hydroxymitragynine

These have hit the shelves at every local smoke shop near me within the past few months and spread like wildfire. Ive been a daily kratom user for over a year now and was an on and off user for several before, normally I dont ask for anything at smoke shops except for my usual. Im aware redditors online think smokeshop kratom is a scam and it is for thee but not for me, i get my capsules fairly cheap (still overpriced) but its mainly not a scam because I also buy many other things from smokeshops and I enjoy going to them and chatting with the owners a bit. Many here also sell non legal highs under the table not in store but have a dealer they will call for you to drop off within like 5 minutes, usually because he will be parked just outside or even live above the store. This is my other reason I buy kratom from smoke shops because it can often lead to a conversation that then can lead to them giving you the info on their dedicated off the books guy. This is all to say ive taken norcos and percocets before, and also that while I regularly visit these places I often just ignore random new shiny little kratom products because if I wanted something stronger than my maitenance dose ive been slowly decreasing I could get the "real thing" at the exact same place I buy the kratom. However I was checking out a new smokeshop and saw these; and at this place none of their kratom and nitrous and legal high soykaf was under the glass or behind a counter meaning I could just browse it all and grab something to bring to the register. I got something similar to these and took a whole one and ended up having to walk home 2 miles because I was afraid I was going to puke and pass out on the bus. Naturally in the coming month I kept buying it here and there and then decided this is insane and I have to stop and could not handle the withdrawals. Now I have a year of daily kratom use also contributing to that but I had gone a day without it before and it was bad but not this bad, I wake up now with a pounding head and runny nose since starting these things, that never used to happen with just the kratom plant powder. They are expensive even online and its pretty bad. They are pressed pills not of kratom although they often advertise having real kratom in them (and often do) in small amounts, but of what the kratom metabolizes into in your stomach. I suppose it was only a matter of time before people started refining kratom into stronger more immediately available forms. Doing some research the 7-hydroxymitragynine is actually not really that easy or profitable to obtain from the kratom leaves themselves, and so its actually largely synthesized. This makes me think that probably these are going to be cracked down on at some point soon and classed as some synthetic analogue opiate. They have deceptive labeling where sometimes the front or the back will list it as being say 7 mg of "mitragynia speciosa extract" but then somewhere else will clearly list it as "25 mg hydroxymitragynine tablets". They are as addictive as any painkiller ive taken, and I couldnt ever say that for regular kratom like some although it was obviously still very addictive. They must have gotten very popular very quick cause in the past weeks ive actually discovered fakes and talking with my trusted smoke shop guy he revealed that there is in fact already a bootleg/fake market for these and even gave me some tips on how to spot the fakes for the popular brands right now. They started putting those authenticity qr codes on the back like they were with disposable vapes however they usually just link to a page that says "its real!" and its incredibly easy to copy providing practically nothing in the way of security or authentication. Anyways this is just a psa/ opening a discussion about these. Have you found them in your city? Thoughts? Id avoid taking these if you arent trying to shoot your tolerance through the roof and now have to struggle with weaning off something way more expensive and a lot more addictive.

>>18144 So glad these came out multiple years after i had already quit my decade long opi addiction, one of the main opis i used was the entire duration of the 10 years was kratom and kratom alkaloids. Evidently these are a semi-synthetic version of the most potent kratom alkaloid. Definitely watch out, cause your a junky now kiddo. Stay safe, and if want to get clean I recommend ibogaine opiate detox, but only when done at a reputable clinic, most ibogaine clinics are dangerous and unreputable unfortunately.

fuarrrk that, I hate this soykaf so much because I see normal people and glt bois on yt talking about "muh addiction". Everybody will get the wrong idea and want kratom gone cause "omg those headsh op hippies are evuuul like fent dealers"

>>18192 i agree. this soykaf is bad news for kratom the plant, just like heroin was bad news for the poppy plant.

I wonder what would it feel like if one would extract that pill into a pure 7-OH solution, and shoot up into a vein. Would it give a rush?

>>18178 yeah unfortunately that seems to be the case. I have a therapist working with me on it and im trying to slowly decrease my dose which would be going swimmingly except there is a draw for me which is taking it and then painting at late hours and this is keeping my dose from actually decreasing at the speed I want. Basically im getting in my own way. One thing ive noticed that I dont see reported for withdrawals off of actual opiates is brain zaps, and actually brain zaps when id take too much as well. Ive always been prone to them though so maybe its just me.

>>18195 not sure, but im pretty sure i recall kratom alks being toxic to IV. can someone with more knowledge please confirm this? >>18196 kratom a bit of a dif pharmacology than regular opiates, it definitely has more of a stimulating effect and more of a anti-depressant effect, so that might explain your experiences with it in those ways.

I found out about this by finding two empty bottles on the ground near a backwoods road. My guess is it was someone out of state where kratom isn't legal. I understand why someone might take issue with this like some comments have mentioned. I also question if this isolated form has that effect of nausea if you take too much or not, I hope it does or else we're going to see some people ODing on it then it will absolutely get derezzed.

found out about these a few months ago, yet to try them but i want to. almost feel like i missed the bus since fakes are going around and some brands have a class action lawsuit now too

>>18209 Its a little less nausea inducing but still quite nausea inducing at the doses you might 'nod off' on. The nausea comes in waves. The biggest difference from kratom for me is its way more stimulating, im not sure if that follows the normal effects of whatever the specific concentrated alkaloid it is usually does but its what it does for me. It hits very quick and I just can lock in to whatever activity im doing. The pain relieving effects of kratom and subsequently this have not really ever been super noteworthy to me me, in fact if that were all it did this probably would not have me in its grasp like it does right now. They certainly cause a lot of pain for me going off of them my withdrawals appear to be terrible if this soykaf is giving me a run for my money (im a bit sensitive) but im pretty certain none of it is 'real' pain. I guess il know for sure when ive had some months off of it. I have trouble imagining someone ODing on it but I could imagine withdrawals with the right combo of pre existing soykaf or other medication could really hurt someone in a way they wouldnt expect. I also know kratom had some cross use lethality cases but to be honest I always assumed thode people just had kratom in their system and the coroner was like "yeah that probably contributed". With the 7-OH i could imagine it actually being a significant contributer to lethality in some mix of other drugs. again to be very real im not some person whos only ever done legal highs I had both a cocaine and meth addiction seperately for some time; kratom should be legal to sell in stores but this stuff I dont think it should be. Despite my experience with drugs I really had that anti drug psa moment of idiot trying new drug out thinking it was something else or wouldnt do soykaf/anything different and then was blown away and am now hooked on it and want off the ride. I think probably nothing easily accessible from the headshop should do that for you (I know everything can to different people but I mean to this extent). I should have to call someone and deal with soykafty people i dont want to deal with and feel anxious and soykafty about the whole process for highs like that. I know its a dumb wishy washy take but its where I stand on it.

>>18144 Not sure you guys watch youtube, but a youtuber called Goblin went over these talking about the compounds, and how they are incredibly addictive and that the company behind these are targeting kids and other kratom users. It's really disgusting. Please Please I advise not to use such.

>>18211 whats up with the lawsuit? sauce pwease.

Hate this bullshit. Kratom improves my quality of life and these retards selling pills labeled "mitropiom" or whatever the fuarrrk are going to get it derezzed for good

>>18258 use search engine, there's several different ones active rn and the one i saw was just in an insta ad https://www.mctlaw.com/product-liability/7-hydroxymitragynine-injury-lawsuits/ https://phillipslaw.com/7ohmz-kratom-addiction-investigation/ https://www.supplysidesj.com/herbs-botanicals/class-action-lawsuit-alleges-addiction-financial-loss-from-kratom-related-compound-7-oh a lot of these vendors do seem rather sketchy but fuarrrk opportunists in general to be honest

>>18260 There is definitely class actions happening but side note those insta ones are usually some kind of scam, im not sure how it works but they target your web browsing interests and I suspect some even swap word usage with AI or something cause for example there is one about video games and it will swap the name of the video game/game company with whatever it thinks is something you played. Like if you have a lot of searches for animal crossing it will say something asking if youve made any "in game purchases" in animal crossing or other nintendo games (which as far as I know there is no in game purchases for animal crossing). Im not the biggest law gut so im not entirely sure how the scam works but im just fairly certain they are scams, they may even be pseudo scams where the class action was really put forward but fully knowing its frivolous or not going to work and they take peoples money to be represented and just dont move forward or something. Or maybe like in this case its a scammer piggy backing off a real class action (possibly same with the video game one cause I think there was some class action about in game purchases for cosmetics and stuff). Anyways point is if you are ever interested in getting in on a class action dont do so through instagram ads.

>>18268 yea...i mean, unless someone died or got legit poisoned or if the soykaf was called 7oh but was really another compound i could see a lawsuit, but you cant really sue someone for making you strung out, otherwise tobacco, kratom, and alcohol would already be illegal.

>>18271 The legit ones may be because of second thing you said where some of these companies advertise as kratom but dont actually have any kratom in them and the 7oh is sometimes not even kratom derived (at least not in a direct extraction way). Someone doesnt necessarily have to die but just be caused significant injury in some way which addiction and the withdrawals might qualify for. Loot box gambling doesnt kill people but class actions have been attempted over whats seen as a deceptive practice that equates to just gambling.

OP here, after being addicted to these since some weeks before I made this post (a few months ago total) I was finally able to quit 5 days ago. It was brutal, the reddit stories about quitting were a lot worse than what I experienced but I also had managed to get down to 15 mg dose 3 times a day about, and tapered off with kratom. I still take the kratom but im back to the dose I had been taking from years before these, about 6 grams (and thats for the entire day not multiple times). Its probably a little early to do a victory lap, I could see myself falling back into these (or something worse honestly) if soykaf were to go south in my life. Opiods were never really my thing but with these my brain was able to "make the connection". My favorites ended up being a brand called press'd and another one just called "hydroxie". Again I may have had an easier time quitting cause ive never lived to nod off or check out, so these really were more like a stimulant for me that frustratingly would make me nauseous and sleepy if I took too much. I have figured out though or remembered I had a chronic shoulder pain going on, so thats fun to have back. As well as my IBS. On the plus side these are crazy expensive and while there were other reasons id be lying if I said money wasnt a big one. If each pill was like two bucks im not sure id have quit. I more than have the money to pay for them but I dont like spending money. Something I saw online a lot was people saying the withdrawal was "weeks" for them or months even and im not sure how that could be (even from people who tapered with kratom) . It actually was pretty much like one and a half days for me, I discovered it has a really short half life (hence why its so prone to redosing) so im not sure how these stories of people saying like they were in withdrawal for longer than they were off roxies or heroin is possible. Also in the post acute withdrawal I am not bedridden like some people said they were. Im not saying all this to gloat but actually just because all these quitting horror stories made me put it off, especially because the first day (or even half day lmao) off it is so bad. I couldnt afford to be out of comission for weeks let alone a month, I know thats true for many people, so my experience is you absolutely can get off these over a weekend (and should). Happy to be out of it, I dont want to say it robbed me of these past few months but I certainly wasnt all there. Its nice to feel again, even the pains and sadness. I walk a few miles everyday and that was very enjoyable on the 7 hydroxie and pseudoindoxyl. However tonight on my walk I felt a kind of joy I hadnt experienced in a long time actually even before starting these, like a kind of meaningful joy rather than one I just repetitively try to grab for everyday and know will go away once I return home. I cant really say why, maybe because I shot my tolerance so far up I was experiencing something on the climb down that I wasnt even able to experience before at my baseline. Had you asked me before quitting these if I was going to quit kratom I would have said no way. But its funny like being at my regular dose now it used to give a slight feeling but I cant even notice it. And on the first few days I was tapering no matter how much kratom I took I felt nothing and was still in intense pain. It seems like itd be such a cakewalk now to quit the kratom too and im actually really curious to see what thats like. Its odd to say but its been enioyable almost in a fuarrrked up way, maybe its just a defense mechanism to avoid ever moving to stronger opiates or back to these cause I know where it ends up but ive been really learning these past few days and also was prior to starting these the kind of joy in suffering. Its actually probably when I think back why I decided to buy these that minorly fateful day, I was kind of anhedonic and had started to feel things again through therapy and simultaneously got hit with a lot of bad news. Got to be too much, but here we are; the bad news still lives among me and the numbing and distracting stimulation does not. I feel like ive been doing less these past days bjt when I take stock im actually doing just as much. Ive found that to be true with every drug ive been on for periods of longer than a few weeks which was always funny to me, you take it because you feel you need something just to end up on paper doing no better.

>>18656 oh i forgot to mention though, the insomnia after is real. Ive been going to bed at like 7 am and waking up at 10-12 pm. Ive always had trouble getting to sleep but usually I wouldnt be able to sleep like this multiple days in a row. Im not sure I was getting much sleep in actuality though while on it. I feel like I would be half asleep a lot.

>>18657 why is your name in blue and an email link? wtf newhomo here, what gives?

My dickhead government derezzed kratom. When i saw these new kratom-derived drugs, i was pretty sure it will happen soon, and now it happened. I used it sparingly or on-off sometimes, for about 11 years. Now it's over. It's not impossible to get it because in all neighbour states it's still sold legally, but i probably won't bother with it. RIP in pepperoni kratom-sama

>>18664 fuarrrk that. legalize all plants NOW!!!!!!!!!!! >T. 10 yea kratom addict, now over 3 years clean

I tried these a couple weeks ago. I know Kratom is a popular topic on here. I even made posts about it in the past. It should definitely be used conservatively if used at all, like any other opiate and the more could be said about these 7oh motherfuckerz. I work in the alcohol-ethanol industry and someone walked into our shop with these things poking out of his bag. I was curious having tried OPMS in the past. Anyway, I took 2 tablets and 45 minutes later my face was so fuarrrking itchy. It wasn’t to the point of rubbing myself raw but jesus was there an itch. After I quit vaping, I took 4 at a time, I was puking my brains out. It tasted like sour chocolate milk but that was probably my own undoing. >>18664 SEA?

>>18663 damn yeah you are, its a feature of all imageboards you can put sage in email section to not bump a thread. On boards that move fast its a great way to rage at someone who posted a thread you dont like while also ensuring it doesnt get bumped and survive. Here though I mostly just use it when im not adding to the main topic or im double posting just as a courtesy.

>>18674 fuarrrk. i honestly never paid attention to these things. looking back now i really shouldn't have asked this while being fked up on whatever and just deduced this myself.

Got the exact brand in the OP pic a few days ago. Felt just like kratom. Didn't feel like anything special. Was disappointed. I think regular kratom is just fine. And no I don't have a tolerance I quit kratom 7 years ago and I decided to pick these up to see if they were any better.

>>18196 Interesting, brain zaps is a common symptom of GABAergics and especially benzos. Do you take anything alongside 7?

>>18820 no but I think i figured it out, its also a symptom of serotonergic drugs. 7 oh does something with it and I wasnt aware. >>18678 You got a bunk batch then or found maybe something new they are selling that is just mitragynia speciosa. Which is because the FDA has decided to attempt to schedule 1 7oh because it is a powerful opiate agonist. Im not saying try it again but either opiods in general dont do much for you or you didnt check the ingredients or got one of the offbrand knock offs. This isnt like kava or something where its highly subjective its at this point studied and they know exactly what it does and that its about as strong per mg as other prescription opiods. Hence why they are moving forward with scheduling it.

>>18144 heard they are about to make this schedule 1

>>18832 Mdma is the biggest culprit for brain zaps as it's a serotonin syndrome symptom

>>18877 fuarrrk that can we have nothing nice? I use these to fight off the occasional alcohol urge.

>>19056 im not trying to be a dick but im not on mdma nor have i taken mdma in probably years how is this related. im not like asking if 7 oh does this im saying i for sure get brain zaps at night as a result of overusing 7oh which confused me initially but now that I know it has some kind of serotonogic effect im just wondering exactly what that effect is. im not like cross pollinating here there isnt any other drug or medication im taking at the moment.

>>19060 I've never had such a serious kratom withdrawal that i would have brain zaps, it always remained at the flu-like symptoms and depression level. But heaviest period of withdrawal from high dose escitalopram (SSRI) was like getting shocked by electricity every few minutes. Brain zaps are actually tiny localized seizures in the brain, where firing of neurons get out of control, and they fire without real stimuli periodically with all their force. Just not in the whole brain and body like in a grand mal seizure, but only in a small brain area, and not for a long period of time, but only for a fraction of a second. Serotonin seems to have a regulating effect of these firings somehow, i don't know the exact mechanism, but there are many things pointing in this way, besides the SSRI withdrawal thing, for example: -brain zaps from withdrawal of serotonin releasers, like mephedrone, mdma, etc (i'm sure the guy above didn't want to say mdma caused your symptoms, he just tried to use it as an example to show serotoninerg drugs often cause brain zaps.) -severe lowering of seizure treshold by tramadol, which is an SNRI, and not by desmethyltramadol, which is the active metabolite opioid agonist of tramadol, but lacks SNRI effects. -the far superior anticonvulsant effect of nitrobenzodiazepines (clonazepam for example) compared to other benzodiazepines, and we know they are serotoninergic in addition to being gaba modulators unlike other benzos. Also, on drug forums, users who had seizures say that clonazepam have a far higher chance of seizure as a withdrawal symptom than non-nitro benzos, even higher than those of very short acting ones, which usually have a shorter but higher intensity withdrawal. -anticonvulsants in general, even those without direct serotonin receptor or serotonin transporter affinity, have shown to raise serotonin level. DOI: 10.1111/j.1471-4159.2006.04277.x says: " Generally, agents that elevate extracellular serotonin (5-HT) levels, such as 5-hydroxytryptophan and serotonin reuptake blockers, inhibit both focal and generalized seizures, although exceptions have been described, too. Conversely, depletion of brain 5-HT lowers the threshold to audiogenically, chemically and electrically evoked convulsions. Furthermore, it has been shown that several anti-epileptic drugs increase endogenous extracellular 5-HT concentration. 5-HT receptors are expressed in almost all networks involved in epilepsies."

>>18259 Way more people have got hooked on kratom than people who have used kratom to come off opis

>>19097 Hence this thread.... /Thread

>>19077 I actually get it from using too much of the 7-oh in combo with falling asleep, not necessarily when coming off of it. It might be worth noting I also just get brain zaps when sleep deprived and I start trying to fall asleep. Not like serious sleep deprivation either it can just be losing one nights rest and il get them the next nightas im falling asleep. Il even get them while dreaming, ive had like dreams where I can tell i must be getting actual brain zaps irl because its so vivid and shocking in the dream usually accompanied by some nightmarr scenario where something is zapping me.

>>19097 this is true, but does that justify derezzing it? should any living being be made illegal? it is a plant and has a life, people should be responsible with it. i was addicted to kratom and poppies for ten years before i quit a few years ago but im not in favor of either being illegalized.

I have been on and off kratom user for many years and gave these a try. Without realizing it I became heavily addicted in a short amount of time and if I did not take these within every 4-6 hours I would start to widthdrawl, bones hurt, sweating, body hurts. I ended going cold turkey after realizing I how addicted my body is to them and how often I have to take them to not get sick and laid in bed feeling like I was dying for a week before starting to get back to normal. They feel good not going to lie but it is not worth it. I saw other people online saying were heroin addicts for 10-15 years and coming off of these were worse than heroin.

broke down and ordered a bunch of hydroxy online. i should have enough for the next few months i guess. i think the criminalization efforts towards kratom are this generation's illegalization of marijuana.