Why Use Discord?

So, I've tried Discord recently because people keep saying how great it is for socializing. However it was pretty miserable experience. Joined a few programming/gaming related servers and what people post there is only soykafpost memes and absurd jokes, no interesting discussion, no nothing. Absolutely fuarrrking soulless experience compared to IRC or even Matrix where people actually talk What do people actually do on Discord that makes it enjoyable? Or is it just another soykaf app made to brainwash gen z?

>>67579 Smaller and niche interest servers generally have higher-quality discussions, but yeah, it's pretty much pointless. They may as well have just made an IRC+Mumble frontend and sold that. Another negative is that it is minority owned by Tencent.

>>67579 Tried Discord. Joined a server with 7K people. It was extremely dead. No one talked. Emojis everywhere. Pronouns everywhere. Can't type unless you're in the server for weeks. Join another server. Can't join unless you fill out 10+ questionnaire and have social media linked to your account. Join another server. You need a phone number linked to post. Most people in the server are 16. I fuarrrking hated it, and haven't bothered with it since. The buy nitro spamming was the cherry on the soykafcake.

>>67580 How do you find those servers? Matrix has the room directory and IRC has /list that allow you to see pretty much everything, but on Discord official search and sites like disboard only return large servers for the most part

Something that hit me when I tried it is that there's so many literal children there. Of course discussion quality will be low.

>>67583 look guys, i'm so smart!

>>67579 It is like kicking dead whales down the beach for meeting new people. I use it for fighting game matchmaking servers and to talk to old friends from a 4chan general that we all used to post in many years ago. The average age of the people I talk to there is probably 25+ which is why I actually like discord. What do you think makes discord as a program worse than IRC? Your issue with it just seems to be that you don't like anyone there, but if you just look at discord itself it is basically IRC but with more features like vc and embedded images. It's great if you already have a community of people to talk to.

I made incredible friends there in the past, but we all moved to IRC and Matrix over Tor after we got stallman-pilled a couple years ago. It's possible to make friends and talk about stuff on any chatroom software like this, but in the context of Discord it helps to be involved in some kind of gaming, ideally something with a persistent world, reputation, stakes, etc. Anything that draws out peoples' true natures and their true level of trustworthiness, is great for community building, because friends trust each other first and get to know each other later- and they communicate on discord while they do that.

>>67587 >It's great if you already have a community of people to talk to. This is correct. OP, don't you know that communication channels exist only because people had something to communicate about? A lot of channels arise from a 'shared activity' like the previous poster mentioned, activities or spaces where there is no de facto gathering place for long-term messaging and social interaction. - Many small, private groups spring up between small amounts of people. - Those groups become aware of and increasingly interlinked with each other, increasing the size of the social graph and demanding larger spaces to accommodate them all - Eventually the more public spaces become large enough that links to them get indexed by search engines and frequently posted in wherever the community originated, making them de facto gathering places for segments of the users - This happens at the same time as Dunbar's Number for the community is being exceeded, so the public spaces grow every larger but diluted and less personal to their size. They get to a size where you end up having several different large public places, loads of medium-sized places adjacent to those larger places, and huge amounts of small, private places adjacent to those. - The small and medium spaces are the real meat of what's going on and where most of the socialization happens. The large, public spaces serve as heavily-interlinked nodes that allow those from the other spaces to interact with / be aware of each other. They aren't for deeper socialization, they are more for large scale things like aggregated information (announcements), and the occasional large spikes of chatter from when lots of people of various groups get together for a moment. If you're late to the party and weren't there for the formation of the stars, you use large spaces to discover/map the existence of medium-sized spaces (spaces below Dunbar's Number), and you interact a lot with people in medium spaces until you start forming connections with people such that small spaces inevitably arise. There's your answer, OP.

I am in a few discord servers, and used to be in others as well, and I have no fuarrrking idea what everybody is complaining so much about. It's just people, talking. The servers for topics like classical languages are pretty good, people talking linguistics and philogy, it gets interesting, and fun. Sometimes someone finds their way into a server, starts getting confrontative and rude,and eventually gets derezzed or leaves in a rage. I suppose people here don't like it because they can't be their usual unpleasant selves the way anonymous imageboards allow this. I've been using imageboards for over a decade, but I am sick of hostility being the norm just about every time one makes a post. In discord I've been engaged in actual conversation without the stuff being derailed by an insistent troll going on about race or some similar soykaf. You don't get people chronically complaining about tfwnogf or being depressed out of their skulls, either. Also, where else am I going to find communities around niche subjects? Reddit? LMFAO. Imageboards only know to talk about comouter software (and that often in a very superficial way), anime, and politics, in a very, very unproductive way. I've tried starting threads about the stuff I'm interested, they get a couple replies (if any) and die. Someone said people in ibs are smart pretending to be retarded. I differ, theynare just plain retarded and it fuarrrking shows in every thread. But ok, sure, discord bad, lmao.

>>67595 >I have no fuarrrking idea what everybody is complaining so much about. It's just people, talking Yeah, I dont use it because of privacy reasons, but the times I've had to use it, it's just like any other group chat service, conversation wise. Maybe there more of a gamer culture compared to something like irc, slack, or matrix, but that's about it > I suppose people here don't like it because they can't be their usual unpleasant selves the way anonymous imageboards allow this. I try to be kind and polite on imageboards, and my main reason for preferring imageboards over chatrooms is that you don't have to be online a ton for (small) imageboards. Just read it a few times a day and catch up on what you missed. Take as much time as you need to write a response. In chatrooms, you have to be online for periods of time and login pretty frequently to stay caught up. I cut them out to reduce my time online many years ago. The downside is that chats allow you to form more personal and long-lasting relationships and imageboards do not.

I have used Discord, but never regularly. Only really for an archiving group and some friends who use it as their main platform. So: >What do people actually do on Discord that makes it enjoyable? Talk to specific groups of people who are actually interesting or actually running a project. >Or is it just another soykaf app made to brainwash gen z? It's a profit-driven instant messaging app. It's soykaf. It's not made to brainwash, but nor was Facebook, twitter, reddit or 4chan. They became monotonous soykaf and increasingly corporate over time as an inherent result of their quest for profit and popularity. It's an instant messaging platform. Like IRC, like AOL and MSN, like Matrix. Except it also has more integration with voice chat and live video (possibly it's only real strength). If you're looking for quality discussion, you're using the wrong infrastructure, aimed at the wrong community. Any quality you get their is a fluke, a coincidence. Now, while the instant chat part also applies to IRC and Matrix, they're typically slower, plus there's a bit of an intrinsic barrier to entry - those platforms were never ''really'' mainstream. The only way new people come in is likely to be an actual meaningful community or through unusual values (anti-capitalism, privacy advocacy or etc.)

Discord was not enjoyable for me to use. When I used soykafcord it was not uncommon for people to complain about a server being dead, trying to produce activity, never being successful. I don't believe the users enjoy using discord, they just use it because it is "what everyone uses". They don't think, people have been socially engineered to use and continue using garbage like discord. I was on a decent discord server for years. It was a 4chan webm server started by a youtube channel which provided just that very thing. It was also free speech. There would be genuine discussion, enjoyable, engaging activity that would occur. But one day the server got taken down. It was just gone one day. People in the server had befriended each other, and mutually worked together to reform a new server. Then we learned that a ton of people got derezzed with the server. The second instance of the server would never compare to the original. We lost a bunch of regular members. Discussion could be had, but it was far too fleeting to be worth sticking around. People became paranoid. We eventually imposed a vetting process for letting people enter the server, because people would try to infiltrate the server and report it. At that point the influx of people entering the server tanked, you no longer have new individuals with new ideas entering the discussion and an echo chamber forms. We struggled to mediate the desire for activity between the desire for the server to not be derezzed. The thing is servers on discord providing genuine discussion without restrictions are no longer public if they even exist. They aren't easy to find. If they are open to the public people come in and destroy it. With these types of servers, idiots join, see things they disagree with or don't like and report the server and it gets deleted and its users derezzed. I saw it happen to numerous servers. There are actual pedophile rings on discord. Then there are LGBT servers, and furry servers which facilitate grooming. There are antifa servers which are enabling "domestic terrorism" if we go off of the characteristics for something to be determined as domestic terrorist activity by the powers that be. These servers are never taken down, their users are never derezzed. I wonder why? You have to consider what kind of people are running discord when a server of 4chan spergs sharing memes and chatting gets razed to the ground meanwhile actual pedophiles are free to do as they please, never getting derezzed. Not once did I see one of those grooming servers get taken out. You can't use discord anonymously. You have to provide a phone number, they will arbitrarily accept and deny phone numbers, you can provide a real, valid phone number, and it can be denied and your account locked. It happened to me once. You can't use anonymizers with discord consistently. Any information passing through discord will be logged. Discord contains a process logger to monitor activities outside of discord occurring on your system. Voice and video communications are "encrypted" and pass through a server where they are decrypted, their contents analyzed, then re-encrypted before reaching their destination. Even if traffic wasn't decrypted for analysis it is still captured by the client itself upon its input. >>67595 Free speech is never permitted on these servers. You will say people here do not like it because people here cannot be their usual "unpleasant selves". This determination is subjective, by their metrics people here may be "unpleasant". They are unpleasant for thinking differently, for not sharing the worldview of the powertripping moderators and admins. On the other hand there are free speech chatrooms on IRC and XMPP. The best discussion I've had online as of yet has been on IRC and XMPP. There are trolls, they never successfully derail discussion because people just ignore them when they come, they do not come frequently. There really is no need to ban people. Perhaps a need for banning people could be justified on discord as discord provides users with dumb features that enhance their ability to derail discussion. Anyway fuarrrk discord anyone using discord who is not completely ignorant to its evils is a retard.

>>67579 Personally, it's because when I deleted my account, I nearly lost my old high school friends, and could not make new ones with similar interests to me. I don't use the servers beyond a couple university clubs. I've received some good info from them about topics like TTG

Don't care about OP-Post, but discord is very awful software. Lags, infinity UPDATES OF UPDATES, NITRO BUY NITRO PLES. Feel's like facebook or mom's watsapp chats, but with anime and furries.

>>67579 I tried discord once. Joined a few servers but was eventually derezzed by most of them. The problem is that discord servers quickly become echo chambers where people can be kicked out for really simple disagreements. The only plus side was the language learning servers. I ended up quitting because I find it about as addictive as chatrooms.

>>67579 I never liked Discord. Not only it's proprietary software/service, but it's also collecting data (read their TOS, they collect even messages). I prefer chans, text boards and IRC. You aren't limited to using the official client and they don't actively collect data (although you need to use IRC with Tor if you want real privacy). I have heard that Discord has similar problem as R*ddit with how the servers or subr*ddits are moderated.

>>67595 > I've been using imageboards for over a decade, but I am sick of hostility being the norm just about every time one makes a post. In discord I've been engaged in actual conversation without the stuff being derailed by an insistent troll going on about race or some similar soykaf Why are imageboards so cruel? It's not just imageboards but the internet in general is a pretty harsh place where we're ready to tear somebody, anybody, to shreds, especially anyone who doesn't share our extremely cynical and nihilist outlook on life.

>>67579 >What do people actually do on Discord that makes it enjoyable? Use it exclusively to chat with friends. I don't really care for public discord servers, Apart from 2 or 3 servers, they are all private or friend related in some way. It's literally IRC like >>67587 and >>67591 explains. There's nothing special about it. Don't force yourself to use it. I'm only there because me and my friends have been on discord since it's release and don't have a reason to switch. Use it when you'll find a nice bunch of folks that caters to your interest. Don't think the server browser will help much if that's what you're after. It's a cesspool from what I here from here and other places. I actually never used the browser to begin with anyway. pic unrel here's my friend's cat. she didn't fuss when nail clipping so she got catnip and she rolled in it

Only reason I use it today is for work purposes, or when some idiot decides to put the downloadable link to their software in a discord server instead of somewhere else. Other than that I stay far away from it. In the past, when I was 'lonely' and tried to make net buddies, I used Discord, but I never seemed to like it at all. Everyone was either a porn addict, too obsessed with their sexuality and their 'pronouns' for whatever reason, or some 4chan-lite kid who couldn't avatar user on 4um.net so he made a discord server centered around conversing about 'le funny 4chan memes' and 'femboys'. Grew tired of that terminally online nonsense really quick and just decided to accept that I'll always be a solitary person and that's okay, that means less distractions and more time to focus on myself. Yeah I still talk to people, a couple of anons who have an irc and then I have a ton of 'acquaintances' offline who bother me every once in a while, but otherwise I keep a distance and I'm just fine with that. Better than any alternative. If you OP, or anyone for that matter want to make friends, go outside and join a group, whether it be based upon your religion, a hobby, a class, etc., that's the best possible way to make friends. Second alternative is chatting it up with a bunch of lainanons in a small irc somewhere that is dramafree.

I used it for some time until 2021-22. I don't know why people defend it saying its good for small friend groups. I think the structure of the app being based on roles and heavy emphasis on your appearance (name colors, how many badges you have, GIF icons, account number and by the time I left I think profile backgrounds were rolling out) it leads to the deterioration of said friend group. People will be focused on kissing the mods ass and if you disagree with someone you get derezzed from a server and blocked even if you were once friends because you made the vibe of the server uncomfy. If you don't spend Nitro you're seen as lame, as if you don't take chatting to your friends online serious enough. You can be locked out of channels where everyone may or may not be talking soykaf about others and you again may have to kiss ass to get channel permissions to talk where all the "cool kids" actually talk. Every server plays these stupid social games to some extent. I think the people who think Discord really is fine are just Discordbrained or something thinking these sort of experiences are normal. It's like old school forums on modern social media steroids and is overall just unpleasant to use. And I'm not getting into the insane soykaf I've witnessed on Discord. fuarrrking Skype was better and all you had to do was fuarrrking chat. Also I will always bitch about this but I hate people using Discord as a wiki, download site, or issue tracker. "It's easier to use and everyone uses Discord" my brother you are lazy and addicted to the platform please stop.

>>67605 it's because humans love to contradict other humans because it's a quick gain of power over someone else (especially for the average type of people that hang out on imageboards, normally frustrated and powerless outside) + imageboards are anonymous so you see it much more often than your average normal person platform. if I say something on a random large IRC chat it's GUARANTEED someone will have to say something about it. just wait before someone will contradict my point. i'm not saying there's something wrong with this, it's natural, make peace of the inevitability of it and care less about it. we often talk to mirrors anyways, not really to the people in front of us.

>>67609 >just wait before someone will contradict my point. Nobody will, get over yourself faget

>>67611

>>67579 >what people post there is only soykafpost memes and absurd jokes, no interesting discussion, no nothing. Never used Discord but the few I see here and there is basically this so never had the feel t join. I have the same view on twitch chat, when I watch some replay of some youtubers I appreciate I'm always impressed by the extremely low level of the "discussions" in the chat. It's basically just people throwing bad soykafposts and everyone is just talking in the void. It's very unpleasant and I clearly don't see why people use the chat. So yes, I believe if you're looking in niche topics there should be more quality in the chat.

I thought discord was pretty good when it was new, it felt safer to join random servers with no worries about IP leaking, it had voice calls/channels, public emotes etc, and it gave me memories of old public skype rooms which I hadn't seen for yeaaars. One of the worst things about it would be that it's become basically a worse Reddit. Community websites/forums turn into discord servers, information becomes locked off to those without discord accounts. Discord itself gets more hungry for your information (they never used to require a phone number or ID). Those communities are also forever tied to the ToS which updates all the time. Maybe one day it updates and your server is at odds with it, now your whole community is derezzed. Servers are now auto-modded to hell, theres weird custom systems you have to navigate before you can participate. It's actually similar to how minecraft servers have evolved. They removed gif avatars and paywalled them, they removed public emotes and paywalled them, they ban you for using custom clients but rip off their features and paywall them. They give out the most minimal of perks which were standard like 10 years earlier... and paywall them. Recently I went back after ditching it years ago, and searched some of those directory sites for random servers to join. Joining whatever most popular anime/gaming (generic tags) servers I could find.. and it really was terrible. Pretty much everything >>67581 said. Introduction channels entirely made up of young children and teenagers reciting a million acronyms of their mental illnesses and sexual preferences. Everyone a slightly different combination. Servers made up of dozens upon dozens of channels, yet some not having a single post since a year before? They're just so dead and I swear it didn't used to be this way, even for random large servers. They used to feel more alive. Privacy concerns aside, Discord was pretty fun and useful early on. But now it's time for it to explode into a million pieces and die.

>>67600 >>34880 same guy btw wonder why you're using "LGBT" this time -- perhaps the other word you would use is unpleasant..?

>>67600 IRC's free speech guidelines depends on the network. Libera is an over-moderated, communist soykaf hole. Even their politics server are filled with unironic Stalinist sperglords. Rizon, Efnet are usually the more lax, free speech orientated servers but that's channel dependent. Trolling on IRC is usually a lot easier because its really easy to join channels. >>67595 >The servers for topics like classical languages are pretty good, I can't support this argument. Niche, intellectual servers on Discord were always dead, too many derezzed words, or had so many rules, it was impossible to have a productive conversation. Its mostly cliques of people who each other and power trip over being a mod. With IRC, striking up a conversation with people is simple because communities are usually smaller and people get to know each other better. People always eager to talk to newcomers. You don't have to jump through hoops just to talk to people either.

>>67621 >Niche, intellectual servers on Discord were always dead, too many derezzed words, or had so many rules, it was impossible to have a productive conversation. Its mostly cliques of people who each other and power trip over being a mod I had to check, I had to double-check, yes, I am indeed using Discord (I triple-checked), and I haven't yet experienced a single thing of the ones mentioned, either in this post or the previous ones. Then again, it's not like I spend all day on Discord, but I haven't even run into this by chance. >>67619 >searched some of those directory sites for random servers to join. Joining whatever most popular anime/gaming (generic tags) servers I could find.. and it really was terrible. Well colour me surprised. What did you expect? You joined the worst of the worst on pourpose, again, what did you think you were going to find? Idc that much about Discord, even though I'm defending it. From a privacy perspective, it's very unadvisable. But I gotta say what I see, and what I see is simply users from a community who look down on users from a different community because it's not the format they favour. I'm a native of imageboards, so to speak, but after some time away, I have noticed that imageboards are not any better than any other community out there, in fact, they are much worse. There you got kids making up genders and sexual orientations, here you got nazis and a disproportionate amount of transgendered people, anr the guys kindly suggestion they end their own lives, you get people spilling mind poison in every thread, going on and on about muh depression and suicide and loneliness and trying to steer other people in the same direction. And let's not talk about the moderation, I'm actually surprised people in lainchan complain about moderation in discord. Imageboards are mind poison. Just about every other community is like kicking dead whales down the beach in one way or another, but imageboards are the dark bottomless pit of the internet.

I can't imagine being active in a public discord server. For me its exclusively for keeping in touch with friends, mostly ones I know IRL.

>>67623 >There you got kids making up genders and sexual orientations, here you got nazis >here you got nazis Everyone to the left of Stalin is considered a "Nazi" so I definitely don't trust a word you're saying. Saying the Holodomor happened, and Stalin wasn't a good guy, is enough to be called a Nazi these days.

>>67625 Hahaha You hang around stalinists too much.

>>67626 Its not that. Stalinists hang around chans, Discord and IRC too much.

>>67625 Meh, I don't know how many are actual nazis, but I know there are users who openly claim to be "national socialists" aka nazis. But from my observations, a non-negligible number of users in these sites think non-white people are inferior, and even consider black and brown people not human at all. That's who I am calling nazi, after all, it's a derogatory word. There are other people with stances I label under the umbrella term, but you get the point. Idc if it's inaccurate or factually wrong. You can call them boneheads, retards, knock yourself out. Leftists call everyone a racist whether they are or not, all the same. And right-wings will call you whatever slur comes to mind.

When I used Discord only to communicate with a small group of friends I met off the platform, it was a fine experience. Later in time as I joined imageboard-connected servers and large public servers, I saw firsthand how soykafty the platform could be. I already knew it was soykaf for a long time, but you have to witness it for yourself to understand the levels of depravity some of its users have. Its a platform ripe with mental illness, from LGBT soykaf to people that live on the platform with 50+ servers and thousands of notifications because they have nothing and are nothing in real life. Its disgusting spyware and you'd have to be an idiot to continuously use it when it monitors anything and everything you do in addition to demanding your phone number on a whim. I /do/ know why people use it, of course. Its the mental stimulation it provides. For a long time in the past I used a certain "live imageboard" for many hours every day. I ultimately ended leaving it because it was full of losers and hatred, but it was far more interesting and fun than any experiences I've had on 4chan or the 30 other imageboards I've used over the span of my life. A constant stream of posts and content with the ability to tune in and out at will is very addictive and difficult to break out of. A platform like Discord with identities is even worse as you try and advertise yourself in a particular way. Don't use it.

>>67597 >Talk to specific groups of people who are actually interesting or actually running a project. Unironically this. Why the hell do people join servers with thousands of members, whom have little to nothing in common with them, expecting quality discussions? You can't just sign up for ANY messaging platform and magically expect to have great convos at your doorstep. You need a specific fuarrrking reason to go there in the first place.

>>67639 >Unironically this. Why the hell do people join servers with thousands of members, whom have little to nothing in common with them, expecting quality discussions? This is an ironic argument to make on an imageboard.

>>67640 boards like lainchan are small, generally highly filtered. IDK how many people we have on here over the average week but I very much doubt its even a thousand. Maybe with lurkers IDK but posters ? We don't even get a thousand posts most weeks.

The emote system is quite clever, using little embeds instead of emojis makes text a lot more expressive.

>>67641 Even if we assume the pedantic argument of lainposters is true; its a false dilemma. Social media websites typically have thousands, millions people we anonymous to daily yet quality discussions happen all the time because you are bound to find a productive conversation by chance. The point of joining bigger servers is to increase your chances of finding people for that to happen. I also wager many of us found lainchan through bigger websites, and people typically come to avoid all the brewing soykaf on /g/ for quality discussion.

>>67641 What filter? Anyone can post, and if the filter is knowing that it exists, Lainchan got its link splattered in many places.

Like some others here I use it to talk with people I met on 4chan years ago. Not much more. I'm in one public server and I'm not missing much even if it's a niche Linux server. I'd like to move to, say, XMPP, but I doubt it will happen any time soon.

>>67628 >black and brown people This kind of speech is degrading, putting people who are ethnically, culturally, (and racially) under one label is so semantically disingenuous as it is ironically discriminatory despite it being touted as the opposite by the 'virtuous' people who use the term. Please, for the sake of everyone who is not obsessed with modern day 'social politics', please, avoid adopting terminology like this if you honestly seek to be 'politically correct'. The cognitive dissonance of people who use terms like this and 'people of color' is truly unparalleled. And again, semantics is very important whether people realize it or not. It should not be encouraged to call people what they aren't, misconstruing the meaning of words is a dangerous thing. People who commonly use terms like 'nazi' and 'commie' as ad hominems to insult people who disagree with them or act in a certain way should not be taking seriously, because it's just another form of 'newspeak' that puts labels on people and puts them into groups without accurately assessing the content of their character or the content of what they have said. If someone is being what you deem 'racist', then call them that (more, importantly tell them why you believe them to be as well) instead of just a nazi, because ultimately, a 'nazi' has a vague, ambivalent meaning in modern social context, and is an extremely offensive assertion that one shouldn't use so lightly. That takes the meaning away from the word. TL;DR your post sparks my autism.

>>67646 its widely distributed but most people don't run into those links anyway. pretty few people know about it, few come, few stick around. its filtered in the same way a weird badly marked dive bar right near the university is; Anyone can go, but that doesn't mean that the crowd there isn't very specific.

>>67648 Fair enough, what term should I use, then? Ethnic minorities? I'm only using the words they use, which I know is also superficial and inaccurate. I don't mean to be politically correct, either. I don't mind the word niggers, just the spirit in which it is used, specifically by the people making these kind of posts. And I already acknowledged using the term nazi as a vague derogatory word, which it always was to begin with. Incongruent? I suppose so, "whites" bring out the antagonistic in me, I'm fuarrrking sick of their crap.

I am on few servers where I talk a lot.

Discord Pros: - Many users - Likely to find groups with similar interests (unless those interests are anti-discord of course) - Popular groups have lots of activity. Never quiet. - Quickly get answers to questions - Likely your friends are already on - Easy to create new groups and send invites that are one click away for other Discord users - Lots of features in one place. Voice calls, video calls, screen sharing, chat, games, watchtogether etc. - Good bot features Cons: - Many users - Some big servers literally have 10 million+ members. How are you even meant to have cohesive conversations that aren't like a Twitch chat? (granted I'm not in servers like that, maybe it's fine) - Network effect. It'll be hard to get your friends off when Discord evetually has to pay its investors and will do so by making the user experience worse. - Network effect. If a community has a discord they're not likely to have another place online. So if you don't want to use Discord. Tough. It's the default. - Lots of places with scams, malware, child porn. - It's bloated. The UI has a billion clickable things at any one point. It feels really heavy to use. Clicking on anything has a noticeable delay. Even typing feels like it's sluggish - It's proprietary. - It's has a horrendous privacy policy. Obviously messages in a public forum shouldn't be considered private but at least with IRC it doesn't feel like every click, movement, and keystroke is logged for telemetry purposes. - You can't self-host. - Alt clients aren't actually allowed and could get your account derezzed at any point. - Have to have a phone number to sign up. Free ones online don't work. It's technically not free because you either need to have paid for a phone+sim or paid for an online number (paid ones work). - In some countries you can't get phones anonymously. For those people there's always a strong link of their identity to Discord. - How is it making money? With how big it is, it's certainly not with Nitro subscriptions. How will the investors get paid? - Tiny 8MB file sharing limit. I know people just share links to videos that get embeded but I don't. I send videos/pictures directly. - This might be an online generational thing mixed with the size/popularity of Discord. But it feels like it has a real moderation/censorship culture. Every "server" has some long list of rules that often include derezzed words. This side of the internet doesn't feel as carefree and cyberpunk as it used to.

>>67643 >I also wager many of us found lainchan through bigger websites, and people typically come to avoid all the brewing soykaf on /g/ for quality discussion. Yeah you're absolutely right about that. Personally, I found this lainchan via a random post on /g/. >Social media websites typically have thousands, millions people we anonymous to daily yet quality discussions happen all the time I think it's more appropriate to look at this in terms of rates/quatity of quality discussion as opposed to a binary check of whether or not quality discussions occur at all. Lainchan has drastically larger number of quality discussions per thread. The idea amongst others, and myself, is that as a social network of people grows, the per capita quality discussions per communication-instance decreases, and approaches zero. By "communication-instance", I mean smallest significant post of whatever kind is done in whatever platform. On Discord, it's sets of messages related to each other, on lainchan it's threads and their replies. At least that's the way I view it, but please do provide your own thoughts on this.

>>67681 *rates/quantity, sorry for the horrendous misspelling. Also, I think I had a brainfart when saying "per capita PER communication instance", that really doesn't make sense. I should've just said "per communication-instance". Wonder if there's a formal term for what I'm trying to describe in this post...

>>67579 Its good if you already have a group you socialize irl with to hang out, there's a few good servers based off niche communities, the best ones have a habit of hatting new people and do a bit of hazing/trolling.

>>67657 Oh, I forgot one major con. It's an inapropriate store of knowledge. It's a walled off garden that requires an account and a phone number to even see information yet it's being used by projects as the go to place for information. It's not indexed by search engines. It contains a crazy amount of information but organized in a system catered for instant messaging. Many chat channels with information added as individual posts. What will happen to it all when Discord inevitably goes down or becomes paid?

>>67695 Yeah. It's annoying seeing projects using discord as some sort of wiki. At best i'm ok with it being used like some sort of blogging tool. Kinda like a telegram channel. >What will happen to it all when Discord inevitably goes down or becomes paid? You already know the answer, but I don't think that's a valid question to ask. You can basically say that about X things, but of course the scenario is more likely with discord than something like Gitlab. Moral of story, don't keep your knowledge in one place. Redundancy is key. Don't become the smallest library of Alexandria.

>Game has in game communication >Hey join my discord so we can chat >Oblige >They exclusively use in game coms W-what

>>67579 Honestly i just use this because i'm used to it. Simple as.

>>67695 The good thing is that you can get an account using a burner phone # (you can easily get a temp/public phone # online for free). I quit discord years ago because I enjoyed not having to identify myself. Now I use it occasionally again thanks to the burner but I agree with the OP and most lains here in the fact that Discord is absolute dogshit. Shitty UX, zero privacy protections, walled garden. It's somehow even worse than Matrix. Matrix is at least free software so I can forgive it a little.

>>67729 Have you tried server-wide mutes? You should be able to right-click the server icon, go to notification settings within the context menu, and choose mentions --> only @mentions. You can also toggle pings for people doing @everyone and @here. Alternatively, just do server-wide mutes if you can't be asked to get pinged at all. I bet those seemingly random beeps happen because you have your notification settings set to "all messages" for most, if not all servers you're part of. It's likely that when anyone posts any message on any chat, you get notified of that, hence all the beeps.

>>67579 its literal dog soykaf and a WEB "app" its simply popular because its popular also using it for anything but games is turbo cu"cked ass backwards retardation

>>67796 If you know it's fuarrrking you up why don't you stop using it? I get why you need to talk to people but irc really isn't complicated at all, just use hexchat

>>67801 >WHY? it should have gad no effect on those mods yet it did. Well, it sounds like the Discord app does a lot of interesting, yet untrustworthy, things.

>>67803 I wonder if that is why the indie devs use it? I know my old employer made us use it for work. We did d and d sessions on it. I suspect the real reason was to check on us to see if we were playing games instead of working.

lainchain 2023: "do u rly care about privacy? how bout discord?"

I think you may try again When i first download discord in 2020 i really found it lame and annoying but recently i tried it again an via "Disboard" i join many little servers and it instantly became better, those server kinda felt like a group chat with your friend and then we started to have inside jokes to play together etc etc.....

>>67579 Use it only for voice chat and private wow server status.

>>67623 >>67623 You're just wilfully ignoring everything negative people are saying. You're not even arguing you're just having a monologue and serving platitudes. You're a horrible person

>>67929 Discord is, if anything, a web 2.0 version of IRC. People complain about how discord is horrible to search for things compared to a forum, but IRC has the same problem as discord. There is so far no substitute for a forum in the things a forum was good for. RPGCodex, for example, have interesting threads full of old games, how to play many of them in modern computer, etc. That thing would be impossible to have on discord because it would be among full of random discussion making it impossible to search for what you need(IRC too would have the same problem, btw).

I think it makes more sense to join a discord centered around a community or person with a certain topic that you want to get in touch with more instead of joining a server you know nothing about. A good example of this would be Bisqwit. I enjoy his educational programming videos and he runs a small server where discussion happens.

>>67929 discord requires registry. idk about you but Im never going to use it for this reason alone. The only reason I got into IRC (which has since changed my life significantly) was because the barrier to entry was zero and I could basically just try it. Discord aint like that.

>>67930 You're correct that there is no real forum substitute. There is this fairly new feature of "threads", but it's rarely used like a sub-channel or group chat that gets deleted after a week of inactivity. It's also easily lost between regular messages. It's really just an IRC with pictures. Nothing real-time can replace a forum or chan.

>>67579 >What do people actually do on Discord that makes it enjoyable? nothing, its just the most popular voice soykaf for gaytmers atm most people you will encounter are naturally unhinged retards and get offended if you say the word white or black, as most people who speak english are

>>68014 The english language seems to cause some sort of brain damage. Being an english speaker should be considered a mental disability of some sort.

>>67882 Most important post in this thread and really sad that it took so long. Discord is literal spyware and you're an idiot if you use it.

>>68027 yep. though the keyboard input is probably just for text chat

>>68027 Pretty sure the people here already know, or at least assume that this soykaf is literal spyware. been lurking enough to see lainons drag it beyond the dirt 6 feet down under a buncha times. Only difference is that I imagine most people who use discord here assesed that it isn't too much of an issue and use it because of the need to keep up with their folks. if you really need to hide something, or if your privacy is to be protected at all cost, you already know you shouldn't use discord and you're already aren't using it. Hell, you're already ignoring this thread and let "idiots" be idiots.

>>68030 >Only difference is that I imagine most people who use discord here assesed that it isn't too much of an issue and use it because of the need to keep up with their folks. Can confirm for myself. I know Discord is a botnet nightmare sending all my activity to commercial firms and the feds. But by the time I knew that I've already made friends there and I'd hate to migrate to Matrix or IRC fully while telling those people "sorry but I have privacy concerns."

The discussion on spyware has got me thinking. Isn't it possible to mitigate most of those privacy concerns? For example, wouldn't running the web client on a containerized web browser and a secure display server neutralize the possibility of Discord recording keyboard input of other programs. Same thing with tracking what programs you are running or whatever. >>You're not running your browser on a container, Lainon?

>>68034 I believe it is. At least, that's the path I would take to try to sanitize my environment if I had to absolutely use Discord on a privacy focused machine for some divine reason. I was going to joke in my post saying "You're also using QubesOS", but it's what I would try, honestly. And then, whatever you do inside discord from that point, well, i mean... just keep in mind it's their service, not yours. Assume they have a tendency to be a bit of a peeping tom.

>>68034 >Isn't it possible to mitigate most of those privacy concerns? Certainly not the most important one: that everything you say is recorded by a venture capital firm to be commodified and sold for a profit.

>>68034 >>You're not running your browser on a container, Lainon? I'm not even running Discord through a browser. I'm doing it directly from the executable like normal cattle bc having it in my taskbar is convenient

>>68034 You can simply use an open-source client like Fosscord or client patches that disable telemetry such as Vencord. >cord cord cord

>>67579 Don't know who said it was great, Discord is pretty bad especially the big servers who are "Discord partners" because everyone is REALLY moderated and you cant say anything really because you'll get muted or something. I use discord on a daily basis for one server which is kind of a small/medium friend circle because I don't have better ways to chat with them If you have better alternatives to chat with online friends you should go for those probably, Discord is like kicking dead whales down the beach real bad

>>67579 I use IRC, like a chad. It's glowie free.

>>68118 irc is insecure by default and arcane to configure. if you're worried about LEOs then it's the worst communications platform. dedicate yourself to peace and seek not trouble.

>>68125 this honestly i mean isnt that how sabu was compromised? he logged into an irc and forgot to use tor, glowies snagged his ip and through the isp they found him. a better option would be something like matrix (although lets be real, it is by no means flawless)

It's one of those things you get pressured into because not enough people you know want to use whatever you want to use. So what is the best way to get around problems with Discord aside from not using it? Has anyone tried to reverse engineer it?

>>68144 The solution is to not interact with such poople, if they all want to run off the cliff as part of the herd then let them run off the cliff and hope they all die.

>>68140 or you know, actually make sure you can't connect to it without tor by using something like tails matrix is way too complex

>>68118 Honestly just don't act like a dumbass online and you'll be fine. Government agents aren't after your ass, and will likely never be.

>>68145 If your internet friends don't want to talk to you regardless of what platform you're on then they are probably not real friends >>68147 Sounds like something a fed would say, hmm...

>>68146 Not that lain, but that doesn't really address all the problems with irc. If a sysop wants to, they can spy on your private messages. If the server is compromised, logs can be recorded (and if history as shown us anything, it's that the sysops are probably logging everything anyway). Look at old hacker zines, for example. They're full of irc dumps of rival hacker groups' private irc channels. And there's issues like making sure all participants are configured to avoid stuff like irc's file transfer exploit, nobody is using irc clients that send identifying metadata, and client exploits. Using Tor doesn't address any of this.

I've almost considered using Discord to talk to people I know IRL due to them not willing to use anything else to talk to me on. I mean would it exactly be more secure to talk to these people on their phones that have Facebook, Instagram, and other soykaf installed with no privacy features enabled on fuarrrking stock android devices, etc? Most of the people I know now days don't even have a computer anymore. I've not talked to any of them online for close to a year now and everyone is starting to become more distant with me. Perhaps I should just let them be and become a ghost that they used to know and move on with my life alone in a deep search for more people like myself.

>>68159 I have been meaning to cut off all of my channels too, just keep a phone number for sms (encryption? doesn't matter) and email. Talking to people on messenger apps all the time takes out the fun and excitement of getting to meet people. Meeting friends after a long time has gone from "yooooo wassup" to a blank and awkward gaze. Sure, it's better than having to spam emails for people across the planet but the charm of it is gone.

I use Discord bc it's easy to do live screen sharing and mostly bc it's my only way to talk to people who speak my language (french). All FLOSS/privacy-oriented alternative are full of english speaking people and I feel really bad at speaking english bc I feel I'm bad at it (even after years of studying it I feel the need to verify every sentence I write just to be sure I'm not going to look like a fool) I would love to just get ride of that soykafware on my computer.

>>68143 >in order to sell that information to advertisers Minor nitpick, and its a generalized one that's snagged on to this: Its not just advertisers. Its all plugged into the national security state on the back end. I prefer to just call it "the system", as in " in order for the system to surveil you." I don't think its just semantics, because calling it just "advertisers" really blunts the full impact of what's going on. Its a massive surveillance system that is spying on everyone not just for profit, not just in order to better manipulate the individual and engineer the masses, but also for political control and ultimately oppression, though (presently) that's mostly for the extreme outliers.

>>68209 At this point it's a simple conclusion that anyone willing to sell your communication to advertisers also has no problem giving it away to government spook agencies. There's been too many examples to count.

>>67579 Duck it im going to do it

>>67579 >Why Use Discord Because you can make a little private server for you and your friends. It's incredibly simple and it just werks™️ That's about it. Public discord servers are literally worthless. Don't even bother with them. I'm reminded of a halfchan post that called it "gayer than a forum and a chatroom combined."

>>68318 >Because you can make a little private server for you and your friends. Joke post? You absolutely can't. Discord owns and controls everything.

I will never use it because the privacy policy makes it clear that every word you type will be sold and end up training dystopian large language models and stylometric analysis that will personally compromise you >>68299 Qubes

>>68321 You know what meaning of private was meant.

>>68334 Yeah I'm pretty sure Discord staff are lacking people who speak anything else but English. Though I think it's also partially that they don't care. The only way to not get your servers deleted is literally just groom children and collect illicit images of them because that seems to be a free pass for breaking ToS.

What is it exactly that made Discord popular? Just filling a small niche with gamers doesnt seem like it should have brought other people in. I know before Discord what everyone used was Skype and main complaint with that was video and audio call quality where it would drop off but Discord didn't originally have either of these features. I did notice some people mention group chats in Skype got laggy when you had around 50 people in a group but Discord servers are not the same functionality as a group chat because how publicly accessible they are and these public servers also seem to be among the main complaints made about Discord. If it's understood why it's popular and why it's hated then something FOSS can be tailed to fill these needs to replace it so we all can have more privacy without having to be socially isolated. Anyone have any more ideas on why it might be popular and widely hated at the same time?

>>68452 I started putting on loads of weight and fast after I started using Arch and I'm a Discord mod as well. Hmmmm...

>>68463 That's what I was thinking. Group chats seem fine but trying to make it something like what used to be acomplished by Yahoo Chatrooms goes in the direction for something also used for personal conversations and seems which seems to be why some people hate that. I may be mistaken though. What is closest we have to Discord that would be a base to start with some coders could build off of? Element maybe? I was thinking what if code from Mumble was integrated for it's voice calls which itself was very popular before Discord so it's a good start, then we just need a solution for video calls. And what else make it so it can overlay on games like Discord if it cant already? Maybe then it could overtake Discord. >>68465 Yes we know it's not really a personal server and because it's cloud based it's not private.

>>68465 We all know. You don't need to tell us. It's "private" in the sense that it's not public.

There's an old online group of friends I can't no longer access because they moved to Discord from IRC and I lost my Discord account and have no other way of contacting them.

>>68374 as an ex exporter and child groomer I got to confirm. Discord is a total mess.

>>68492 Discord could always block that addon or what is needed to make it work at any time or ban accounts that use it. In theory at least. And what about voice and video call? How would you have your own encryption for that? And what happens if Discord fails as a profitable company and then shuts down without releasing the source code? You could lose all your logs if you care about those unless you externally back them up but you still would wind up potentially losing contact with a lot of people.

Nobody enjoy discord, but friends are already there so might as well.

>>68519 This. Discord is just a fad anyway. At one point, they'll have to be profitable and it's going to be more and more intrusive and impractical. It will drives people off and they're going to switch to another messaging "app". The interesting question is: will it be decentralized/p2p AND libre?

>>68526 I agree. I think that Matrix has a chance at becoming the Discord replacement when the time comes. I have been hearing about it more and more from people who don't necessarily care that much about freedom and privacy. Though, only time can tell what will happened.

>>68526 Messaging apps become popular based on how easy their mobile client is to use. So I wouldn't necessarily hold by breath unless you think know a decentralized FOSS messager that has a S-tier android client.

>>68530 The fact that you can easily bridge matrix to a bunch of services, including discord, makes it relatively painless to switch.

>>68531 If that was the case then discord would t be popular. Their discord client is dogshit, basically a web app frontend.

>>68532 Issue is the lack of call support with the bridges. If that can be implemented then that'll be a big step forward.

How valid are these complains about Matrix? https://www.nuegia.net/articles/matrix.xhtml If this is such an issue why hasnt someone taken some good looking Matrix clients and turned them into XMPP clients? Since people that use Discord or anything mainstream will only really care about performance, features, appearance and ease of use.

>logging is bad on the other hand when Im using it for support i like the logs to be plentiful, public, and searchible. I see a lot of things telling u to use discord these days for support and its a completely opaque and terrible option. ok maybe for chatting with your friends, but thats a pretty different niche. support really should be done on forums. forums>irc>discord in this domain

>>68623 the things you're looking for should really just be put on a wiki somewhere to be easily accessible, looking for pinned messages on discord or just old messages is retarded (but something that you have to do I get it)

>>68519 theyre not really your friends if they make you use discord

>>67579 It's not that bad if you have normal person friends who you gayme with and some niche forums turned into servers ,

I'm gen z and have friends, so I use discord otherwise I'd go insane from loneliness and resort back to being a neet. No thanks to that life again. Could be much worse, like having to use Instagram or TikTok, yuck.

>>77594 Congratulations, you've been pwned. Don't worry, you're worthless anyway, so nobody cares, not even you. Just saying.

>name is "Discord" >"Why is it so soykaf?" Might as well name a car brand "Car Wreck", then wonder why your son died driving one. Gee, I wonder.

>>67595 I don't know, if I have to pick between being forced to be insincere and adopt a false social mask to make people feel good about themselves just to serve the discussion so they don't run away with their tails between their legs crying vs just being able to be ruthlessly honest. I'll take ruthlessly honest, even if it means having to put up with trolls and idiots that's fine. They don't bother me because they say obviously dumb soykaf and demonstrate themselves as being low IQ posters with nothing to contribute. Just ignore them. The only people who get really upset by that are people who can't manage their ego, which is often one of the biggest problems with communities like the ones you describe. Subject matter always ends up becoming the slave to socialization until its so one sided everyone is saying demonstrably untrue things and no one is allowed to speak up because it's socially unacceptable or the power mods take personal offense to it and ban it on principle alone reguardless of sincerity or context. This is the internet, what's the point of any of this if we have to dance around social pleasantries and wear a pretty facade for everyone just like in real life? At that point you're better off just going outside and making real friends in real life that you can do real things with.

I have to use it to get access to some specific information but cant even make an account. Even using real phone number on physical sim and they reject it as invalid number. I had issues with email domains too. How the fuarrrk normal people are so obsessed with this when its so hard to use?

>>78863 > I have to use it to get access to some specific information but cant even make an account. Even using real phone number on physical sim and they reject it as invalid number. I had issues with email domains too. Discord has cracked down on people creating burner accounts recently. Something about what you are using to register may be shadowderezzed or flagged (your email or email provider, your browser, your IP address, your unique hardware fingerprint, etc). Perhaps they are more lenient when registering on a mobile device, or from within the official app. > How the fuarrrk are normal people are so obsessed with this when its so hard to use? Normal people don't take many (if any) preventative measures against companies harvesting data. They don't use ad blockers, they don't use VPNs (unless they are spammed with a VPN enough times), they don't use hardened forks of security-focused browsers running on esoteric flavors of *NIX operating systems on librebooted hardware older than they are with the microphone and camera ripped out and the chassis wrapped in Faraday fabric. To quote a blog post from May Vane Day: > [M]ost people have more pressing and immediate issues in their life than the vague-to-them threat of corporate surveillance or vendor lock-in. If you ask some random person off the street what their top five concerns are right now, "privacy on the Internet" almost certainly isn't going to make the list. ... > "Normal" people don't care about privacy and security. They don't care if their tools are proprietary or spying on them or could go away at a moment's notice if the company behind them shuts down. They want to play games with their friends (Windows) and socialize (Discord and every mainstream social media site) and get help with their homework (Google search). ... > If the privacy community wants to get "normal" people on board, they have to figure out how to overcome the apathy and make their alternatives more convenient and less expensive than what the "normal" people are already using. Source: https://mayvane.day/blog/2023/08/interview.html This sentiment of being more convenient and less expensive than the competition is what Signal, for all its issues, aims to do. It is what the fleet of Simple Mobile Tools (and their various forks) aim to do. It is what Grayjay (grayjay.app) aims to do. And it is what ffmpeg has done (https://drewdevault.com/2022/10/12/In-praise-of-ffmpeg.html). To that end, if you wish to migrate people away from Discord, create something better than Discord with features specifically designed to highlight Discord's shortcomings. For example: - An option for self hosting a server, with drop-in bridges for Discord (similar to the ones in Matrix) and processes for importing and archiving the contents of Discord servers. - Allow users to drop in ShareX config files to use alternate file hosting services. - Look at the work being done in various BetterDiscord client forks and add features from there. Perhaps the best option is something like Mumble. You download a client, drop in a single config file, and it just works (TM). But I digress. If you must hate Discord, use your hatred and make something to dethrone it.

>>77599 GenZ self-deprecation is the equivalent of millennial lol so randumb humour.

>>78871 >Source: https://mayvane.day/blog/2023/08/interview.html I read this post and some more of the site and man this person is insufferable. >the misogynistic stereotype of the "wine mom" Says the person constantly soykafting on a generalised, monolithic idea of males. Negative female stereotypes are "misogynist", but negative male stereotypes are just truth and male nature, am I right? >https://mayvane.day/blog/2024/03/web-aint-dead.html Says that "old web" nostalgia is fascist because yearning for an idealised past is something that fascists do. God I am so tired of the indiscriminate use of the word "fascist" online. "Old web" nostalgia is focused on decentralisation which is antithetical to fascism. >https://mayvane.day/2024_books.html Grumbles whenever fictional characters have heterosexual relationships. Yeah, unfortunately the vast majority of people are heterosexual and it wasn't their choice, get over it. Can't complain too much about receiving hate mail when you're a bitter hater yourself.

>>68318 >I'm reminded of a halfchan post that called it "gayer than a forum and a chatroom combined." because it's literally trying to be both of those things at once and is like kicking dead whales down the beach ass for both

https://lainchan.org/%CE%A9/res/67579.html#q67579 >>67579 >Absolutely fuarrrking soulless experience compared to IRC People need to look into DarkIRC (which btw is better then normal IRC: https://darkrenaissance.github.io/darkfi/misc/darkirc/darkirc.html Also the dev is a based Iranian chad https://xcancel.com/Narodism https://xcancel.com/Narodism/status/1846515492388761844#m >or even Matrix where people actually talk Matrix aka Amdocs is a honeypot and fake decentralized chat mossad trix sh*lled in the privacy community. Imagine using a protocal created my an Israeli telecoms company that datamined americans and the us government. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Amdocs https://inv.nadeko.net/watch?v=1YbpKeWBwa0 https://telecoms.com/418812/amdocs-acquires-comverse-bss-business-for-272m/ https://archive.org/details/CensoredIsraeliSoftwareSpyingOnUSAmDocsComverseInfosysCarlCameronDec2001 https://hackea.org/notas/matrix.html https://www.nuegia.net/articles/matrix.xhtml https://disroot.org/en/blog/matrix-closure >Matrix stores the data posted to any room indefinitely on all participating servers. User addresses are visible to anyone participating in the room (in case of public rooms, it basically means to anyone). https://matrix.org/legal/privacy-notice/ > 2.11 Who else has access to my data? >We store some files shared through the Service on Amazon Web Services (AWS) >We use Cloudflare to mitigate the risk of DDoS attacks. https://gist.github.com/maxidorius/5736fd09c9194b7a6dc03b6b8d7220d0 https://github.com/libremonde-org/paper-research-privacy-matrix.org/blob/master/part1/README.md https://github.com/libremonde-org/paper-research-privacy-matrix.org/blob/master/part2/README.md

>>81707 >Imagine using a protocal created my an Israeli telecoms company that datamined americans and the us government. Based

>>78871 >Source: https://mayvane.day/blog/2023/08/interview.html Why do the people who run these privacy oriented blog sites sound so dark and edgy? It reminds me of this other site called sizeof cat which is all doom posting as well.

>>81707 >https://xcancel.com/Narodism See their twitter banner >solarpunk >Ted Kaczynski >people with ak 47's >Terry Davis / TempleOS >anime Wow the dev prob posts on here and also I'm sold

The problem with "good" software is that no one cares. Discord is a commercial outfit looking to make money. It can invest some of that money into advertising. It can grow, like a tumor. Computer users are just that, computer users. They don't understand anything. They don't care about privacy. They don't care about the cost of running servers. They don't care about the client's resource usage (just buy a faster computer!). They don't care. Life's soykaf. Use soykaf software. Die in a ditch. You can't make people care about things they genuinely don't care about. The idea that a floss project can 'win' users over to Discord fails to admit the economic realities that are present. Why is Windows so popular? Why does x software have so many users when y is objectively better suited for their users' needs? Money, money, money, and they don't care. Like another lain said, Matrix is soykaf too. Mossad's attempt to give and slurp up encrypted comms. It has money behind it, so again, it grows like a tumor.

>>81707 Jesus Christ, can the plebs not have a single platform that doesn't glow? Summary of the "Notes on privacy and data collection of Matrix.org" (https://gitlab.com/libremonde-org/papers/research/privacy-matrix.org, https://github.com/libremonde-org/paper-research-privacy-matrix.org): matrix.org and vector.im receive a lot of private, personal and identifiable data on a regular basis, or metadata that can be used to precisely identify and/or track users/server, their social graph, usage pattern and potential location. This is possible both by the default configuration values in synapse/Riot that do not promote privacy, and by specific choices made by their developers to not disclose, inform users or resolve in a timely manner several known behaviors of the software. Data sent on a potential regular basis based on a common web/desktop+smartphone usage even with a self-hosted client and Homeserver: - The Matrix ID of users, usually including their username. - Email addresses, phone numbers of the user and their contacts. - Associations of Email, phone numbers with Matrix IDs. - Usage patterns of the user. - IP address of the user, which can give more or less precise geographical location information. - The user’s devices and system information. - The other servers that users talks to. - Room IDs, potentially identifying the Direct chat ones and the other user/server. With default settings, they allow unrestricted, non-obfuscated public access to the following potentially personal data/info: - Matrix IDs mapped to Email addresses/phone numbers added to a user’s settings. - Every file, image, video, audio that is uploaded to the Homeserver. - Profile name and avatar of users. (Summary sauce https://hackea.org/notas/matrix.html)

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Client-to-client_protocol tl;dr unless configured otherwise, that is by default, IRC allows doxxing your timezone. Everything glows. Everything.

>>81713 picrel and based >>81721 Matrix is utter trash the only thing it has is seemless encrypted group chats but even when you host your own matrix server you dont have the privacy you would otherwise have when hosting a XMPP or IRC server. Not to mention that hosting a Matrix server requires more heavy duty hardware as compaired to a cheap Single board computer for XMPP or IRC. >>81722 Thats why you use uwt (Time Privacy) or create a VM that has a certain timezone or randomize your timezone everyboot.

Harvest Now, Decrypt Later (HNDL) should be Matrix's slogan Matrix has been known to delete/ban/remove "far right rooms" while leaving up or not going after pedo rooms. >Matrix.org a federated app funded by a mossad company https://archive.is/aNzoF >Why Matrix is gay https://archive.is/rR9Q2 When you join a room on Matrix everyone see you address (e.g account@matrix.server) unlike on XMPP where usually its only the rooms admins/owner that can see peoples user/nickname with their corresponding address account@xmpp.server

Matrix is federated (which is not peer to peer) and it’s ok that all is end-to-end encrypted, but all the metadata are shared cleartext with all the other matrix server. This means that one malicious server in the federated network can have access to the metadata conversation of other people

Just use Simplex already and quit being a chud

>>81795 SimpleX has no good clients for desktop yet, the official one doesn't even work if compiling statically. Mobile client is decent though

>>81751 neither of those archive links load and calling it "gay" just makes me assume youre an iidiot

>>81752 You can make your server non-federated though can't you? I figure half of the issues surrounding Matrix aren't as severe if you don't federate.

>>81795 anyone wanna make a server?

i firmly believe SimpleX, Session and any NEW """""""Security Secure Privacy""""""" focused chat protocol are memes, snake oil, and botnet. irc xmpp matrix are the only ones well established. even doe >>81751

>>82134 Sessions proven to be glowop. Simplex still to be seen. Qute complex. Matrix... No. But inform me on IRC vs. XMPP? My limited understanding while IRC I think can't really be secure, it's just so old that it can be run on any OS through any type of tunnel so could be anon, up to the user if they want to push it through whonix. But I think XMPP can be both anon in that regard, and secure because of OMEMO right? So we should be using XMPP and Omemo? Is this better than OTR?

> no interesting discussion, no nothing >do it yourself >who? me? If you play the game "Social Life", you do not set the rules, but accept them. So be easy, don't care, and do what society wants. if they get's fun of stupid memes, who the f.k are you to interrupt them?

>>82137 >My limited understanding while IRC I think can't really be secure, it's just so old that it can be run on any OS through any type of tunnel so could be anon, up to the user if they want to push it through whonix. Correct, even if blowfish encryption has already been secretly cracked. OTR plugin is the way to go for one on one conversations. XMPP, in every nook and cranny, is still superior to all. But, OMEMO has issues, where OTR is good fallback. For whatever reason, most clients has been dropping OTR support as they """"""""""""""""""""""""""think"""""""""""""""""""""""""" OMEMO succeeds it. OTR is end-to-end. OMEMO is ends-to-ends, that is, MITMed by design. It's built for phoneposters, and is only better than using nothing at all. neva4forgt https://notes.valdikss.org.ru/jabber.ru-mitm/

>>82140 Jeez on Hetzner and Linode. The support ticket replies are obviously typical fed-corp-speak "cannot confirm nor-deny" bs. Bundespolizei basically does whatever the fuarrrk it wants so because of it's all-encompassing organizational structure so wouldn't surprise me. Plus they arrest and imprison grannies for free speech there I wouldn't trust Germany on any dimension.

>>82137 stock IRC is insecure yeah, no encryption out of the box, password authentication only (must be provided by IRC daemon) and IP leaks (unless daemon has configured cloaking). however, if you use add NickServ's SASL authentication, onion services, host/ip cloaking and TLS to the mix, it is much more secure. XMPP is pretty secure out of the box though, but hardened IRC is still a worthy competitor

>>82139 that is bullshit, i have tried to make interesting discussions, i feel like atlas sometimes, i am the only fuarrrking thing that creates life in any xmpp or irc chatroom, it is tiresome, i quit.

>>82139 Discord is not 'social life'. Go outside.

>>82137 You're correct, IRC as a protocol is totally insecure. It can be wrapped in TLS but it will still never be end-to-end, the server will always read your traffic. And yes it can be anonymous if you use Tor and block CTCP replies and other identifying information and characteristics of your client. You should also know that direct chat (DCC, different from "private messages") doesn't work the same way as normal chatting and has its own pitfalls. OTR is very old and the primitives it uses are considered to be weak. It's also limited to 1-on-1 conversations, and can't be used to send offline messages.

>>82157 I don't really get why so many people care about offline messages. These days tons of people are logged in 24/7 because smartphones and because lower energy use on PCs these days than back in the 90s. All they have to do is set up a message cue where if someone is offline it will wait till they are on to send it and allow you to remove it before it sends if you change your mind.

>>82157 You can always use pgp with Irc. Security is a spectrum, and depending on threat model it can be considered more secure than whatever the currently recommended messenger is

>>82159 you also can use OpenPGP on XMPP (i like Psi+)

>>82163 Is there a single person who isnt a tech nerd or a schizo or government targeted individual that uses PGP? It just isnt automated enough to be wides scale usable unfortunately or am I wrong

>>82164 It's common to use PGP for encryption.

>>82165 Come on, dude. It's not even common among Lains. >>82164 is totally right about tech nerds and schizos. >>82158 >logged in 24/7 because smartphones Isn't that an illusion caused by push notifications? Apps that actually keep running in the background hit the battery pretty hard. >>82159 PGP is stronger but has no deniability or forward secrecy. Up to you if that tradeoff is worth it. I guess you could add key rotation but then you've just re-invented the Signal protocol.

>>82184 My package manager uses PGP.

>>82164 >Only people who want/need encyption enable encryption Shocker. PGP cant just be enabled by default on everything since it required users to actually know what theyre doing.

>>82164 IMO the biggest issue with PGP is that GnuPG has a garbage interface. I also still have no idea how to properly use keyservers, for that matter. But it doesn't have to be hard: I find managing SSH keys very easy, in no small part because it doesn't try do to more than necessary. None of this certificate or subkey stuff that is good on paper but a massive pain to actually manage. I've been considering making a set of applications that use SSH keys for encryption. SSH is very common, so I believe piggybacking on it (just the keys, not the protocol) would be useful to make secure identity management + communications more widespread.

>>82184 > Isn't that an illusion caused by push notifications? Apps that actually keep running in the background hit the battery pretty hard. Don't they often run periodically in background just pausing and unpausing? Or atleast that would seem the more logical way to work if power consumption is an issue then you wouldnt even need push notifications if you expect need to immediately reply you just keep the app in foreground and when not go to background. Still when it comes to PCs though that isnt the case, is it? They generally are actually running. I just rarely ever saw any advantage to being able to send offline messages. 95% of the time it is indistinguishable from cued messages these days. >>82192 My point was the best encryption is one everyone would use from not having to think about it and being easy to set up. Trying to convince and teach someone is a real hinderance to privacy and security.

>>68159 I find it's pretty easy to get people to install signal, just tell them you'll be taking a trip out of country and it's easiest for you. Once they begin using it they're unlikely to stop.

>>82204 That's pretty sneaky, I like it. Although they might eventually get tired of opening up a whole different app just for you. How well does Signal integrate into messaging? If they try to text you normally, will Signal take over?

>>67579 I don't get it at all. The MFA alone is such a painful experience I don't bother with it. Then you're more than likely to get derezzed for pissing off mods because discord users aren't there to hear opinions, they want to control speech. Even if you make a new account, you're essentially stuck in Karma hell. Karma is killing the internet. Up voting mentality on the internet has ruined it. All it does is leverage sockpuppets and advertisement platforms while banning those that point them out. Sure there are bots and (s)hills on chans, but that's still better than having your forum gate kept through a literal corpo mod. Big pharma is probably the one promoting this soykaf the most. That and the blowback to epstein's bullshit. That cartel must get power at all costs amirite?

>>68159 >I mean would it exactly be more secure to talk to these people on their phones that have Facebook, Instagram From memory, apparently yes. That's how bad Discord is. You're better off just using any standard messenger because none of it is secure. Then again, I have to use greasymonkey and adblocker extensions just to get a feed on fb that isn't just ads (like nothing but ads, no posts by friends or even things I follow - just pages I haven't even followed nowadays, it's SO soykaf now). Most people just use instagram now. Why bother with fb? Then again, instagram is also garbage like that (also owned by "Meta", "Meta" is the name because it is "meta" tier quality that's for sure now )

>>82206 >How well does Signal integrate into messaging? If they try to text you normally, will Signal take over? it doesnt anymore

was gonna make this it's own thread but might as well bump this one. discord now scraps posted images for LLM training. this is not optional as far as i know. how we feeling about this? personally: positive = it will be easier to push friends to irc or xmpp. negative = i know, you know, we all know the kind of pedo soykaf that gets posted on there and how soykaf their moderation is. illegal content is bound to slip into the training data. kind of a positive = the soykaf storm controversy resulting if that scenario happens will be actual gold to watch https://www.newgrounds.com/bbs/topic/1543138#bbspost28031891_post_text https://support.discord.com/hc/en-us/community/posts/30239349701527-Remove-the-AI-remix-feature

>nooooo discord datamines us holy fuarrrk you're so annoying it's unbearable. if you use discord stfu and eat soykaf that you deserve

>>83726 I doubt anyone that didn't care about privacy would start now. Someone might make a youtube video and get 1 million views talking about it but everyone will forget about it in mere days. It's similar to what happened with kernel level anticheats.

>>81795 if only simplex had an emacs client...

>>82192 why not just use age and signify? age for encryption, signify for signatures, both use Curve25519 iirc

I don't understand why no one has made a viable composition that can be popular, easy to use and privacy friendly and maybe allow more advanced privacy features that are harder to set up as optional for those who want to use them. Start with Element for design influence but get a proper designer not a programmer designing, and remove Electron to reduce footprint, use something like XMPP instead of the Matrix maybe since so many complain about it, use Mumble's audio processing for voice and video calls. Make connections similar to how Portmaster's Safing Privacy Network works which should be a lot faster than Tor although less secure. Anything else? If only I could program and had the focus to do this.

>>83752 my first thought is that no one is going to provide for the servers with the kind of bandwidth and power needed if you want it to truly be as popular as discord (since it's a hypotethical substitute). you have to assume most people will never even understand what self hosting is and think discord or every other app is a self contained program. XMPP, matrix, mumble, all this software works because they're not so popular so some groups of people can gather and host some main servers for the entire network, and most people are into tech and can self host as well, but i don't think that can happen with a discord substitute. i think the main reason (implicit, because they probably don't know it) people use discord or any other non foss communication program is the conveniency of a company hosting the servers.

>>83752 if there's anything you can do about it then you should. even if its just commission people to handle the parts you can't do. theres tons of coders who want this to exist. do you remember tox? >>83754 infrastructure is a secondary concern, it doesn't matter until you even approach the users for it. personally i would make it a peer-to-peer protocol

You can set up your own instance of a Mastodon server and be the only one that uses it. But you can still connect to any or all other Mastodon instances that You want to, and communicate with all of the people on them. That way, you're the boss of your instance and nobody can tell you what to do or kick you off. All that could happen is some instances might disconnect from you, the same as you can disconnect from them if you don't like them. Or if you really wanted to, you could invite people to become members of your instance. But then you'd have to deal with moderation.

>>83754 Who says you need dedicated servers or that they need to understand anything? It can either be just p2p or have users act as nodes to relay the information without any input needed from them to hide the IP of where messages come from even though it would have down side of exposing IP of users in general which could be collected over time. Whichever is possible within reason while not sacrificing performance or bandwidth. Does that make sense? >>83765 I am broke. I sure couldnt commission people so i just try to throw out my half baked idea out there hoping someone takes it on and does so correctly which seems like a long shot and I of course couldnt figure everything out myself since the intent would be to be both secure and user friendly so any idiot can use it but security id a tough subject no one fully agrees on what is best so there would have to be some approach of making a few methods work with it for different threat models if there is a way to do that in a single program and still have it communicate to each other properly.

>>67579 It's the same as with every big, compartmentalized social media: you avoid big, general places and stick to small, niche pockets, preferably with few people that you already know.

I am desperately begging for TS6 to be released for selfhosters ASAP, I ran a TS3 server for a while but no-one wanted to lose the proper chat support and screen sharing/video streaming of discord. Now, discord is being publicly traded and is adding "Quests" to the mobile app too. TS could make a soykaf load of money from communities and server licence payments, but they seem to enjoy dropping the ball.

>>67582 other social media. for example /soc/ had constant threads about them, same with r*ddit. the Internet is a top down siphon now.

>>83766 > twitter II, now with less people! wow, sign me up >>83752 because the people who are able and aware are just fine with the status quo. i IRC with friends and sometimes we mumble. my head doesnt explode if i have to open 2 windows at once. that said, yeah, its a solid idea. there would be money in it too probably. just no one cares enough to implement it. >>82260 spot on anon >>82192 >IMO the biggest issue with PGP is that GnuPG has a garbage interface yeah, why whole workflow revolves around the terminal, but the second i need gpg, im opening kleopatra >>82139 > just socialize alone ??? >>81716 what is surprising is how much soykaf people are willing to put up with. i mean, they obviously do not understand privacy or even optimization, but when the UX starts actively stomping on them, they still take it, just so they dont have to spend an hour setting up an alternative.

Element was a pretty good alternative from what I saw. Only thing that stopped me from using it was communities still using Discord. IRC after years of trying is too barebones to seriously get people to move to it.

>>85356 >TS could make a soykaf load of money from communities and server licence payments, but they seem to enjoy dropping the ball. I don't think so. Through their actions people have indicated that they prefer freemium botnet SAAS like Discord to paying for software and hosting it themselves. Programs like TS & Vent are relics of the past.

>>67579 So you joined random programming/gaming servers? That's like typing "music" on youtube and listening to the first result.

public servers are always trash and run by manchildren who want to feel powerful. only reason i'm there is since majority of my friends use it. they're too well-adjusted to go to some ancient protocols or niche applications that they haven't heard of before.

People say it's easy to get a girlfriend there, and yet, I failed.

discord is literally hot garbage. it's a dustbin for mentally unstable people and extremists. if you don't already know someone on there and you go in expecting to make friends it's a terrible idea. first server i joined was ran by a 25 year old guy that was habitually dating 16 year olds. he nuked it after i found out because i posted a meme making fun of him and then he wiped that account and started using another account. absolute psychos can do whatever they please on there so long as they have extra accounts on standby. alternatives to mainstream social media aren't exactly advertised either so i'm guessing a lot of discord's new users are either younger friend groups or neets desperate for some kind of socialization. religious and political discord servers are horrible and philosophical discord servers are a direct pipeline to both. if you find a server that says they "respect free speech" there is a very high chance of it being infested with religious extremists/literal nazis and i don't use the term nazi lightly. once you make a friend or two then the site essentially has you because now you're emotionally invested. don't do it anons. >>67579

Sorry, if I wrote the wrong way, I just can write a floor forum s

>>85977 Nibba, this is a terrible place to find a girlfriend. If you are active on there for more than a few hours, you will probably end up having teenagers try to ERP with you. Multiple times, I got an unsolicited friend request from a public server, and after 5 minutes of normal conversation, the person started trying to talk dirty and ask me about sex. After I called them out for their behavior not being appropriate with strangers on the internet, they wrote a long apology about how they were lonely and then I made them feel bad because they just wanted to have lewd chats and goon. Keep in mind, this person started off by saying they were a minor. I'm somehow not surprised at how many groomers there are on there. Meanwhile, here I am just trying to have autistic conversations about obscure cyberpunk anime and soykaf, not some homo-furry sexting.

There is too many messenger threads across tech and sec where discussion is spread across three or four threads on the same subjects. >>87667 It doesn't matter what other people are into.

>>67628 >a non-negligible number of users in these sites think non-white people are inferior What makes you think otherwise?

>>67595 Have you ever thought that people willingly don't reply to your topics because they find your input to be uninteresting?

>>68140 that's not an IRC problem. that's an internet problem.

anon, you're clearly in the wrong haunts. I'm in the rust community discord and people talk about programming and actually all the time there. You just need to branch out and maybe join a community for your specific programming language.

>>68118 why not switch to XMPP Instead?

I tried to create a discord account. It forced me to check 20 time that I am not a robot with a captcha robots can pass. It asked me about my email. I had to do borderline necromancy to revive one of my old email address I use for that stuff. And then it forced me to link a phone to the account. I tried all the free burners I know and then I realized I had worked for them for almost an entire hour, still fruitlessly and I now had to pay for a burner or to make them hold me by the balls. I don't know what they do with the datas of their users and at this point I don't even want to know. I know enough.

>>87870 And just like that I also learnt they are going to ask for a real ID. All the western countries create the same law, requiring every mean of communication to ask for a real ID, all of them at the exact same time. What a coincidence.

>>67582 I'm in discord channels for a podcast I like as well as a geopolitical analysis youtube channel. both have high quality discussions. of course there's still bickering and insults from time to time, but the same thing happens anywhere else.

>>68125 >arcane to configure I can make an irc client in a few lines of code in just about any language I would care to use. >>68140 >i mean isnt that how sabu was compromised? I figure you're being actively chased by powerful idividuals, jou just pretend you're clueless.

>>67579 Doesn't really run on win 7. Used some webapp but wrote my email wrong which took the name I wanted so I said fuarrrk it.

>>67579 >>67580 It's literally Reddit-chat. The amount of noise is insane. To say nothing of the vast quantities of private data being gobbled.

>>68140 There are some chans that come with cheap but good enough chat systems. A barebone chat system shouldn't need much and would carry within itself very little ways to compromise its users.

The platform might be soykaf but you can find hidden gems on it, and I believe that's true of the entire Internet in its current form -- hell this should be clear to anyone frequenting imageboards such as this one Most of the public servers are soykaf, moderated by manchildren if not literal pedos and populated by an array of edgelords, attention whores and all sorts of lolcows, but occasionally you might come across some smaller, mildly funny or interesting community created by a youtuber or meme page admin or whatever, maybe you vibe with some of the people there and stay. It's rare and kinda only happens if you're a terminally online loser to begin so I can understand why it's offputting for mostly anyone over the ripe age of 15 I started using it to chat in a small private server with friends during covid, over time found a bunch of other communities and nowadays I really only chat in two or three servers out of my list, I voluntarily mod a STEM server with >100k people and while it's a sisyphean task that makes me want to kms at times I think we manage to maintain a decent space and community, with clearly delimited serious channels and more chill brewing soykaf channels (that's another thing with big Discord servers, often you'll find you vibe more with the culture of some specific channel or thread and stay there). We also manage to avoid much of the drama that is so common in other servers and especially other large mod teams, the latter largely due to us being older, not having arbitrary hierarchies (we're all essentially on equal grounds with the server owner and each other) and overall just expecting common sense from each other All in all it's not too different from say, imageboard culture where the huge normal person ones are generally crap but there's other options that are more chill, one ends up vibing more with boards and threads that fill a specific niche, etc. In a way Discord is simply how instant messaging culture (in a broad sense) has survived in our current day, in a mega-corporate enshittified form of course, but hell what isn't nowadays.

>>67579 I would NOT say it's "great for socializing." There are people who use it as such, and freaks they may be, everyone needs their people and if that's what makes them happy.. talking to the same people everyday sharing memes and reacting with Twitch emotes to each others comments, anime profile pictures, different colored names, server rules and moderators, whatever. It's a social life built upon smoke mirrors and lies but it's relatively harmless. The platform itself is however a necessary evil to at the very least have a throwaway account for, to access the things that are limited to servers hosted there, especially because of its present popularity, as in many people already have it and thus makes some communities quite productive or bustling with activity. The culture of it, and concept of Nitro, and other things like the inability disable showing people what servers you share with them. I detest all of that, but so long as I don't engage in any long private DMs about my personal life it's relatively harmless to me. Some communities or creators, specific niche games, tend to push information or files via such servers and it's very useful other otherwise unobtainable. For example, mods for the game Assetto Corsa, where they'll have a Discord server which the map and carpack downloads and install instructions are all listed and organized. Mechanical keyboard servers for groupbuying limited run keycap sets, buying or selling keyboards or parts, and so on. I'm in the Discord server for this one Chinese guy that makes custom HHKB and Realforce shells in polycarbonite and other materials, quality stuff, and he has a channel on that server where he sells discounted ones because of some minor defect. And because of the nature of it being a Discord where other people can talk and post reviews, it serves to legitimize it to some extent. It also allowed me to speak directly to the guy himself throughout the process and get some additional stuff in my order, or get a lower price. I also found people that make artisan keycaps and things like that, or buying secondhand tech stuff directly from people. With the added benefit if you were facing a problem related to a game, or looking for specific information about something you can search the history of the sever to read other people's discussions or troubleshooting of such things, etc. So as a lurker, it's very convenient. Another example, I like playing the game Melty Blood Actress Again online against other players, and thanks to a Discord server I'm able to easily get matches for it when otherwise it'd be impossible. There's a number of older niche games that similarly benefit from the platform. Playing Magic The Gathering EDH games through Tabletop Simulator, a popular Discord server is where most setup a game/lobby and use it as voice chat for the game. There ARE other options, that I would personally prefer. But that's not the nature of things, so I'll use some of these already existing places because that's where the people, information, or resources I seek are presently organized. But the important thing is just don't use it for your day to day personal conversations with friends, especially over long periods of time, or do. Doesn't matter in the end frankly. I draw the line at paying them money.

>>88026 >often you'll find you vibe more with the culture of some specific channel or thread and stay there reminds me of the OpenAI discord. they had like 30 channels and the ones at the very very bottom that only someone who scrolled and navigated through the list would find. these were the technical discussion, api discussion channels. this is where the smart people discussed how to use and make tools. so this is where 5% of the people hung out, and this is the only channel where i would not-troll. every other channel was full of the lowest IQ people you would expect, you'd see them typing into discord thinking it was chatGPT, etc.

>>88027 >to at the very least have a throw away account for Hard to have simple throw away accounts on discord when they're demanding that you put a phone number in.