Buddhism and psychedelics

Do psychedelics go against the five Buddhist precepts? Can psychedelics be characterized as 'intoxicants''? Should one refrain from taking acid in their journey towards enlightenment?

One of the vows for lay Buddhists is to swear off intoxicants. I'm not sure this is accepted in all schools of traditionally practiced Asian Buddhism. The last of the Five Precepts prohibits drugs and alcohol. I guess you could argue that psychedelics can be medicinal but I'm not a Buddhist so I have no idea if they make exceptions like that. I doubt actual Buddhists would buy that argument. Basically, yes its against the precepts for lay people and they'd probably tell you to refrain from it.

Buddhist precepts are not moral imperatives. Buddhism is not a moralist tradition. The precepts are used to circumscribe a space of practice within the practitioner's life, they are used to control the unfolding of the practicioner's life in such a way that practice is possible and it is effective. In this sense, the problem with intoxicants is that they disturb your mind, and buddhism isn't about mind states, altered states of consciousness, peak experiences or whatever, it is about seeing cleary what is actually going on, that is, your life. Thus, intoxicating yourself won't help you to see things cleary, possibly the contrary, in the sense that some people will have certain experience with psychedelics and create whole conceptual structures that will actually prevent them from seeing reality as it is, instead they see just their conceptualizations. This doesn't mean that every substance is bad for everyone all the time. Coffee is, in a sense, an intoxicant, but it isn't problematic to drink it sometimes to wake up in the morning. If it makes you anxious though, than it is bad. In the same sense, in certain circunstances psychedelics can be helpful to "flexibilize" the mind of a person, showing them that reality is not as concrete as it seems but rather is influenced by your mind. This depends of course on the tradition, it was done very rarely in tantric buddhism in a very controlled way, but it is a no-no in theravada for example. It is safe for you to refrain, yes, given that i don't know who you are and how your mind works. As time goes on you understand a little batter what is the path towards enlightenment. At this point you wont refrain yourself but you just won't see the point in using it.

By the way, Chogyam Trungpa was a person who had a deep understanding of the dharma and he drank a lot. I think that he died due to excessive consumption of alcohol. Some people doesn't see him as an example of anything, but well, people see what they can see. People from Theravada will look at this and say that we are delusional. For each their own. For me, he is the example that buddhist enlightnment has anything whatsoever to do with a "pure" ethical and moral behaviour, with following rules because following them is what "is" right. Ethics comes as a consequence of your understanding of what karma is and how it works (it isn't about retribution). It has nothing to do with morality in an abstract sense. Chogyam Trungpa drunk a fuarrrkton because he could do it and deal with the consequences, a beginner practicioner can't.

>>13929 Thank you for your thought out responses. Would you happen to know of any good resources to help me get started in my journey? Books, articles, perhaps videos.

>>13947 Are you talking about Buddhism? Different anon but I'm in similar position as you. I recently found this website that looks pretty good place to start --> https://www.accesstoinsight.org The Dhammapada is also on my reading list (so is The Heart of the Buddha’s Teaching written by Thich Nhat Hanh). I'm also thinking about starting daily zazen meditation (possibly). Video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LL2XUTeoUsM

>>13950 Great resource. Reading their introductory texts right now, and finding all of it very interesting. Will be reading some suttas afterwards and reflecting upon them. Thank you!!

I hate the adoption of eastern philosophy so much. I hate how it's been conflated into cyberpunk and science fiction, like holy fuarrrk, play a fuarrrking sport for christ sake, you filthy degenerate.

>>13997 But why? Would you care to elaborate further?

>>13998 Religions are criminal organizations meant to belittle their subjects into believing that submitting authority to them will grant them access to an afterlife. Play a sport and aspire to greatness, not old indoctrinated zealots. They believe this world and everything in it to be temporal and so are they and their religion. Religions are for children and adults acting like children.

>>13923 psychedelics make you understand and love buddhism. fuarrrk it just do them. in the long run, though, I think they can't get you to enlightenment or the rainbow body (the rainbow body takes like 60 years of Dzogchen practice).

>>14002 Where is the Authority in Buddhism, the whole point of Buddhism is to try and make you a better. Person so that you don't have to keep on doing it over and over again.

>>13923 psychedelics allow a person to serially re-imprint their samskaras. deep meditation does the same thing. if its the same thing, then its the same thing. people who say you have to take the long way because its muh better are old orthodox windbags with no realization and nothing to say. when you work on your samskaras, you can fix your negative karmas and attain liberation easier. since the religion is atheist and has no central diety, there's no one to blame but yourself if you fuarrrk up your brain/life. set and setting. >>14002 i'd love to slap the soykaf out of you, little bitch

>>14002 Based. Religion has always been a way to keep women and children in line. Men don't have to ask permission to build society.

>>14025 >i'd love to slap the soykaf out of you, little bitch - An Enlightened Buddhist

is the outcome Skillful? the tree from the fruits!

>>14056 How now brown cow, hao Tao art thao? (便條太謏)

I dont know about buddhist precepts but for sure Psychedelics help to see that everyone talking in this thread is doing so to support and propagate their belief structures oriented on goals such as taking psychedelics.

japan lainanon here. A cheeky tab of lysergic and a day spent at a temple, performing sutras, or otherwise concentrating and being still is a good day. very comfy nobody needs to know

Waan't there a story about everyone in a temple getting addicted to meth