in the coming months and years. I'm so sick of seeing wealthy little media-industry strivers complain about staying at home being so hard and then turning around and shaming people for having to go out and work or take part in culture so there's still something left after the virus kills a small sliver of the population. Yes, millions is still a small sliver. Use proportional statistics, not straight numbers for Christ's sake. But it ain't Marxism. They aren't Marxist. They take on the aesthetic and terminology of Marx because they're bored to death and irony-poisoned and desperate for purpose. They're wealthy without understanding it, unmoored and adrift. That certain kind of rich kid who nonetheless acts poor around everyone else and complains about how broke they are even though you saw their mom drop them off in a brand-new Porsche or whatever. They wear worn-out jeans but forget they're still wearing designer shoes. It's part of a pretense. Real Marxists are out there organizing ways for people to rent strike so they don't get evicted because of this damn stupid quarantine. People who can't make rent now out of no fault of their own because the market has collapsed around their ears by decree from above.

>>23690 I can work from home, Im a server admin for a ship building company with govt contracts. Im onsite until the county shuts down and spent the last 3 weeks getting the disaster plan in place and hardware for 230 people so they can work from home. The only option is to isolate and let this burn itself out, but the "lol, It doesn't effect my age group" is destroying that chance to make the pain less by taking it now instead of dragging it out. The second wave of infection is already on the way to university everywhere thanks to the spring break crowd. So buckle up, because WE screwed up as well and now we will all pay. Sometimes you simply have to do what you have to do and prepare for the worst, but never think that things will not change.

I don't understand why we are always assuming the number of hospital beds(which the whole disaster is predicated on) is assumed to be constant in all projections. Do they think it's just not possible to upgrade the medical infrastructure? Didn't they enact war powers in the US to do exactly that? What the fuarrrk is up with Americans and having soykafty healthcare

No way in hell we're getting off that easy. Neural implanting, genetically engineered babies, ai integration with human consciousness, political tension rising in asia and europe, possible collapse of the international banking system with 0% interest rates for 15 years. This is exciting because it's new. The chances this isn't just another event in history is very small like we think of the spanish flu today. Don't fall for the hysteria. This thing is bad but things haven't even come close to cracking as bad as they can and will this century.

I have to begrudgingly agree. I'm a libertarian and I don't like the way this is progressing at all! First of all, I don't really see how this outbreak is an argument against libertarianism or leftist anarchism, but I can see how the majority of the population would think so, since what most people are probably thinking right now is "thank god we have this government telling us what to do! otherwise we would've all been infected!". This coronavirus outbreak sounds eerily like the beginning of some dystopian post apocalyptic novel. We're already being forced to stay at home by the government, and people are actually doing it without question. This could very well lead to a big brother style government, where everyone takes what the government says as 100% facts, no question, and anyone who questions it is erased from existence. Think I'm acting crazy? Well think about it! I'm gonna give one big "what if" scenario: the coronavirus gets eliminated by brute force (killing everyone infected), the government lies about the coronavirus still being out there so that we're forced to stay in our homes (the purpose of this being so the government can do all their usual shady deal behind our backs. If everyone is locked inside their homes, it'd be practically impossible for them to get caught), the government buys out all the journalists and news sites so that they can brain wash us with both propaganda and fake news, telling us that it's "too dangerous" to go outside, and that's why we've been locked inside our homes for years without any sign of ever being able to go back outside, eventually, people get so used to this new lifestyle that they don't even question when they're gonna be able to get out, and lastly, anyone who get's too close to revealing the truth gets killed, and the government could just say it was to protect us from the, "still ongoing", virus. Do I sound crazy? Maybe, lol. Still, you gotta admit this'd be a great science fiction novel.

>>23700 The people aren't that brainwashed. I just went for a walk. I live in a lockdown order area and kids are playing in the park. We were living in a dystopia before this situation ever happened. The majority now are just as cynical and bitter as the fringes used to be.

>>23700 >I get my political views from gut feelings and works of fiction >Why yes I am a libertarian, how could you tell?

>>23700 If you're a libertarian you will probably think is dangerous. All central banks started to print money in alarming quantity, governments started to hand out free money and all kind of financial life-boats to companies and the people alike, paying obligations like loans, rents, etc are suspended, while at the same time people want to buy as many from everything as they can. This is the best recipe ever for hyperinflation. Hyperinflation is the best recipe for a long and rough financial crisis, and a long and rough financial crisis is the best recipe for psycho extremist groups and suicidally power-hungry leaders getting power over the whole world( ok i know, today's leaders are those too, but i mean even much more), then hello and welcome world war 3.

>>23691 "lol, it doesn't affect my age group" is not destroying that chance. What is destroying that chance is that we have literally no damn infrastructure to keep people sheltered and alive through months of quarantine. Why did anybody think this would just work? Not everybody can work from home, get money, make rent. This was doomed for the start and it was not because of attitudes. It was because the quarantine plan wasn't a plan at all. There were no provisions to make it realistic and workable. It's just an order to stay home and watch your family get hungry and evicted. Of fuсking course it isn't gonna work. But congrats on your ship building company preparing and helping its workers stay employed at home, that is truly helpful for society. But this plan was a crock of ѕһіt from day one. Just because doctors say quarantine doesn't mean everybody magically can do it. Anyone who thought that would work is either dumb or privileged and ignorant of the realities of most of people's lives in the US.

>>23698 What the fuсk is up with Americans and having ѕһіtty healthcare? Lmao it's our whole schtick. It's our thing. We're going to burn this country to the ground instead of using massive social programs to expand medicine and build capacity and enact a plan that would actually work instead of this quarantine dumbassery. We're just sitting around pretending that this social distancing can miraculously last long enough. Somehow. It's 1000% fuсked. I have so many friends who are already evicted and it's not even the end of the month. People are going to riot.

>>23315 Any sort of preventative measure will look like an overreaction if it works.

You're a fool if you think there is any current realistic solution other than letting this thing run its course and burn itself out. Working age people will be fine, that's what really matters.

>>23679 Pelosi simply offered some guidelines on what the Democrats want. Right now, the Bill's in the Senate, and they appear to be reaching a conclusion soon. Out of curiosity, where did you hear the "minority-owned" stuff? Not that I don't believe, you, I just don't want to go through the bill's 1,400 pages. Sources: "How the House Democrats' stimulus plan compares to the Senate's": https://www.politico.com/news/2020/03/23/house-democrats-stimulus-senate-coronavirus-145388 "Negotiators on '2-yard-line'": https://www.politico.com/news/2020/03/24/congress-coronavirus-emergency-package-146066 Also, Pelosi isn't "refusing to compromise". She's saying she's willing to let the bill go to a unanimous vote, which you don't do if you don't want to compromise.

>>23711 Found it. Derp. https://www.essence.com/news/politics/nancy-pelosi-stimulus-package-minority-bank-provision/ It seems like it's *a* part of the House package, but something that can be negotiated. If the Senate bill goes as planned, there aren't many reasons to believe *this* is the thing that sinks the bill in the house Source: https://www.essence.com/news/politics/nancy-pelosi-stimulus-package-minority-bank-provision/

>>23712 I mean I hope to be pleasantly surprised, but we know Pelosi's track record. She always does the neolib thing of pandering to corporate special interests and lobbies while means-testing to death any bill that could actually manage to help people. She'll gladly use an illusion of compromise to shift that blame from herself. It's part of the democrat centrist playbook. I have no hope that what she brings to the table will significantly help the country during this time. They're the most disgusting careerists. At least the Republicans look you in the eyes while they're fuсking you up the ass.

>>23613 yes social engineering on steroids they are going full technocracy with mandatory vaccination ,digital health certficates & more surveillance based on digital IDs . https://www.technologyreview.com/s/615370/coronavirus-pandemic-social-distancing-18-months/ this is going to be the new normal!!!!!

This civilization would have collapsed on itself sooner or later. Humans live so distant from nature, cut down woods and build roads and cities everywhere, it was only a question of time. The most sensible thing to do is to let it all collapse in on itself and move out as far from civilization as possible. Human beings will learn the error of their ways only the hard way. Rather than just stopping to live in such an unnatural way they hope some gadget or whatever will fix it, but the truth is no gadgets or whatever will ever fix the situation since its broken at the core. Even though they have technology and power at levels that are almost unimaginable, they still heavy rely on humans to run their technology for them. Right now the chances to just sabotage modern society are good, the cops are busy and all the economy is collapsing all it needs is to push it over the edge. The gov might think they can push whatever measures they want but the more difficult it gets for them the more faulty the system will be. Keeping the system busy until parts of it are simply exhausted to a point where it simply breaks down is the winning move right now.

>The prevailing ideology of our time - neoliberalism - is quickly showing its catastrophic failure to function against any sort of setback I don't think it was ever supposed to work if half of the production is gone. The thing about liberalism is that it can get up and running relatively fast - just look how Europe became the second biggest market on the planet with the highest quality of life 40 years after being ravaged by war. > It's also a pretty serious blow for left anarchists and libertarians, who are quickly finding themselves unable to justify their position in the face of a pandemic Anarchists never could really justify their position. Liberals have to remind the public that this whole soykafshow started thanks to an authoritarian government that wouldn't allow people to freely discuss and prepare for a weird new disease in the name of maintaining order and unity. >once this is over and the world will be another shade more authoritarian for the foreseeable future This is the thing I really fear. >Or do you think it'll prove to be nothing in a few weeks and life will go on as usual? This isn't the first world wide pandemic nor it will be the last one. Life will go, the world will keep on turning regardless of how many people die. The world was already heading to a more authoritarian state with indiscriminate mass surveillance. This is simply accelerating things.

>>23372 UBI doesn't work and will never work for the same reason that printing more money doesn't work.

>>23401 >>23438 Cells are constantly producing protein chains to sustain and multiply the cell. Viruses hijack the RNA chains to force the cell to build copies of the virus. What scientists do to edit genes is to inject a virus that has been engineered to target and replace specific parts of the RNA only so when the cell divides, the new cell is now modified. This leaves markers behind, as all cellular life needs specific markers at the beginning and end so they're read correctly. If COVID-19 was really an engineered virus, researchers studying it would've found out. But they haven't. Because it's not engineered.

>>23691 Good for you. Please tell me how can I be a barista from home. Meanwhile, back at the real world, most people work in service-related stuff. Especially countries and cities that depend on tourism will be impoverished thanks to kung flu. A lot of people that works in services are going to be left out of work. Small- and medium-sized companies will go bankrupt and so will most self-employed. And when the low- and medium-class waste all of their saving sustaining themselves through the quarantine(s), big corporations will lose customers and fire at least some of the high and mighty IT workers. This quarantine is completely unsustainable past a month or two. France is attempting to pay wages but that will come back to bite them in the ass later. There is simply no infrastructure to maintain people isolated for months. Not to mention that this isolation is awful for people with anxiety disorders, depression, schizophrenia, bipolar disorder, anger management issues and all sorts of mental illnesses. Plus it's damaging to kids to be isolated and without any form of physical exercise. The quarantine is going to kill more people and ruin more lives than the virus itself.

>>23729 Youre stuck in 1900. Nowadays can sequence custom rna strings rather cheap. Infact you as a private person can even order sequences and the companies doing it are obliged by gov to screen orders for soykaf like antrax because its absolutely possible to make diseases if you dont filter it out.

Saw today paprika 50% up in price. Soon all imported food should get hit. Same time our own farmers need help soon for harvest but the seasonal immigrant workers cant enter the country currently . I dont see the fresh unemployed dong well as replacement. Interesting times ahead.

>>23730 >this isolation is awful for people with schizophrenia Evidently so: >>23733

>>23731 It still leaves markers behind. >>23730 I suspect this is why China resumed production and is desperately trying to hide the new cases in Wuhan. There are rumors that the CCP regime is actively prohibiting new tests to be carried and stopped counting new cases.

Mainstream sites slowly throwing the idea around that social distancing will become a new normal, It's finally our world, we've had decades of preparation.

>>23737 Errors can happen but dont have to. You can get clean sequences out of sequencers. That's why the entire discussion boils down to how likely is it to develop naturally based on genetic distance. You can't proof soykaf with certainty. It's just a probability game. That aside you can help horizontal gen transfer in the lab. You literally cant proof if its from a lab or not looking at it. The only thing that remains is that the circumstantial evidence that they have a viral lab that was known for bad security in that exact town and that it wouldn't be the first time a virus escaped from a lab. Usually its just not as big of a deal.

>>23738 I don't think you realize what that means. normal person regulations will hit your livestyle and your niche will get destroyed. It's not becoming your world. Your world will be taken from you.

>>23728 you're right. We should abolish private property, that's the only real solution.

>>23738 It will never become normal. Mass hysteria, cabin fever, and suicides would follow from this level of isolation after a couple months. It would probably be more dangerous than the virus. Not to mention that nobody would be able to pay their bills, overall efficiency would plummet, and the recession we're seeing would continue indefinitely. Most people are hard-wired for socializing. Antisocial people like us that post on obscure imageboards are outliers. Most people are right on the edge of snapping already. This can never be normal.

>>23728 Most UBI plans are funded by taxes and not money printing, and are perfectly sustainable. UBI is just one example of how resources could be allocated efficiently without the economy running at full capacity though. The specific method doesn't matter. The point is, it's absurd to think the majority of bullshit our efforts are expended on is actually necessary for people to continue living. Our production efficiency is enough to provide for everyones basic needs hundreds of times over. People will not die because of restaurants, hotels, airlines, gamestop, and other ultimately useless businesses going bankrupt. If they die it will be because society deprived them of abundantly available basic needs as punishment for being unable to have a job, not because of the economic collapse itself. But since we live in democracies, and those people can vote to not die, it is impossible for this to happen on a large scale. "Work or die" on this level, is a totally empty threat. We can save millions of lives by shutting down the economy here, and the only cost is loss of unnecessary luxuries.

>>23743 >people can vote for what they want That's how our troubles started. What they choose and what benefits them are not correlated because most are financially illiterate.

keep in mind that the only reason this will be bad in the US(and most other third-world countries) is because the government is utterly incapable of making a reasonable decision.

>>23745 *the government and many citizens it baffles me how many people still don't take this seriously.

>>23622 >Literally millions of Americans will choke to death on their own blood You're being a little melodramatic there, nancy.

>>23751 Assuming a conservative 2% death toll and most of the country getting it (which will happen if Trump gets his way) a well of a population of 330 million, 6.6 million people will die from drowning in their own blood. But it's possible up to 15% of people will die because there will not be enough ventilators, putting that number at a staggering 50 million.

>>23753 So I guess you think we should turn all our rights over to big daddy government and ruin the economy to save a bunch of invalids.

>>23754 Stupid reactionary, if this happens then any sort of individualistic conservatism will be over permanently. This would make almost every state turn blue.

>>23755 I think you would be more comfortable over on plebbit.

>>23753 The best estimate epidemiologists are giving is half a million deaths in the US. It's not super hard knowledge to find.

>>23754 edgy

>>23733 For this "conspiracy theory" to work you would have to make millions of people lie, most of them being doctors and epidemiologists that show CT and xray scans of scarred lungs, genetics of virus vartiants and symptoms of people. You might not have anyone near your that has covid-19 but by current estimates of epidemiologists if we factor in the R0 of 5 and double time of 5 days after 5 and half months you would have 1.3 billion people infected if normal societal activity was done. First case was found out in november of 2019. Soon you will have more friends gasping for breath than those being normal.

>>23753 you forget that some states are being much more proactive than others. California has 50 million residents and a statewide lockdown order. >>23754 if you want to be wracked with pneumonia for 2 weeks, be my guest. Don't go forcing it on everyone else who likes to have functioning lungs though.

>>23754 >So I guess you think we should turn all our rights over to big daddy government and ruin the economy to save a bunch of invalids. So I guess you think that (in the possible worst case scenario) saving half a million+ of US citizens aren't worth it AND they are all to be regarded as "a bunch of invalids" for involuntarily getting themselves the virus, judging by how you arrange letters into sentences.

I went a little far with that statement. In all seriousness though what do you think we should do, how are we going to save all those people? Will it be worth it to destroy our economy and people's jobs, ruining their lives, to save a bunch of other - mostly elderly - people. While it sounds cold to say, many of the people that will be gravely affected by this virus will die of one thing or another within 5 or 10 years or so anyway. We should allow the government powers that could hurt us as a society for a long time, and seriously hamper younger people who will have to live with the results that long-term quarantine would cause? We're also talking about people's lives. It's not right to expect us as a society to suffer economic hardship to extend the lives of older generations a little bit longer. I feel like a lot of people who suggest doing things like that are probably a little more privileged than the vast majority of Americans out there in the workforce living paycheck to paycheck, and don't really have a proper view of how stopping people from being able to work will affect most of us.

>>23766 I meant to respond to >>23763

>>23763 Definitely don't agree that we should just cut 'em loose and leave them to die. But we shouldn't turn over rights for this. Rights that don't apply in an emergency were never rights at all. Also there's the little problem of how this quarantine won't work if we don't have some kind of state support to keep people housed and eating and stuff. It just won't. We can't make everyone socially distance long enough without that; the quarantine will have to be lifted early, and then full spread will happen just the same and we'll get the same damn result except now our economy is trashed and lots of people die of poverty. Suсkѕ.

>>23768 No right applies in an emergency over the right to live, so it's an empty speech what you have there.

>>23766 >>23768 1) the government needs to be ramping up medical capacity *now*. Social isolation was always going to be a temporary measure, a few weeks at most. The economy will be fine in a few weeks, assuming by "the economy" you mean services and not financial markets, which were fuarrrked anyway. 2) we can respect that quarantine is a good idea in many scenarios while also rejecting increased government powers. It's not "either lose all your freedoms or let people die", that is a false binary.

>>23772 *the economy will be fine in a few months

>>23768 >Rights that don't apply in an emergency were never rights at all. Inalienable rights have been demonstrably a lie in the US since the whiskey rebellion. It's foolish to assume the government has any pretenses of observing them in current society.

>>23768 >some kind of state support to keep people housed and eating and stuff What's wrong with that, seems like a much better solution.

>>23775 Everywhere has already done this. China forced factories to pay workers in Wuhan who weren't allowed to leave their house. It shows how soykaf our public infrastructure is when the Chinese can manage the same situation more efficiently.

>>23774 Yeah. Rights have always been a huge fuсking lie. The only way to have them respected is to revolt en masse and show the bastards what happens when they fuсkin mess around

>>23733 It is easier to release a bioweapon than to unite every nation's media and government in a massive propaganda campaign. It's even easier to take advantage of a naturally occurring pandemic.

>>23773 lol if you believe this you are increeeedibly dumb. This is going to be way worse of a recession than '08 and we never really got back from that. At least the bottom half of society didn't. This will likely be far worse. Economies don't really spring back that way. Ever. Why would you believe this?

>>23775 I don't think anything is wrong with it at all. I hope it happens and becomes an institution that lasts for generations after the virus blows over. I fuсking love socialism for real. Sick and tired of everyone being told they ought to soak the gears of the machine with their blood to lubricate it in return for a few bread crumbs. This is all fuсking doomed if we stay the course.

>>23771 What? Do you think there's literally nothing in the world worth dying for? This is such a craven philosophy.

>>23672 I come to the sad conclusion that our destiny is already marked. Coronavirus, listen to me carefully, it won't be the worst problem in two, three months, when we are in the height of social chaos. Many people will die due to the diseases that were already there, why? Because the hospitals will be full, and there will be few people. In my opinion, it is a profound naivety to believe that 1.5% can be expected to die soon and we will continue to maintain the capitalist economy as such, we are still human and it is difficult to control the media, hide the death figures etc., will prevent us from seeing people dropping dead on the street, at bus stations and on the subways. Nobody wants that, and people only keep the system as such because they believe that it is good for society, for each one, sacrificing 1.5% would be to throw at them what they really are for capital and the bourgeoisie. Nothing will go back to how it was before for most western countries. I even say, my dear friends, that this could be even worse than a war, as Merkel alluded to in the video below, after all the schizophrenia promulgated by the decadent capitalism of the last 40 years has destroyed people's imagination, zombified the unprecedented Western population. The result can only be a... zombie apocalypse.

>>23786 >the video https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IWZiolHnm-w&fbclid=IwAR1pufoHyKAWu4NQPKXRXb35Cu1VB_wX3DrEClIdpOycMLXqDOnZ-v5i1-8

>>23786 So a zombie apocalypse, as in the end of zombies?

>>23787 She never says anything beyond "many may die included your loved ones so cooperate together t o minimize it", and its otherwise just the usual , "more solidarity, we will make it together" is what she's been preaching as the solution since she got elected.

If soykaf is really hitting the fan, is there anything I can do now? Things like learning electrical skills, starting a small garden on my apartment balcony, and generally living more healthy? Or should I have been doing all of that and then some a long time ago to prepare and I'm more or less fuarrrked now?

>>23729 the virus may or maynot be engineered but my point was the panic is engineered and the suggested cures like more authoritarian measures , more survelance , digital ID systems had been created before the covid cricis. The panic is intensified by the media so that the people accept the new draconian laws without question .Do you really believe that the people in positions of power value human life and the laws they force upon us benefit us ?

>>23783 because this recession is totally different in character from the '08 recession. It's caused by an actual drop in spending. When everyone starts going back out again, the cause of the recession will be gone. Then again, I should never expect a capitalist economy to react sensibly to anything. >>23791 The best way to be prepared is to have strong community bonds and look out for each other.

It must be very obvious now to people how hard they've been fuarrrked by politicians/corporations/media during this whole thing. If not now, they'll probably realize soon. At the risk of being v&: how likely do you think people would seriously consider and then start to exercise violence against those in power?

Looks like this is the end of the American empire. China and Russia are winning over Europe with aid while NATO can't do anything.

>>23797 Extremely unlikely. What is happening is revealing huge flaws in the system, but the system is not the direct cause for it as conspicrap theories like to fanfic about.

>>23799 Direct cause for what, the virus? No, the revealing of huge flaws is what is upsetting. Regular, normal people "rightfully" presumed the government would have their backs if some incredible natural disaster like a pandemic were to kill their family and take away their jobs. When simple folk realize the government actively fuarrrked them hard out of security, and instead stuffed their own pockets, I'm thinking it's reasonable to believe that things could boil over.

>>23299 I am afraid that psychopaths will find a way to check who is and who is not infected, and have them isolate what they are and the rest work. Am I afraid of the possibility if infection? Obvious. But I am also afraid of returning to normalcy, which is an indescribable nightmare. I wish leisure for a year and a half. Between going back to the violence of normality or the potential violence that the social chaos of such a long quarantine can unleash, I still prefer the comfort of quarantine, it is very easy to choose between a maze with no way out and a maze that can have a way out, very easy. In any case, the disease will not go away and the tests are extremely ineffective. I really hope that the quarantines don't end so soon, I don't want to waste my time doing useless activity just to maintain a schizophrenic system.

I'm going to just leave this here without context or explanation. https://nationalinterest.org/blog/buzz/you-might-see-more-these-watching-you-thanks-coronavirus-136807 jk, the surveillance state is being shoehorned in retards. It's the convenient excuse the state has needed to cyberpunk up your existence. Get familiar with adversarial makeup or you're gonna get got.

>>23791 >If soykaf is really hitting the fan, is there anything I can do now? Things like learning electrical skills, starting a small garden on my apartment balcony, and generally living more healthy? Or should I have been doing all of that and then some a long time ago to prepare and I'm more or less fuarrrked now? Both, you better get to it while you can, garden work always pays off and you can do some nice electric stuff.

>>23299 The long term aftereffects, and utility, of the spectacle are what worry me the most. Read "The Shock Doctrine" by Naomi Klein. Basically the idea is pretty simple, when a population is exposed to large scale societal trauma it opens the opportunity to bring certain things on the table, reorganize society, and establish new norms not otherwise possible. The children will always remember that time the schools etc were shut down for covid-19. Everyone will always remember the flashing lights and endless stream of masks and death and that ball thing with the spikes all over it plastered all over the media 24/7. This is a powerful precedent you can draw on later. Next time you tell them to stay in their houses, and that their neighbor is a threat, they will submit. They're finally making their move to get what they want. -Agenda 21/2030 -id2020 -Forced vaccination -Increased surveillance On and on. It's all towards globalization and Brave New World stuff.

https://www.theatlantic.com/health/archive/2020/03/how-will-coronavirus-end/608719/ Barring a genuine miracle, the USA is about to lose its status as a global power. China, Russia, and the EU will take over in a multipolar world.

>>23849 Very possibly true, however see my post above. Spectacle, narrativizing.

>>23850 You're right about the increased authoritarian measures, but I don't think we'll go one world Orwellian styled nightmare quite yet. This pandemic is making people very reactionary, xenophobic, and isolationist - half the world is blaming China and adopting yellow peril, the other half is blaming the USA and the extant anti-Americanism is only intensifying. The EU might divide itself or it might come out stronger than ever once the USA is out of the picture depending on how they fare from here on. Russia is going to quickly claw its way to the very top now that the USA is going to need decades to recover. Coronavirus wasn't even a problem for them because of their rejection of globalization and that knowledge is going to become apparent across the globe. China was always going to rise to the top, but now their demographic crisis is seriously alleviated. They're only going to come out much stronger. I imagine all the rest of the Anglo capital worshiping neoliberals will move to Canada and NZ to try and profit off climate change and to avoid the suffering that overtakes their former homelands. USA might balkanize.

>>23851 Mobile phone industry explores worldwide tracking of users , is this not one world Orwellian styled nightmare http://archive.is/4azLv CEPI is seeking a “monopoly” role in the vaccination business the objective of which is a “global vaccine project”, https://www.globalresearch.ca/after-the-lockdown-a-global-coronavirus-vaccination-program/5706547 is this not some Deus Ex soykaf!!!

>>23850 What part of half a million confirmed cases is spectacle? the only current talk about eroding privacy rights has nothing to do with any of the delusions spouted in this thread, or with the virus itself for that matter.

>>23864 That: -The tests are inaccurate, the numbers are being inflated by basic qualitative heuristics like fever or pneumonia -People dying of other conditions are being counter as coronavirus cases -It's spring when people get sick anyway. -As it stands right now mostly people with underlying health conditions are contracting the virus and dying. -Even if you accept that the total known infection rate is accurate, the spread is essentially 1 person gives it to 1 person (not exponential), and the mortality rate is literally 0.01% eg in Germany -There are big players with interests and plans they've had for decades. Whether you like it or not, you have to take this into account when you interpret what's coming out of the media and especially the cdc. The concern of mine is what it does to asymptomatic carriers.

Capitalism is finally falling. Make a wish.

>>23867 I wish all communists kill themselves. Capitalism will survive and flourish.

>>23867 Do you think the percentage of lainchan users to get gulag'd will differ from the general population?

>>23870 100%. Lainchan users think they're all that, but the truth is they're retarded.

>>23870 Lainchan users will score average. The fact is most people on here are kids who don't know the first thing about security, opsec, or protecting themselves from anything. This matches with the average population. Honestly, it might be higher since they're subject to adults who are 10% more idiotic.

>>23869 >capitalism >bailouts choose 1

>9/11 will seem like a minor event in comparison It already is. 9/11 didn't lead to massive lockdowns and ceasing of business. The stock market was shut for a week and all airlines stopped flights, but no shutdowns on this grand of a scale. >Every aspect of our current society will probably fundamentally change for good Only future knows this. Human are meant to work as a pack and now the technology is filling that role, but I don't think it can ever replace real humans. >Technologically, people are demanding more safety measures and surveillance. Yup, people are begging to be locked in their own houses and if anyone deters from this norm...they're willing to report it like a sheeple, well done! The most shocking revelation that came out of the coronavirus fiasco is how the sheeple are utterly begging to be locked in their houses. They drool for martial law, forced vaccination and getting chipped like animals. All it took was some fear mongering in the media and ta da… The greatest counter to the panic is to not panic. Respect the virus, take necessary precautions, then stop. Stop consuming media pieces about it, stop panicking, stop letting it rule your thoughts, stop talking about it with everyone… They want you to be afraid. Don’t let them. This is not the first crisis and will not be the last. The only way to deal with an unfree world is to become so absolutely free that your very existence is an act of rebellion. At the edge of extinction, only love remains.

>>23893 lol, capitalism. fuarrrk your socialism.

>>23898 You missed the point. He said >Capitalism will survive and flourish. we have bailouts, in fact the most massive one is happening right now

>>23902 Those things aren't mutually exclusive. Nice try though.

I'm just gonna leave this here...

>>23903 >bailouts >anti-thesis to market competition >communism for a select few youre a retard if you believe its part of capitalism

>>23905 Yikes, wait a sec. They pulled a bait and switch. China has become the USSR, world war 3 is still on.

>>23906 Governments are separate from capitalism, and their decisions by extension. Nice try though.

>>23905 >>23907 When fukushima happened burgers on facebook were gloating about it calling it karma for pearl harbour. This is just usual behaviour. Not really indicative of any mental change.

>>23910 >makeup soykaf to sound right >it still doesn't hold up because this affects companies and is anti-competitive youre a failure

>>23905 Not wrong.

>>23914 Think for whom china produces. The west outsourced their pollution to china. They went there to produce as cheap as possible and that meant pollution.

>>23913 It's not my fault you can't separate economics from politics. It's sad though that you're so narrow minded and focued on muh marxism and assorted fäggotry. You're a failure.

>>23913 It applies to all companies equally and is thus competitive. >makes up soykaf to sound right youre a failure

>>23917 >politics is separate from economics Who the fuarrrk comes up with such mental acrobatics? Lobby groups will feel hurt.

>>23920 ~somebody drank the coolaid~

>>23919 When the banks got bailed out it only happened to those who gambled and failed. Good banks who didnt gamble got nothing out of it. So they lost out on years of massive gains for nothing. In essence they got punished for not gambling while the gamblers got rewarded for failing.

>>23922 ~cite your sources fäggot~

>>23924 >i need a citation that banks not failing didnt get bailed out 0 iq

>>23925 >banks not failing didn't get bailed out >>>>banks failed and didn't get bailed out 0 iq

>>23869 > Capitalism will survive and flourish. We'll see that in few months, when the economy fails completely and you'll be surviving by stealing dog food.

Just found this gem >used model for pandemic is based on closed source code from 13 year ago made for flu

>>23336 It's more contagiousness so the hospital beds will fill up and the weaker won't survive, of which, oh well.

>>23905 Interestingly after wallowing for a while in the mud of incompetence, the president finally stopped calling it the Chinese virus. Doubt it makes a difference anyway, those that claimed the virus was engineered to make the Chinese suffer have already moved to more fitting delusions.

>>23937 That's interesting. I was thinking the other day what kind of software they use to test if someone is positive or not. >thousands of lines of undocumented C God help us all.

>>23949 idk if you meant this, but the software described would be used to model how it spreads and how measures (like self isolation) affect this spread. >>23937 Mathematics doesn't really change in 13 years, those models will still be very applicable. The only thing that differentiates the cold from coronavirus on a pandemic scale is the rates of death, rates of infection etc. If you want some basic examples, Moran Model, Wright-Fisher Model.

>>23893 imagine thinking "free markets" ever existed, could exist, or are at all compatible with capitalism